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Tectonic Activity


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#1 Nightshade24

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Posted 19 July 2016 - 03:38 PM


Quote:
"Terra Therma is a planet sized moon in a large synchronize orbit around Epistellar Jovian Planet... It is constantly exposed to tidal forces from its parent planet and therefore prone to frequent volcanic eruptions and persistent tectonic activity..."

Analysis:
In this video first showing off the brand new map Terra Therma. It's description mentions how it has extreme tidal forces causing tectonic activity. Which is to those that do not know clearly what tectonic activities are, they are earthquakes, volcanoes, and process of forming mountains.

Description and Proposal:
My proposal is due to the upcoming introduction of 'Knock Backs" being reintroduced. I wanted to propose an idea how this can tie into the maps we have. Firstly Terra Therma...
I believe we should have earthquakes and aftershocks happen every few minutes with respective sound effects, it'll shake the cockpits of 'Mechs in this time and will make it harder to keep your target on the enemy both visually and your corsair jumping around if like you are jumpjetting.

Scaling:
Another note is that if you are a lighter mech say bellow 60 tonnes (the lighter you get from 100 the more and more susceptible you are) the more likely it is for your 'Mech to fall over and get knocked down into the ashes of Terra Therma (or into the lava if you are unlucky.). Light 'mechs are the most susceptible to these active tectonic events.

The third point is that is that there is a flat out higher chance for all 'Mechs to fall over upon collision or death from above.

Way to counter the effects:
A way to reduce these effects and chances is to move slower as slower movement puts less stress on your Gyro and it'll allow you to have a more stable footing. Allowing slow 'Mechs to be nearly unaffected while faster 'Mechs may need to heavily reduce their speed.

Advance Gyro will allow you to have better accuracy overall in these events as well as being more sturdier and unable to as easily get knocked back.

Ways to aggravate the effects:
'Mechs that are legged will need to be stationary or move much slower to prevent the 'Mech from falling over. Accuracy will be hindered noticeably even when stationary.


This is my proposal for the future of Terra Therma and allow the environment to effect the 'Mech and the MechWarrior in more ways then just with visuals such as night arriving or blizzards/ fog/ sand storms. I do hope more maps in the future will start to impact the mech ranging from Ice and unstable/ slipper surfaces to sluggish movement through molten lava or water. Or reduced speeds in heavy mud.

Edited by Nightshade24, 01 August 2016 - 09:51 PM.


#2 pyrocomp

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Posted 01 August 2016 - 04:25 AM

View PostNightshade24, on 19 July 2016 - 03:38 PM, said:

(no idea how to spell this word, and no it isn't interstellar) epperstellar Jovian Planet...

Posted Image
Epistellar Jovians are exoplanets, similar in mass to Jupiter, with remarkably small, circular orbits around their host stars and orbital periods of less than 10 days. They are also referred to as "hot Jupiters" or 51-Pegasi-type planets.

Edited by pyrocomp, 01 August 2016 - 04:25 AM.


#3 Nightshade24

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Posted 01 August 2016 - 09:48 PM

View Postpyrocomp, on 01 August 2016 - 04:25 AM, said:

Posted Image
Epistellar Jovians are exoplanets, similar in mass to Jupiter, with remarkably small, circular orbits around their host stars and orbital periods of less than 10 days. They are also referred to as "hot Jupiters" or 51-Pegasi-type planets.

Gotcha, I tried googling it but it didn't help. Thanks.

Will edit it into the OP.

#4 Koniving

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Posted 02 August 2016 - 07:27 AM

I like the idea but we won't see awesome things like knockdowns.

Wanna buy a mech pack?

Short of knockdowns, the crippling blow to lights would be harsh. Alternatively, the lower your current speed versus max speed is, the more stable you can be during the earthquake.

Having the middle ring risk either breaking and possibly falling or leaning at a 50 degree incline would do amazing wonders to the game.

Alternatively, fill with lava oozing out.

Either of those two also give back to the lights which will have an easier time recovering from the event. They can still climb that incline better than almost any mech. They can also outrun the lava a lot better than those poor hundred tonners. Heck it would even be a great day to be 80 tons there!


#5 pyrocomp

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Posted 02 August 2016 - 08:25 AM

View PostKoniving, on 02 August 2016 - 07:27 AM, said:

Wanna buy a mech pack?

