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Clan Weight To 245


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#1 Natural Predator

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Posted 17 January 2017 - 09:36 AM

I believe clan weight should be moved up to 245 tons. That would be 3 65 tonners and a 50 tonner. When it comes down to equal IS skilled groups vs Clan Skilled groups Shadow cats vs Griffins or worse Thunderbolts is a pretty unfair advantage they have. The reason I advocate for this change is several
Clans have multiple options in the 50 ton weight range and 65 ton weight range. This gives us more flexibility in decks. For those that wish to bring an assault like a marauder 2c it gives them a bit of forgiveness in their decks. It makes it possible to have a fighting chance in wave 4. Right now if your not up by at least 4 to 6 mech kills going into the last wave your in deep **** versus a similar skilled opponent.

Edited by Ragnar Baron Leiningen, 17 January 2017 - 09:42 AM.


#2 Hanky Spam

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 04:42 AM

Yep I agree
IS would then still have per drop deck 20 tons more available.

#3 Vxheous

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 05:16 AM

245 Tons would also bring back the Kodiak/Ebon Jaguar (or Hellbringer)/Hunchback IIc/Arctic Cheetah deck, which a full 12 Kodiak on 1st wave can pretty much chew through 1 1/2 waves + of IS mechs. A better solution would be to drop IS deck to 260 (or less)

Edited by Vxheous Kerensky, 18 January 2017 - 05:17 AM.


#4 MovinTarget

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 05:25 AM

View PostVxheous Kerensky, on 18 January 2017 - 05:16 AM, said:

245 Tons would also bring back the Kodiak/Ebon Jaguar (or Hellbringer)/Hunchback IIc/Arctic Cheetah deck, which a full 12 Kodiak on 1st wave can pretty much chew through 1 1/2 waves + of IS mechs. A better solution would be to drop IS deck to 260 (or less)


Kodiaks ain't what they used to be... if its a 12 man...12 kodiaks, 12 timbers, prolly similar result...

#5 Natural Predator

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 06:38 AM

View PostVxheous Kerensky, on 18 January 2017 - 05:16 AM, said:

245 Tons would also bring back the Kodiak/Ebon Jaguar (or Hellbringer)/Hunchback IIc/Arctic Cheetah deck, which a full 12 Kodiak on 1st wave can pretty much chew through 1 1/2 waves + of IS mechs. A better solution would be to drop IS deck to 260 (or less)


Kodiaks are not nearly as good as the used to be. They have been nerfed pretty much into the ground. Also any organized team will just concentrate fire on a Kodiak anyways. No your more likely to see Mad2c before kodiaks. I personally wont run any assaults until we move back to 250.

#6 Lily from animove

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 06:41 AM

and then? when the big organised mercs flip, balance flips, cosntantly changign tonnage does nothing it only changes balance in the noob vs noob encounters.

#7 MovinTarget

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 06:48 AM

View PostLily from animove, on 18 January 2017 - 06:41 AM, said:

and then? when the big organised mercs flip, balance flips, cosntantly changign tonnage does nothing it only changes balance in the noob vs noob encounters.


The solution is to simply have tonnage less for Mercs, regardless of sides... I may be a merc, but you gotta give the loyalist something...

#8 Stormie

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 08:25 AM

Anecdotally, from my experience on both sides since the tonnage change, The more organised team is winning. The tech side of it appears pretty balanced with the tonnage differential we have. If it were like you say we'd have cases where the less organised/skilled team was beating the more organised team... I haven't seen that and Im playing a heck of a lot of FP.
You only have 1 extra option @50t than @45t (nova, hbkiic, huntsman v IFR, SHC)
Rather than getting on here and moaning get creative. 1st wave cheetah rush I bet you can trade 12 cheetahs (360 tonnes) for 700 tonnes of the enemies assaults, negating the whole matches tonnage difference in one wave.
Or split 3 45 tonners per wave in with 9 65tonners. (just quietly if you were going for a 45 tonner I'd be using ferrets not cats as they have structure buffs for days but that's up to your pilots)

#9 Natural Predator

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 10:21 AM

View PostStormie, on 18 January 2017 - 08:25 AM, said:

Anecdotally, from my experience on both sides since the tonnage change, The more organised team is winning. The tech side of it appears pretty balanced with the tonnage differential we have. If it were like you say we'd have cases where the less organised/skilled team was beating the more organised team... I haven't seen that and Im playing a heck of a lot of FP.
You only have 1 extra option @50t than @45t (nova, hbkiic, huntsman v IFR, SHC)
Rather than getting on here and moaning get creative. 1st wave cheetah rush I bet you can trade 12 cheetahs (360 tonnes) for 700 tonnes of the enemies assaults, negating the whole matches tonnage difference in one wave.
Or split 3 45 tonners per wave in with 9 65tonners. (just quietly if you were going for a 45 tonner I'd be using ferrets not cats as they have structure buffs for days but that's up to your pilots)


First of all I made the statement that two teams of Equal skill. You glossed over it. Nobody is moaning or complaining. The ability to handle a Griffin is significantly improved in a nova vs a shadow cat just based on the design of the mech. If you don't believe that then get out of my thread. The Ice Ferret is a garbage mech, easily the worst clan design. Secondly the weight scaling does not achieve balance. I dont need advice on how to play at all. I am advocating an increase in weight so I can play the many mechs I have acquired and achieve a more balanced deck. As you so aptly pointed out weight doesnt equate to the outcome of most matches but given two teams of equal skill it will make the difference if it comes down to a 12v12 wave 4

#10 Vlad Striker

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 11:24 AM

Well IS dropdeck can use only medium-heavy mechs and still can win 3:2. IS OP now for FP.

