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I Don't Think Mwo Is Going To Be An Esport After All


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#61 Lyoto Machida

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 01:45 PM

View PostNovakaine, on 09 December 2016 - 10:34 AM, said:

Seems like somebody turned the MWO bus this way.
Posted Image

On a side note I watched the whole event.
And although it good to put faces to some of the names I know.
It was a definite snooze fest.
Player interviews at the bare minimum would have filled up the dead air time.
Great fights comp boys, but that was a snooze-snipe fest also.
No flair no panache.
Next year bring some lurms if anything for the visual impact.
And PGi can we get some random radio chatter from the teams.
I've saw more excitement from my kids dodge ball tourneys back in the day.
Oh and get a dance floor that would have been funny as hell to see.
Come on PGI stop the bus and take the next exit get off this highway to mediocrity.


Dance floor lol...I'd rather them put up a boxing ring and have people 1v1 in a real life "Solaris" environment. Now THAT would be entertaining...considering the demographic of people we're talking about here.

#62 Novakaine

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 03:38 PM

View PostLyoto Machida, on 09 December 2016 - 01:45 PM, said:

Dance floor lol...I'd rather them put up a boxing ring and have people 1v1 in a real life "Solaris" environment. Now THAT would be entertaining...considering the demographic of people we're talking about here.


You're right your idea is much better.
Considering the demographics.
Oooopty did we just use some code wordsPosted Image

#63 naterist

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 03:55 PM

next mechcon, they gotta give the mwowc's access to a vahalla room that you can only get into if your invited by one of the champs. free beer in valhalla room, or something like that, would be epic, would be lore, and make the finalists have a bigger reason then money to win (free beer), just the finals would have to take place earlier in the day so the finalists can enjoy their prizes.have it at like 3, so last years finalists can enjoy it for a bit, tthen graciously turn over their spots if they lose. would give last years champs a handicap too, free beer and all. just sayin, it works on a lot of levels.

#64 JediPanther

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 05:00 PM

mwo is about an esport as pac man. If pgi ever want to get to capcom pro tour levels it'll take about three more license renewals of mwo or 12 years.

#65 Ted Wayz

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 05:49 PM

Russ wants a tournament, Russ gets a tournament. Never mind no one really asked for one.

Russ wants to be able to tell his developer buddies MWO is an eSport. Given there is no minimum bar Russ can tell his developer buddies MWO is an eSport.

Crap tournament? No problem, Russ got what he wanted out of it.

Why is it Russ under delivers what we want and over delivers on what we don't want?

Keep funding what Russ wants if you care.

#66 Quxudica

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 06:01 PM

View PostTristan Winter, on 09 December 2016 - 10:51 AM, said:

[...] Then we can start building up the hunger for MWO2, which I hope is coming at some point. [...]


I'd rather it not, so another dev can get a crack at it sometime in the future. PGI had their shot, and unless MW5 is gods balls amazing, I'm not particularly inclined to give them a second.

#67 Ano

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 06:14 PM

View PostPeter2k, on 09 December 2016 - 02:42 AM, said:

You know there is a full article on the final matches

EON vs EmP right?

The strategies MechWarrior Online's best team used to become world champions


Thanks for linking this.

View PostBud Crue, on 09 December 2016 - 04:22 AM, said:

Case in point, the article from PCGamer cited above. It ought to be plastered all over this place, and then all over every gaming blog/vlog they can find. The CM ought to be sending emails to every community member who has such a blog/vlog, every member with a unit page, etc. asking nicely if they would post that article, as well as the recently published interview that Russ gave just before mechcon, etc.


It is *bizarre* that they don't make more of this. I mean that sort of coverage ought to be in the image rotation on the homepage but at the very least, you make a news post saying "Check out this fascinating article about the MWOWC from PC Gamer".

View PostAppogee, on 09 December 2016 - 04:32 AM, said:

Posting an article about the finals on the web page would require effort. Interviewing the players and posting bios would require effort. Post-match media engagement would require effort. PGI doesn't do "effort".

That sounds cynical, but it's true. It pervades their whole approach to developing, patching, road maps, balance changes, server issues. It's all slow, it's most often reactive, and if it happens in the evening or on the weekend ... well it can just wait til Monday morning.

After Mech Con, I think they all went home and caught up on all the naps they missed during the week leading up to the event. Or gave themselves a week off. Either way, it's just one squandered opportunity after another. As a passionate Mechwarrior and hugely-invested customer, it just breaks my heart. (edited for space)


Every year I manage the AV for at least one internal corporate event for the company I'm a full-time employee of where I spend 9-12 days onsite in a fancy hotel. For those 9-12 days I typically start work between 4am and 6am, and finish anywhere between 8pm (during the early setup days) to 1am (during the event proper).

The day *after* the event finishes, before I head off I package up the final versions of the presentation materials and the audio recordings of the sessions and send them to our corporate team for transcription and minuting; I collate any video shot of the events, make backups and fedex them home, and send a handful of thank-you notes to the meeting team. I normally do this in the restaurant or bar, with food and a drink or two. That's just admin for an internal meeting but I still do it before I go exploring or catch a flight home.

Unless the day was a total disaster (and as far as I can tell, despite some of the misses on the presentation front, the matches were good, people had fun and MWO got some press attention for the first time in ages) it's crazy to think that the day after the "flagship public event" the team wasn't spending at least the morning posting photos, 1min promo vids cut from the stream footage/event recordings and each and every positive news mention to *every* outlet at their disposal -- facebook, twitter and yes, their own damn website.

View PostAppogee, on 09 December 2016 - 06:10 AM, said:

The thing is: there are a LOT of mature people playing this game, who DO have the experience and knowledge to help and guide PGI in matters where they are clearly out of the depth. But they can't even be bothered hearing our advice. We're here in the forums sharing one good idea after another, but they never visit.