You repeat this so often that I honestly begin to suspect you being on a PGI marketing department payroll. =)

On the other thins. Moving objects are more stable on unstable ground. If the said earthquake is to tumble anything, those would be more probably stationary heavy mechs, not lights. So things will be fair more or less.

Edited by pyrocomp, 02 August 2016 - 08:28 AM.


#6 Koniving

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Posted 02 August 2016 - 09:09 AM

View Postpyrocomp, on 02 August 2016 - 08:25 AM, said:

You repeat this so often that I honestly begin to suspect you being on a PGI marketing department payroll. =)

On the other thins. Moving objects are more stable on unstable ground. If the said earthquake is to tumble anything, those would be more probably stationary heavy mechs, not lights. So things will be fair more or less.


First or second time saying it but it is all over the forums now. Churning mechs every month but no real improvements to show for it.

The stable in unstable does make bit of sense in the conservation of momentum and related laws, as the reduced contact with the surface helps to reduce the transference of momentum from the tectonic shifts while the machine's own momentum will help in resisting change being forced upon it.

So in either case lights have advantages here. Whether running from lava, dealing with the shakes and in the instance of steep inclines from a partially fallen platform.

This, I hypothesize, helps to balance the advantage heavier mechs would have in torrential winds and sandstorms like Tourmaline is supposed to have.

#7 pyrocomp

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Posted 02 August 2016 - 11:59 AM

View PostKoniving, on 02 August 2016 - 09:09 AM, said:

This, I hypothesize, helps to balance the advantage heavier mechs would have in torrential winds and sandstorms like Tourmaline is supposed to have.

Well, in those circumstances lights still will have even bigger advantage as having lower profile closer to the ground making them less a sail. But more will depend on geometry where chcken walkers have advantage over humanoid form. Anyway, it's not so obvious, but in-game both option may be viable without much stretch of 'common sense'. Sure, we are not taking cases of tornado vortex, but just strong wind.
But, anyway, we will never get those things on Toumaline, Alpine or Polar. More to say, currently water does not slow mechs down, but should really be a trap for lights slowing them to 30-40 kmph.

#8 Nightshade24

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Posted 04 August 2016 - 11:08 PM

View PostKoniving, on 02 August 2016 - 07:27 AM, said:

I like the idea but we won't see awesome things like knockdowns.

Wanna buy a mech pack?

Short of knockdowns, the crippling blow to lights would be harsh. Alternatively, the lower your current speed versus max speed is, the more stable you can be during the earthquake.

Having the middle ring risk either breaking and possibly falling or leaning at a 50 degree incline would do amazing wonders to the game.

Alternatively, fill with lava oozing out.

Either of those two also give back to the lights which will have an easier time recovering from the event. They can still climb that incline better than almost any mech. They can also outrun the lava a lot better than those poor hundred tonners. Heck it would even be a great day to be 80 tons there!

Well I am pretty sure Russ said himself Knock Downs are coming back soon. He also said that if knock downs goes well that things like Death From Above and Quad 'mechs will possibly make an appearance in the game. (he specifically mentioned Quad mechs when talking about knock downs, we can assume that he plans that a major advantage of a quad mech would be that it can't fall over. It's a cool advantage to have and it's fair)

Also I wanna buy more 'Mech packs but my only payment method was Karma Koin so yea... I can't get those typical credit card thinger magigers either (or was it eftpos? I forgot) as they require you to have a steady income to use it. Being an artist and photographer and other stuff that isn't quite stable. (Looking into video game designing however as an indie and stuff due to my great ability of making cool 'pixel' / retro art for FTL and Hyperspace Admiral mods but that's enough of my income problems)
I really really wanted to get the linebacker... but it's for the best, I'll save up money until I can buy stuff in MW: O again and hopefully that'll be the first quad mechs, IS omni's, or a few years later we might see some MW4 classics...
Ofc.... I know that was just a sarcastic comment and NOT a honest question. But I legitimately wanted to buy a mechpack.

Also the whole middle being a risk is one thing I wanted, much like how 1 of those bridges fall down. I want to see the remaining 3 to collapse as well as the normal platforms being damaged. Maybe a small gap appearing that only JJ mechs can easily cross but not non-JJ mechs which will just fall into the lava.