Quote

The Ice Ferret is a garbage mech, easily the worst clan design.

In right hands there is good mech.

#11 Natural Predator

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 11:31 AM

View PostVlad Striker, on 18 January 2017 - 11:24 AM, said:

Well IS dropdeck can use only medium-heavy mechs and still can win 3:2. IS OP now for FP.


In right hands there is good mech.

In the right hands any mech is good. But as a design its flawed heavily. The viper for instance is a superior design.

#12 f00lish1

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 11:43 AM

View PostRagnar Baron Leiningen, on 18 January 2017 - 11:31 AM, said:

In the right hands any mech is good. But as a design its flawed heavily. The viper for instance is a superior design.

Hard to say. The viper is pretty glass. They serve different purposes.

Edited by f00lish1, 18 January 2017 - 11:43 AM.


#13 RaptorCWS

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 11:51 AM

View Postf00lish1, on 18 January 2017 - 11:43 AM, said:

Hard to say. The viper is pretty glass. They serve different purposes.

the ice ferret purpose is to collect dust in a mechbay and make the buyer regret the purchase.

#14 Vxheous

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 03:08 PM

View PostRagnar Baron Leiningen, on 18 January 2017 - 06:38 AM, said:


Kodiaks are not nearly as good as the used to be. They have been nerfed pretty much into the ground. Also any organized team will just concentrate fire on a Kodiak anyways. No your more likely to see Mad2c before kodiaks. I personally wont run any assaults until we move back to 250.


You can already run the Mad Iic with 240T. 85/75/50/30 is a very viable deck

#15 Natural Predator

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 03:11 PM

View PostVxheous Kerensky, on 18 January 2017 - 03:08 PM, said:

You can already run the Mad Iic with 240T. 85/75/50/30 is a very viable deck


NO DOUBT BUT 3X65 + a 50 tonner would spread your weight better to match up against IS drops

#16 Vxheous

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 04:36 PM

View PostRagnar Baron Leiningen, on 18 January 2017 - 03:11 PM, said:


NO DOUBT BUT 3X65 + a 50 tonner would spread your weight better to match up against IS drops


3x65 +50 would have trouble with a 85/70/70/40 in the shape of Battlemaster 2c/ 2x warhammer/grasshopper /cicada.
The 85/75/50/30, or 75/65/50/50 would deal better with front loaded IS decks

#17 Stormie

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 05:50 PM

View PostRagnar Baron Leiningen, on 18 January 2017 - 11:31 AM, said:

In the right hands any mech is good. But as a design its flawed heavily. The viper for instance is a superior design.

Lolwut?
You can get a heat efficient 40point alpha on an IFR(can go bigger again if you want small pulse and Srms), which moves at 140, has the structure of a 65 tonner and offensive quirks that match the viper.
I know metamechs isn't everything but maybe theres a reason the IFR is mentioned as a tier 2 mid range mech and the viper is... Well not a tier 2 anything mech.

Maybe you could point out what you think os wrong with the ice ferret, or where you think the viper or shadowcar are so much better choices?

#18 Carl Vickers

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 06:33 PM

I quite like the Viper C, 5 er smalls and 4 machine guns. Works a treat on conquest when lights are capping.

Also works very well when you get into the back of a heavy or assault and those jump jets, they make you fly.

Edited by Carl Vickers, 18 January 2017 - 06:37 PM.


#19 naterist

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 06:54 PM

from what ive seen id say a clan mech is worth an IS mech that is ~5-10 pounds heavier, closer to 5 though. in that spirit 245 would be acceptable, as a large amount of highly skilled mercs have switched to liao recently. if those mercs switch back en masse, then bring it back down. however they REALLY need to get you clanners a 20 tonner for times like this.

in the mean time, stop bringing massive amounts of lurms, and avoid the myst lynx. i feel like the IS killS almost 24 myst lynx's a match and 24 mad-2c's a match, spread that tonnage out like the IS does.

do as OP says, some heavies and 1-2 mediums. everytime i see a group of myst lynx's brawling griffins (every night) it makes me cringe.

#20 Dr Decal

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 07:01 PM

View PostCarl Vickers, on 18 January 2017 - 06:33 PM, said:

I quite like the Viper C, 5 er smalls and 4 machine guns. Works a treat on conquest when lights are capping.

Also works very well when you get into the back of a heavy or assault and those jump jets, they make you fly.

Except its overinvested on jumpjets... it could have half as many jumpjets and see no noticeable difference in capabilities.
Also taking that viper up against 4x Hunchie 4SP, or Shadow Hawks or Griffins... not so much fun.
If my opinion means anything I'd say the Ice Ferret is the best scouting chassis that clans have. has the tankiness and firepower to compete with IS mediums, and the speed to chase down that one light that always runs away.





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