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I Know I Don't Usually Say Much


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#1 BlueSanta

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Posted 21 September 2016 - 09:56 AM

I remember back when FP first started how frustrated we Davions were with the Mariks and especially units like The Seraphim who would gen rush with lights. Back then there was only the one generator on the rear of the gun and it was uncovered. Whole matches would be over in minutes and involved little fighting. It was not the kind of experience we wanted from a MechWarrior game and in a game mode that we had waited years to play.

Now we are the ones who have become known for playing in this manner and I am struggling to understand how we got here. I believe it is because we became obsessed with tagging planets, even though that act still means little to nothing. Hell, it has gotten to the point that most days we cannot even seriously threaten the attack planet.

If we gen rush on almost every attack then we spend half our time learning how to become better gen rushers than fighters; we become half as good in a fight as we could be. We also earn a certain reputation that precedes us and it's not the same one that we have about 420, 228, KCom, etc. I do not like that.

It seems like we have an inferiority complex. That we believe that we cannot always win a toe to toe fight, so instead we must find other ways to succeed, and to make ourselves okay with that thought we tell ourselves things like we are just playing the game mode and that they are sore losers. Yes, we have definitely come across sore losers and **** talkers, but the sentiment of their remarks is usually not surprising based on our actions.

Sometimes there are also still orders to try and tag a planet, which always translates to gen rushing. Why does tagging a planet still matter to anyone in this current iteration of FP? Why do we instead not focus on becoming better pilots so that maybe when the time comes that tagging a planet does matter that we have respect for our ability and skill to put pilots and mechs out of action instead of being gen rushers?

I hope that I did not offend any of my fellow Davion loyalists with my remarks but this topic has been on my mind a lot recently and I wanted to finally type it out in a proper fashion before shooting my mouth off over TeamSpeak due to frustration over play style. I would like for this to be something that we can have a dialogue about. Thank you for reading.

#2 MovinTarget

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Posted 21 September 2016 - 10:47 AM

View PostBlueSanta, on 21 September 2016 - 09:56 AM, said:

I remember back when FP first started how frustrated we Davions were with the Mariks and especially units like The Seraphim who would gen rush with lights. Back then there was only the one generator on the rear of the gun and it was uncovered. Whole matches would be over in minutes and involved little fighting. It was not the kind of experience we wanted from a MechWarrior game and in a game mode that we had waited years to play.

Now we are the ones who have become known for playing in this manner and I am struggling to understand how we got here. I believe it is because we became obsessed with tagging planets, even though that act still means little to nothing. Hell, it has gotten to the point that most days we cannot even seriously threaten the attack planet.

If we gen rush on almost every attack then we spend half our time learning how to become better gen rushers than fighters; we become half as good in a fight as we could be. We also earn a certain reputation that precedes us and it's not the same one that we have about 420, 228, KCom, etc. I do not like that.

It seems like we have an inferiority complex. That we believe that we cannot always win a toe to toe fight, so instead we must find other ways to succeed, and to make ourselves okay with that thought we tell ourselves things like we are just playing the game mode and that they are sore losers. Yes, we have definitely come across sore losers and **** talkers, but the sentiment of their remarks is usually not surprising based on our actions.

Sometimes there are also still orders to try and tag a planet, which always translates to gen rushing. Why does tagging a planet still matter to anyone in this current iteration of FP? Why do we instead not focus on becoming better pilots so that maybe when the time comes that tagging a planet does matter that we have respect for our ability and skill to put pilots and mechs out of action instead of being gen rushers?

I hope that I did not offend any of my fellow Davion loyalists with my remarks but this topic has been on my mind a lot recently and I wanted to finally type it out in a proper fashion before shooting my mouth off over TeamSpeak due to frustration over play style. I would like for this to be something that we can have a dialogue about. Thank you for reading.



I think for many, tagging a planet is the closest we can get to having tangible proof of *success*.