View Postpyrocomp, on 02 August 2016 - 08:25 AM, said:

On the other thins. Moving objects are more stable on unstable ground. If the said earthquake is to tumble anything, those would be more probably stationary heavy mechs, not lights. So things will be fair more or less.


This was based on our knowledge of humanoid bipedal locomotion. Personally in Christchurch I was going for a 500m sprint training (back when I was healthy and didn't have 5 surgeries preventing me from exercising ) during the 2nd major Earthquake. It was only shaking and I was running on the grass but it was enough for me to shake me off my footing and for me to sort of stumble (I rarely trip up, rather it be untied shoelaces, missed a step, or someone tried to trip me up). However others around me rather immediately stopped or fell over who were doing the sprints, the people standing and walking at the time had no stability problems.
The other thing I based my knowledge on is our current bipedal robots out there, which most of them hate it when the platform bellow them starts shaking. However we can assume Battletech movement is more refined.. but TT/ MW4 and Online however doesn't make it seem it's that perfect... (cough cough can't get up steps effortlessly)

you spoke about momentum and stuff and minimal contact with the ground and that is true. However the problem with that is as soon as you slipped or missed the footing your momentum from helping you is now forcing you to keep moving when you can't really effectively move.

EDIT: also wasn't there TT rules that meant that you should slow down in a faster mech for certain terrain otherwise bad things happen?

Edited by Nightshade24, 04 August 2016 - 11:10 PM.


#9 Koniving

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Posted 05 August 2016 - 01:47 AM

We all want to get the mech packs. And really? I'll be honest with the attitude Russ has had since he came back from vacation (as if he somehow came back worse than he left), I flat out stopped listening to the discussions. Since they always outsource the really good people in the coding department and don't keep them around long enough to make meaningful changes, plus the years that have gone by I gave up on it. But knockdowns making a comeback would be nice. Now if they would stop tweaking weapons so it stops screwing with quirks (and use quirks to encourage use of those few or gimped Hardpoint like the head launchers on the CTF4X and Grasshoppers, I'd be a bit happier.

Now Quads... it'd be interesting. I'm guessing that Harebrained offered to help PGI with coding.

View PostNightshade24, on 04 August 2016 - 11:08 PM, said:

EDIT: also wasn't there TT rules that meant that you should slow down in a faster mech for certain terrain otherwise bad things happen?


All mechs have to slow down to Cruise speeds to do steep turns and a sharp turn is all but impossible. Thing is since it goes by "full speed, cruise speed, and 'well you need to cut just enough movement points to make that U-Turn"... it affects mechs based on their movement points. If you are 3/5 like a Dire Wolf it might take 10-20 seconds and cutting to whatever 1-2 hexes are to make a forward moving U-Turn. If you're as fast as a Jenner stock (6/9) you only have to cut to 64.8 kph to make steep turns without the risk of slipping or tumbling like a football thrown by a kid who was throwing it like a dagger..at the ground...to see how many times it could cartwheel.

Now it isn't based on weight class as I had a 15 ton mech in light rain crossing a parking lot at 43.whstever (4 hexes) and used my last movement point to make a 90 degree turn. I slipped, fell, skid for 90 meters which in the process tore my arm off and broke a searchlight, then I slammed into a Starbucks (actually identified as "brandname coffee shop, light single story structure") at the last 30 meters, fell threw the first floor into the basement. And all of this in the span of 10 seconds. Thankfully It's (of Patlabor fame) is a tough guy so he didn't lose consciousness. By some miracle I managed to get out without further damage to continue my navigation course within the next 10. Only to cause a civilian car wreck involving 5 cars in the 10 after that.

(Yay Megamek and the civilian hack job I did. The civilian cars, and pedestrians all had to be custom made unarmed units with Princess (,the AI bots) set to be cowardly and to run away, with particular patrol routes and about thirty bots to populate the map without bot crashes. For fun later on I gave some "civilians" very minor weapons, pistols basically and I made one allied to some civilians and another allied to some other civilians on the other side of the map to instigate a turf war. Ever seen a bunch of cowardly gangsters fight in Battletech? It is hilarious! Then march in with a police mech to clean up and watch them run and disperse!)

Edit:. Boo Android and the Google keyboard. It sucks having large fingers.

Edited by Koniving, 05 August 2016 - 01:59 AM.