To be fair, you know what the forums are like. Sifting through the vitriol, the unworkable ideas and the one-note-flutes is a huge amount of work to *possibly* mine a gem of an idea. Equally, just because someone says they're experienced in X discipline and can give them advice, whether X is event management, community relations or whatever doesn't mean their experience is relevant in context (or even validly claimed), and it doesn't mean that advice wouldn't be at least a little self-serving.

View PostBig Tin Man, on 09 December 2016 - 12:33 PM, said:

Two people from my unit went to the event, and they said it was actually pretty well organized, catering and drinks were on par (the tickets weren't that expensive, so adjust your expectations). It seems like PGI had the IRL side of the event handled, they just didn't have a team to take care of internet.

(edited -- this next bit is re: the stream)
Could it have been better done with more events specifically designed for the stream, i.e. dev and team interviews, Q&A from twitch, Paul avoiding every question and camera, etc? Definitely.


It's a *huge* amount of work to make a live event *broadcast* interesting. HUGE. We have the expectation that "TV content" is a continuous feed of interesting items, and live events aren't. If you're attending, in between stuff-that-happens you're getting drinks and food, looking at merch, looking at stands, chatting with friends, making new friends, planning dinner etc. You have to fill all of that dead time on a stream with multiple hosts, interviews, content content content. And that's just for a couple of hours.

While they could have done more for sure, I must say I think PGI were always up against it re: the stream. If they hadn't done a stream, people would have complained mightily, but to produce a live event stream at the sort of level we'd like, for the full duration of the stream, would probably have cost more than combined budget for every other aspect of the event combined.

EDIT: and if they'd spent that money, we'd be splitting our time between complaining about how terrible the host was (bad jokes, didn't know the game etc etc) and wondering why they blew so much money on the stream when it could have been spent on (maps/engine upgrade/ponies)

Edited by Ano, 09 December 2016 - 06:23 PM.


#68 Tristan Winter

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Posted 10 December 2016 - 12:24 AM

View PostQuxudica, on 09 December 2016 - 06:01 PM, said:


I'd rather it not, so another dev can get a crack at it sometime in the future. PGI had their shot, and unless MW5 is gods balls amazing, I'm not particularly inclined to give them a second.

I'm terrified at who might pick it up next. It could so easily be dumbed down and turned into MechAssault.

Did you see what happened to Heavy Gear Assault? It looks like Robot Quake Arena! <shudder>

Better the devil you kow... (and I wouldn't go so far as to call PGI the devil, obviously)

#69 Anjian

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Posted 10 December 2016 - 09:08 AM

Some points.

1. Playing from China to the MWO servers in what appears to be now in somewhere in mid US (used to be in Toronto), could probably result in at least 300ms ping likely 400ms, due to having many router points even if using a VPN. This would be unplayable and MWO has enough issues with syncs and hit registration at over 200ms.

2. When game companies do business in China, you have to think big and local.

a. Set up with a local partner.
b. Local partner sets up the servers.
c. Local partner has the autonomy to set up their own events, such as those in Chinese holidays. They will have the autonomy to set up the pricing of premium items. Profits will be divided between you and them.
d. You create a special China version of your game to meet the rules and regulations, as well as for the taste of the audience. The advice and recommendations of your Chinese partner will come most helpful here.

This system has been very successful with games ranging from the World of Warcraft to World of Tanks. Very successful indeed, that even if the Warcraft movie bombed in the US and worldwide, it was a stunning success in China due to the players over there. Lots of them.

Edited by Anjian, 10 December 2016 - 09:09 AM.


#70 Anjian

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Posted 10 December 2016 - 09:19 AM

View PostTristan Winter, on 10 December 2016 - 12:24 AM, said:

I'm terrified at who might pick it up next. It could so easily be dumbed down and turned into MechAssault.

Did you see what happened to Heavy Gear Assault? It looks like Robot Quake Arena! <shudder>

Better the devil you kow... (and I wouldn't go so far as to call PGI the devil, obviously)



Robot quake describes HGA's lore and spiritual ancestor, Heavy Gear II, and that game had a strong devoted community, which I remember fondly. Heck HG2 was the first ever multiplayer game, and the memories of which I remember fondly, like those I headshot with my bazooka while jumping from the air. Even in HGA, former HG2 players are asking if you remember who and who from the HG2 online community for reunions. I also remember the waves of Japanese players that hit the game online when the time zone moves to their side at night, and then later as the day cycle continues, they fade away as the American players come in on their time zone, then when the Americans go to bed the cycle goes to Japan again and so on.

Robot quake is not bad play model. But people expect legged tanks when they think Mechwarrior.

A more streamlined game can be viable --- as War Robots has shown --- but the lore is specifically made for that, and you can't copy that any longer. Mechwarrior will have to be distinctive.

World of Tanks is the big elephant that influences every vehicular PvP F2P game out there including MWO. Anyone who picks up MWO will still end up following the footsteps that WoT has made, and may end up like WoT with legs with CS:GO as the other influence. There might be Overwatch and MOBA influences too.

Lately I heard that CCP Games, makers of EVE Online, might be up for sale. It would be interesting to see who picks them up. This might be a trend for smaller independent one game companies including PGI, to get bought up by the biggies like Tencent (bought up Riot Games, makers of League of Legends), My.com (Obsidian Entertainment, makes of Armored Warfare, and Pixonic, makers of War Robots), even Wargaming.net who picked up and is reviving Master of Orion.

The most immediate change I can think of is probably the implementation of a Tier tree.

Edited by Anjian, 10 December 2016 - 09:36 AM.






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