15 replies to this topic

[Iron Buccaneer]

The Inner Sphere certainly has a number of really good scout mech builds for either Protect or Gather missions. In the hands of a reasonable skilled pilot the IS probably has an edge in Scouting missions in fact.

If only experienced, veteran, and elite players dropped I would put my money on the IS every time.

The problem is that lots of new players and special snowflakes are going to drop on both sides. When those type of players drop the advantage is strongly in favor of the clans.

The IS trial mechs are absolutely awful while all the clan trial mechs are at least useful in some role. The storm crow and cheetah are very nice mechs for scouting.

So here is what happens:

Clan Trial Newbs vs IS Trial Newbs = Clan Victory almost every time.

Clan Newbs vs IS Newbs = Streak boats give clan Victory every time.

Clan regulars vs IS regulars = probably about a 60/40 Clan advantage.

Clan vets vs IS vets = probably a 50/50

Clan elite vs IS elite = probably about a 60/40 IS advantage based on DPS and durability.

So you can see on the larger scale why the IS struggles at scouting.

[MovinTarget]

I would agree that at lower.... tier(?) play, clans have an edge, but IS has an edge in selection, speed, and brawling at higher levels of play. The learning curve is steeper, but Streak crow is always just a streak crow...

[Memnon Valerius Thrax]

i agree with that

[NocturnalBeast]

I will not pull percentages out of my backside, but I will reply. The main problem is that most Clan players played Streak or SRM Stormcrows, Hunchback IICs, or SPL Nova Primes, all of these are high-alpha builds. Clan players also stuck together in a deathball most of the time, while IS players were more likely to split up and search for caps. To counter the Clan deathball, IS needs to bring SRM Mediums (also high alpha and durable), and stick together, but many times I saw too many IS players choosing low-alpha, high DPS builds that require too much face-time to be effective in the fast-paced, close-range brawls that most scouting missions devolve into.

My takeaway from the event is that there were more experienced players on the Clan side, whether they were PUGs or groups, because most top-tier merc units went Clan. PGI can fix the merc imbalance by limiting the number of merc units that any one faction can hire at a time, but most top units only want to be on the side that is winning by overwhelming numbers and these are the players that PGI seems to listen to the most.

[TooDumbToQuit]

One thing that helped is that a large amount of Intel points were not given a nice prize like last time. Not sure who made the call to change it but they need a pat on the back. All everyone was doing was collecting data points.

I think it is funny to read about how Clan scouts stuck together etc. The sheer amount of time on almost every mission explaining to them to come together and fight as one started to wear on me. We also have to deal with players dropping light Mechs.

The Clan has had the plus of being on defense most of the time. Defending data is not rocket surgery.

I've faced top tier IS Units and new players. Scouting is doing the "dirty work" and I wonder if some people simply do nt want to do it.

Edited by LikeUntoGod, 05 July 2016 - 02:06 PM.

[NocturnalBeast]

LikeUntoGod, on 05 July 2016 - 02:06 PM, said:

One thing that helped is that a large amount of Intel points were not given a nice prize like last time. Not sure who made the call to change it but they need a pat on the back. All everyone was doing was collecting data points.

I think it is funny to read about how Clan scouts stuck together etc. The sheer amount of time on almost every mission explaining to them to come together and fight as one started to wear on me. We also have to deal with players dropping light Mechs.

The Clan has had the plus of being on defense most of the time. Defending data is not rocket surgery.

I've faced top tier IS Units and new players. Scouting is doing the "dirty work" and I wonder if some people simply do nt want to do it.

I lead both IS and Clan scout Lance's during the event and I agree that regardless of what side you played on, having 4 high-alpha mediums and sticking together was the way to go.

[Ultra-Laser]

LikeUntoGod, on 05 July 2016 - 02:06 PM, said:

One thing that helped is that a large amount of Intel points were not given a nice prize like last time. Not sure who made the call to change it but they need a pat on the back. All everyone was doing was collecting data points.

I think it is funny to read about how Clan scouts stuck together etc. The sheer amount of time on almost every mission explaining to them to come together and fight as one started to wear on me. We also have to deal with players dropping light Mechs.

The Clan has had the plus of being on defense most of the time. Defending data is not rocket surgery.

I've faced top tier IS Units and new players. Scouting is doing the "dirty work" and I wonder if some people simply do nt want to do it.

Given how apparent different skill levels are in scouting I think it might be more effective to try and have 4-man premade rack up those scouting bonuses so that they can give the PUGs enough bonuses on their own planets in the earlier part of the attack phase then shifting to 12-man premades to attack while PUGs hold down the fort.

Of course, I haven't put a lot of detailed thought into this. I would however love to hear someone more in the know explain the finer points of how it would or would not be a smart move.

[A Shoddy Rental Mech]

Maybe if they'd fix this

IS SRM 270m.....Clan SRM 270m
IS streak 270m.....Clan streak 360m

it'd also fix scouting

[S 0 L E N Y A]

The Nerf Bat, on 22 September 2016 - 12:12 AM, said:

Maybe if they'd fix this

IS SRM 270m.....Clan SRM 270m
IS streak 270m.....Clan streak 360m

it'd also fix scouting

That isnt really the problem.