#10 pyrocomp

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Posted 05 August 2016 - 08:54 AM

View PostNightshade24, on 04 August 2016 - 11:08 PM, said:

This was based on our knowledge of humanoid bipedal locomotion. Personally in Christchurch I was going for a 500m sprint training (back when I was healthy and didn't have 5 surgeries preventing me from exercising ) during the 2nd major Earthquake. It was only shaking and I was running on the grass but it was enough for me to shake me off my footing and for me to sort of stumble (I rarely trip up, rather it be untied shoelaces, missed a step, or someone tried to trip me up). However others around me rather immediately stopped or fell over who were doing the sprints, the people standing and walking at the time had no stability problems.
The other thing I based my knowledge on is our current bipedal robots out there, which most of them hate it when the platform bellow them starts shaking. However we can assume Battletech movement is more refined.. but TT/ MW4 and Online however doesn't make it seem it's that perfect... (cough cough can't get up steps effortlessly)

you spoke about momentum and stuff and minimal contact with the ground and that is true. However the problem with that is as soon as you slipped or missed the footing your momentum from helping you is now forcing you to keep moving when you can't really effectively move.

EDIT: also wasn't there TT rules that meant that you should slow down in a faster mech for certain terrain otherwise bad things happen?

Keyword - scale. Or amplitude and frequency to be precise. Yours is an example of not so small amplitude regardin your height and step length or step 'clearance' which can be small. Average human easily can rebalance himself via quick step. Not so sure about assault Mechs that sometimes need a few seconds to make first step.
So if not to shake a platform under yours example robot but to vibrate it, will that robot notice it?
Anyhow, this all is quite arbitrary in estimations. And as was said above any scenario might be implemented without much stretch over logic.

#11 Nightshade24

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Posted 06 August 2016 - 06:30 AM

View PostKoniving, on 05 August 2016 - 01:47 AM, said:

We all want to get the mech packs. And really? I'll be honest with the attitude Russ has had since he came back from vacation (as if he somehow came back worse than he left), I flat out stopped listening to the discussions. Since they always outsource the really good people in the coding department and don't keep them around long enough to make meaningful changes, plus the years that have gone by I gave up on it. But knockdowns making a comeback would be nice. Now if they would stop tweaking weapons so it stops screwing with quirks (and use quirks to encourage use of those few or gimped Hardpoint like the head launchers on the CTF4X and Grasshoppers, I'd be a bit happier.

Now Quads... it'd be interesting. I'm guessing that Harebrained offered to help PGI with coding.
-snip-


I may not be a dev but I am a mod-dev. I may not have thousands of people watching my every move (or ignoring my every move) but I do look at those that are objectively and try to understand the problems that go with them.

TBH Russ is under the situation where what he wants in MW: O is not quite practical. Many decisions he has to do to make his dreams come true is economic/ game developer night mare...

Objectively if you look at the game it's fantastic. The balance relative to other games are great. You can use any 'Mech in MW: O and do well in it, and consistently if you put your mind to it. Using a large array of weapons. Many games out there have characters / vehicles/ weapons that are literally useless that even if the MM works in your favour you will still struggle.

Russ may not be the biggest in Extrovert.
PGI may not have the most community managers/ helpers that we regularly get forum feedback from PGI on matters.
It is annoying to think none of our suggestions ever get in especially when hundreds of people ask the same question in the Town Hall meetings every time.
Some of us may hold a grudge because IGP didn't want CW and PGI couldn't add it sooner or better.
Maybe it is because we do not agree with the balancing or what ever.

But PGI and Russ do go through a lot of work and many things are being done in MW: O rather on the side burner or being internally tested ranging from avalanches, further destructible enviroments, etc...
Then you have Russ hinting that Melee may be a thing in MW: O, he never confirmed it but when the kodiak is out and most people were like "Such a shame we will never will have melee" and his response is on the lines of "never say never".

I would personally like to see the grasshopper/ Cataphract to get quirked for there tiny hardpoints but I do have a strong distaste of quirks in the 40%+ region.

If the game itself is fine at the momment (relative to many other games out there) then I am fine to wait for a later date for a "yes/no" that's certain for each upcoming change and such. If there is no knock backs back or quads or what have you then that's fine. The game is still fun and still holds up against other games.





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