And yes, gen rushing is often used by teams or groups of players (there's a difference) as the logical course when "There's no way we can beat these guys".

Its a shame, because as you pointed out, it ain't fun for at least twelve of the players in the match, perhaps more.

I appreciate the fact that you want to air this out. I know not all Davion players like to/want to gen rush, ever and its hard to convince the others that they can win otherwise.

All I can say is seek out the Davions that *don't* want to gen rush and try to group up on drops so that you are all on the same page. Once you show 'em you *can* win w/o rushing... and you get *PAID* when you win through attrition, others may jump on board.

#3 Lizardman from Hollywood

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Posted 21 September 2016 - 10:48 AM

Just look at how the tourney has devolved into examining the .xml files to determine the exact best place to fight from that will give you every advantage while taking away as many as possible from your opponent. It's not fun to watch and it makes all the players of other games just lol at us and our grand attempt at a professional tourney.

I say look at it because once fp becomes worthwhile to the comp heads then that's what it's gonna turn into, shuffling .xml files to see how far they can bend exploits to win games.

#4 EvAbsence

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Posted 24 September 2016 - 11:15 AM

For my part, I can agree that gen rushing is something that very few people really enjoy. I personally gain absolutely no joy in a gen rush, and just about as few CBills. It is the same mindset as those that rush bases on Assault, and retort their enemy's disdain with comments like 'Should have read the objectives', and the like.

One thing I'll add though is that I have a fundamental issue with treating that as a victory anyway. If we are speaking in RP terms, a successful objective rush tends to leave your team at a distinct armor and k/d ratio disadvantage, should you play out the match as you would in a real role playing situation. Should the match be played out in full you and all of your company-mates would most likely die. If I had a hand in the development of the game, an objective rush should award you with a percentage of the available credits as a full win as determined by the number of pilots remaining, because the cost to your unit is substantial. Be prepared to repair and refit, and find new pilots. Even better, objective rush away, but the match will still go until you all die or you defeat all of the enemy. At least then the enemy team (or yours if you are good enough to recover) will have the opportunity to get some CBills out of it.

Thankfully I've not run into it enough to call it a frequent frustration, but I do agree that focusing on improving combat skill AND honing the coordination required to pull off a successful gen rush is very important.

A well done gen rush is a fun thing: When I say well done I mean when you have remained close on kills and have positioned yourself to secure the win whenever you want. The remaining waves can be used to fight it out for the fun of it while still securing a victory.

Edited by EvAbsence, 24 September 2016 - 11:16 AM.


#5 Tahawus

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Posted 24 September 2016 - 12:05 PM

In general, I agree. Gen. rushing is a negative consequence of the way the objectives are set up, and should be avoided to increase the benefit to all. The incentives for gen. rushing are reinforced by the structure of the cease fires, where it can be beneficial to rotate through matches as rapidly as possible to secure a planet. I notice this in particular as a West Coast NA player who's primary gaming time is immediately before the end of the phase.

I also need to point out that MANY of the accusations of generator rushing that I've seen have been thrown in the third and fourth waves of mechs. If we're knocking omega out in the first or second wave, then that's, IMHO, gen rushing. Third wave is maybe a grey zone, but fourth (and frequently to secure a win when the kills are close), no. Accusations of gen. rushing at that point are a failure on the accuser's part.

#6 Ironically Ironclad Irony

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Posted 24 September 2016 - 01:23 PM

Yeah when i think gen rush i think first wave... as, in you are even giving combat a chance. Second wave is not nearly as fishy, and to me third/fourth waves are fair game for objectives. Thats just me though and i for one would be in favor of there being kill component to the objective, like minimum 20-24 defenders killed (to weaken planetary defenses). That brings a little closer in line to the recapture/hold territory theme where you *have* to engage.

#7 Javin

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Posted 27 September 2016 - 08:29 PM

Now that taking a planet is an impossibility with low loyalist numbers, most of us play to kill now. I think the lack of a chance to take planets killed gen rushing.





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