Its the fact that streaks tubes can be boated by Clans and IS cant.

This makes taking an IS light that isnt a sniper a very very large risk if scouting against clans.

That said, I am believer of "dont get mad, get even."
Enter the Griffin 2N.

Rookie Clan pilots fear the Griffin and complain about it as much as IS rookies fear Streak Crows.

Edited by Boogie138, 27 September 2016 - 12:43 PM.

[Appogee]

I play Scouting matches as both factions... Generally I will take a splat Griffin as IS, and a Storm Crow with Streaks/SRMs/SPLs when I'm playing Clan.

Frankly, playing as a Clanner is just straight-up easier.

I think it's partly due to the Clan Mechs being better, and partly that the IS seems to have more noobs.

[DaemonWulfe]

To me it seems the noobs are evenly spread across IS and Clan, especially after having done a week as Wolf. I can't really see a difference in how the average Clan or IS puggie acts. It's pretty much the same deal. Lots of LRMs and "support" mechs, lots of dudes running out, not torso twisting and generally getting iced within the first few seconds of a push or waffling back and forth behind the line waiting to die. The early ones always try to reinforce and end up losing another mech, so on and so forth.

[Kheg VanHellSink]

DaemonWulfe, on 27 September 2016 - 04:16 PM, said:

To me it seems the noobs are evenly spread across IS and Clan, especially after having done a week as Wolf. I can't really see a difference in how the average Clan or IS puggie acts. It's pretty much the same deal. Lots of LRMs and "support" mechs, lots of dudes running out, not torso twisting and generally getting iced within the first few seconds of a push or waffling back and forth behind the line waiting to die. The early ones always try to reinforce and end up losing another mech, so on and so forth.

that is bang on. if IS noobs doped the LRMs for faction play they might win a few again. or perhaps if they listened to the vets of the game but most of them refuse to do anything of the like and wonder why they can't win and call cheating... for what ever reson the clan noobs listen better . lol

[MovinTarget]

Kheg VanHellSink, on 17 December 2016 - 09:14 AM, said:

that is bang on. if IS noobs doped the LRMs for faction play they might win a few again. or perhaps if they listened to the vets of the game but most of them refuse to do anything of the like and wonder why they can't win and call cheating... for what ever reson the clan noobs listen better . lol

No one side is better, its just easier to ignore the whines, or the whines are fewer when that side wins more consistently.

[Notron]

From my experience and apart from the mechs pro players (other too ) go most of the time wherever they win (there are exceptions) and gain incentives more reliable / faster. Hence if clan is stonger (by mechs or people or both) people go there to take the advantage. IS looses in return more often so further IS units take into account switching also to clan and so on.

1. If you balance all factions lets say by mechs and limit their access to just some specific balanced mechs the spread accross the factions would be more even. That doesn't work that well for clan but for IS it would have some effect. If you motivate people to play their most liked mechs they would probably consider switching.

2. Probably I'm wrong here but you get nothing for sticking to your faction in a role play sense. So why should I play for an always loosing faction? And why would someone join this faction (rational matters)? If you motivate people playing for the faction they like the most and it is worth it they would probably switch.

3. Improving voice chat to a degree that everybody can use it without struggeling to get it consitently running would also help random groups (like often IS) to coordinate better (they are still scattered forces but don't loose all the time that dramatically). This would include a test mode to check settings / proper function before jumping into a match.

Currently, with these few people playing faction wars clan has the advantage by players much more than by mechs (especially as there are better organized, skilled or just by pure active numbers).

Edited by Notron, 19 December 2016 - 04:38 AM.

[JaegerDjinn]

Ed Steele, on 05 July 2016 - 01:32 PM, said:

I will not pull percentages out of my backside, but I will reply. The main problem is that most Clan players played Streak or SRM Stormcrows, Hunchback IICs, or SPL Nova Primes, all of these are high-alpha builds. Clan players also stuck together in a deathball most of the time, while IS players were more likely to split up and search for caps. To counter the Clan deathball, IS needs to bring SRM Mediums (also high alpha and durable), and stick together, but many times I saw too many IS players choosing low-alpha, high DPS builds that require too much face-time to be effective in the fast-paced, close-range brawls that most scouting missions devolve into.

My takeaway from the event is that there were more experienced players on the Clan side, whether they were PUGs or groups, because most top-tier merc units went Clan. PGI can fix the merc imbalance by limiting the number of merc units that any one faction can hire at a time, but most top units only want to be on the side that is winning by overwhelming numbers and these are the players that PGI seems to listen to the most.

Not true, I will bring my Enforcer 5p with dueling altras and tear the streak crows apart. The one and only time i ran scouting with some Isen players in thier griffons we ran 6 matches and won 5 of them. It is all about the players in scouting.

[NocturnalBeast]

Basically, whichever side has the most SRMs and can focus fire best wins.