11 replies to this topic

[Blue Pheonix]

Should I equip machine guns on the Pirates Bane locust?

My feelings of machine guns in MWO are kinda.... meh.

In my experience with running them, they don't really do much even with exposed/non armored parts. I understandably don't expect them to do as much damage as even a small laser but when I ran the locust in testing grounds and exposed a few parts on a few mechs so that section/part was orange (exposed) and then I laid on that exposed part for long time with machine gun fire, it was.... underwhelming. The exposed part would have come down faster had I fired just one regular medium or small laser. Machine guns (especially only two) and its ammo seem like a waste of tonnage.

I must admit that I do not often run mechs with machine guns so I have little experience with them.

The locust has only 2 machine gun slots. Maybe MG are only reasonably effective run in larger groups/bigger mechs. Should I use the slots for machine guns or just stick with a bigger engine as speed is the lifeblood of any mech?

Edited by Blue Pheonix, 05 December 2016 - 05:22 PM.

[Bud Crue]

December road map states that there is some performance changes coming to both IS and clan machine guns so maybe they will suddenly be worthwhile (I doubt it but we won't know until at least the patch notes). In the meantime imho mgs on a locust a are a waste of space. To make em fit you eiher have to drop armor, engine or your energy weapons and losing any of those things in that mech is not a good idea...again just my opinion.

[Leone]

So, When I first met the quad machine gun Blackhawk (Nova) I was piloting one myself, albeit without the machine guns. Now, you'd think, if the machineguns were so inferior, I'd've won, or maybe, just maybe, the other play was better'n me. (Completely possible.) Thing was, I did lose, and they trying it myself, I did wreck so much face.

Now, yes, less machine guns means less awesomeness, so sometimes you hafta ask, is it worthwhile? The answer, of course, depends. The reason to take machineguns on the pirates bane is because there's no room for anything else. And yeah, they do help, but they're just there to assist the lasers whilst your stripping the legs on slow assault or something.

~Leone

[Jingseng]

2 mgs are edging towards the not worth the effort range. 3+ for results really (and even 3 is kinda meh). But then, what else are you going to do with the tonnage and space =p Certainly not fitting any autocannons on there. For a light, which isn't going to focus (generally) on jaw dropping firepower and alphas, having a heatless, short range back-up/boost is nice for keeping your overall dps going.

[SnagaDance]

Machineguns should be only taken at 4 or more IMO and even then you shouldn't think of them as a true damage dealer, they are an equipment wrecker.

For instance, I've got the 12 ERSL 4MG Nova Leone mentions and it is a great face wrecker. Target open sections with equipment in them and let fly. Sure, killing a mech is the best way to eliminate its threat, but another one is disarming it. If a mech no longer has (a singificant amount of) weapons with which it can hurt you or your team mates then you are already ahead.

Used cleverly in addition to a mech's other (far more heat generating) weapons they offer a nice little tool to help neutralise enemy mechs, even when you're at your heat limit.
Now I might not have cause to use them every battle but I can't tell you how satisfying it is to open up a Hunchback 4P's right torso and then opening up with your machine guns and see the Medium Lasers on his info-doll winking out one by one while I get down from the top of the heat curve in the meantime.

[The Basilisk]

There are Situations where MGs have a notable effect...as support weapons on mixed loadouts.
"Mixed loadouts" is normaly already a thing where all to many ppl raise their brows to scoff and turn around....well in a competitive environment thats well deserved but in QP where you encounter random maps and ppl, mixed loadout mechs actually do work pretty well.
Especially on lights that already don't realy realy need to torsotwist but rather distribute dmg by speed and curse alterations.
Additionally MGs simply do heatfree dps. 0.8dps for a single one most mechs will carry 2+ and have +20-40% ROF.
With MGs this translates directly into dps.
So: (2*0.8)*1.2=1.92dps for 2 MGs weighting 1T for the MGs and 1T ammo.(LCT-1V f.e.)
A single med laser will do 1.23dps without quirks and fired at max rate.
A SPL will do 1.45dps. Both without ammo but considderable heat.
Seeing MGs as cheap and heatneutral addon weapon for close range light mechs IS valid bt may not be the best choice in environments where you need specialized loadouts.

Edited by The Basilisk, 06 December 2016 - 05:32 AM.

[jper4]

like others have said i'd say 4+ MGs is where they become "useful-ish",

I do have a couple lights with 2 or 3 but those are more of the "i'm not touching you" annoyance of hearing them rattle off the enemy mech variety in the hopes he gets mad enough to turn towards you so someone with real weapons can get a shot at it's rear armor when it does.

and even those mechs are in the "well my heat efficiency is fine so no need for another DHS, engine's at max, and I have a couple tons not doing anything and no more energy/missile slots so I guess some MGs." category. other time i'll use less than 4 is if all my weapons on the mech are say on one arm and I want something to do when the arm is gone.

ams is probably a better use for those 1-2 tons though given how many LRMs are still out there.

[jss78]

My favourite use of MG's is on 'mechs that meet two basic conditions:

1. Their other weaponry is also such that you tend to go close anyway. So you're not packing dead weight while fighting from mid-to-long range.

2. The have sufficient mobility that you can often work your way to rear arcs, so you can get the time to safely work with the MG's.

I've never really built a 'mech around machine guns, but on such 'mechs, if you happen to have some ballistic hardpoints, why not. Some zero-heat DPS boost.

[r0sshk]

I run one MG and a halfton of ammo on the peanutbutter. Why? Because it does more than a single heatsink would be doing for the 4SPLs and what else am I gonna do with the tonnage? I'd like to run two, but then I'd have to strip considerable armor and that's not gonna happen, Buster.

My advice: go for legs on missile boats and watch them blow up thanks to ammo explosions.

[G4LV4TR0N]

Clan MG's are only 0.25t each, at such tonnage they are great.

[Moses Lanknau]

how about micro lasers? the real thing on machine guns are thier ammunition, especially without CASE.

[Jay Leon Hart]

I'll echo the "4 or more" rule of thumb.

Light / Medium 'mechs with 4+ Ballistic hard points, and whether I have / would run MGs on them;

LCT-1V - 4B - I haven't, I love my LPL too much, but pair them with a MPL and sure, why not
SDR-5K - 4B - Just add a LL/ERLL/LPL, I see the first 2 often enough
UM-R60 - 4B - If you must
FS9-E (EMBER) - 4B - You may as well!
RVN-H (HUGINN) - 4B - I love mine, open them with SRMS, wreck their equipment with MGs

CDA-3C - 4B - Add a PPC... profit!
BJ-A (ARROW) - 6B - Add 1-3 LPL to taste, then open those cans for the tasty treat inside!
ENF-5P - 4B - NO! Don't do it... try UAC5s instead


Viper (C Torsos) - 4B - Add 4-6 SPL/ML and harass those backsides
Shadowcat (P Left Torso, P Left Arm) - 6 B - Add 1-2 LPL, treat like an improved Arrow
HBK-IIC - 4B - NO! nonononononono. NO!
Huntsman - (various pods, up to 5B) - You can, but you shouldn't...
Nova (S Torsos, B Left Torso, BREAKER Right Torso) - 4B - Add 6 MPL / 12 SL / 6-8 SPL / 6-8 ML, and have all the fun!

[Edit] To actually answer your question, I wouldn't bother with MGs on the Pirates Bane
Try these (slightly altered) common builds
4 SPL - my personal choice
4 ML - hotter, better damage and range [/Edit]

Edited by Jay Leon Hart, 06 December 2016 - 01:56 PM.