40 replies to this topic

[Exilyth]

Writing perfect AI is a relatively easy task, 'just' pathfinding on a navmesh, some steering behaviours and aiming is trivial (see base turrets - near pin point accuracy).

The hard task is making a believable AI which makes proper mistakes, like aiming a little off, pulling lasers across mechs, twisting to the wrong side, taking a bit of time to notice enemy mechs (depending on movement & distance), remembering a 'last seen' position and acting upon that instead of just using the players position (no omniscience), panicing when outnumbered or on low health, e.t.c....

All the little things which make a computer controlled enemy feel alive.

[Brain Cancer]

The worst part would be that anything PGI could program as AI opponents, someone else would inevitably program better for their own use.

Cue automated farming.

[ocular tb]

I really should start keeping a tally of how many of these threads appear on a weekly basis.

As for your troubles with teammates, I say just roll with it. If you're good enough you'll find a way to overcome a lot of the problems that playing with random strangers will present. You won't win them all, but you'll be able to win a majority of them if you're good enough. Keep in mind the other team has to deal with the same thing so I tend to think it evens out. Not sure how long you been playing prior to becoming a forum member, but stick with it and you'll get better. Good luck!

Edited by ocular tb, 29 August 2017 - 02:23 PM.

[Xmith]

McGoat, on 29 August 2017 - 09:12 AM, said:

lol - MW4 bots vastly outshine the PGI iteration of one (Escort Atlas), and all they did was run right at you with periodic stops/turns.
I'd say... Nope!

Bot 9 level AI were very very strong when you set up a server using your own builds. They were not easy to beat. Stock built AI were easy but not your own builds.

I would set up a BOT 9 team to play against using various builds I had. Tough to beat.

Edited by Xmith, 29 August 2017 - 02:28 PM.

[Admiral-Dan]

[Redacted]

Edited by draiocht, 30 August 2017 - 03:48 PM.
unconstructive

[Vellron2005]

PaznerWar, on 29 August 2017 - 08:55 AM, said:

Is there anyway to play with bots instead of other people and still earn XP and CB? I'm just done with the people that play this game. Almost no-one understands basic stagey and it's like 9 losses to 1 win at times, if not worse. For example the team in my most recent match went right to the lowest part on the Frozen City map.... What moron would do that??? The other team saw this and took flanking positions in the outlining city ruins and quickly dispatched my team. In my opinion, Bots are probably more intelligent and would give better game play then dealing with unskilled players. Yes... This is a serious question.

Considering the VIP as the example of PGI's ability to create "bots".. yeah.. probably not a good idea..

Although, I've been saying it for years that BOTS should fill the ques if there are no players for FP, or when a disco doesn't reconnect..

[Lily from animove]

Well I brought a buddy here, he plays games, but isn't really a gamer. And Ohhh, did I see the abyss of skill.

[MrMadguy]

It's just terrible/non-existent matchmaker. My today's team was so noobish, that they didn't even know, how to play on Canyon Network (they were simply hiding behind center rock, allowing enemies to come closer and openly attack them from multiple directions), while enemy team was 100% skilled and coordinated. So... Biggest question. Why couldn't MM just shuffle two teams a little bit to make them 50/50 skilled? And second biggest question. Why I always end up in noobish team, not skilled one??? The sole fact, that I'm in Tier 3 - means nothing! This rating is overestimated, cuz "matches played = skill" XP bar design - is nonsense. I can't carry Tier 4-5 teams, just can't! I belong to Tier 4 myself!

[The Unstoppable Puggernaut]

I've love to see AI bots available to shoot. Via a mechlab with a battle simulator (to test what configs work). But again this game isn't as sophisticated a 20 year old Mechwarrior game that could do all the + more (feature wise).

[Tarogato]

git gud and you'll win more.






Even though you only theoretically comprise 4% influence over the outcome of a match (because you're only one in twenty-four players), you can "carry" more than your own weight. Do the right things as an individual, and you'll start winning more consistently in solo queue. Don't expect teamwork. It's nice if you get some, but you're setting yourself up for disappointment if you come in expecting people to work together. It's solo queue, so do your own thing, and do it well. Then you'll be rewarded.

The golden rule I abide by for solo queue is "deal damage to the enemy from the beginning of the match until the end." Which means if you aren't shooting the enemy, then you're doing something wrong. If you die, then you can't shoot the enemy anymore, so you did something wrong.


The other day I had a 13-win streak with zero losses. Tomorrow I could have a 9-loss streak with no wins. Don't get caught up in the wins and losses - ultimately you can only influence the outcome of a match, not decide it.

[Lykaon]

PaznerWar, on 29 August 2017 - 08:55 AM, said:

Is there anyway to play with bots instead of other people and still earn XP and CB? I'm just done with the people that play this game. Almost no-one understands basic stagey and it's like 9 losses to 1 win at times, if not worse. For example the team in my most recent match went right to the lowest part on the Frozen City map.... What moron would do that??? The other team saw this and took flanking positions in the outlining city ruins and quickly dispatched my team. In my opinion, Bots are probably more intelligent and would give better game play then dealing with unskilled players. Yes... This is a serious question.

Your profile list you as active starting at August 12th this year. If that is any indication of your likely tier (guessing 5 due to your complaint of losing so often)

Just take it easy you are literally playing in the lowest tier with the least experienced/skilled players. So yes they will do mind numbingly stupid things like walk single file into a kill box.

My recommendation is to adjust your play style to accomidate the craptastic strategic ability of the typical tier 5er.

Build a mech to take advantage of mistakes the players make in lower tiers. Like a fast hard hitting striker to take down poorly possitioned enemy mechs to far from help to survive a well planned ambush.

Or...

LRMs are absolute murder in tier 5 (just don't expect the old trick to keep working as your tier advances) I find that a quick moving LRM carrier will rocket you out of derp town pretty much as fast as you can.

ECM is a magic miracle box in tier 5. Try and ECM equiped LRM carrier for some suprisingly easy tier advancement. Again don't get used to this trick it's easily handled by experienced players.

Also get a microphone and use the in game voice chat. Organized teams win a heck of a lot more than 12 randoms doing their own thing on the same map.

Call the match for your your team but be patient. When you see a herd of nubs wondering towards certain doom tell them it's a bad choice and briefly why.

ie. Stay out of the low ground the enemy team can easily fire down into us from there. Instead do "XYZ"

[MW Waldorf Statler]

Nema Nabojiv, on 29 August 2017 - 10:52 AM, said:

It wont do any good. Armored Warfare had PVE missions, and eventually people stopped playing PVP because everyone like winning and winning is easier in pve. And then player numbers went down because pve is boring and unchallenging.

better for PGI as play other Games with good Coop Missions and PvE like Star Conflict or War Thunder and forget the stupid MWO Arenashooter and in the Moment we have only a Turret AI ! the VIP Atlas is only a Follow Route A-B-or C -Roll-a-Dice-AI

Play with 3 Bot Members in MW4 is in many Way more Fun, as with 11 members in a PUG game ...Still standing atlas Pilots thats not hit a stillstanding target in 200m or firing LRM Wave after wave in a Cover 100m in Sight or ignored the red Lights thats say ...Fire from the Back while not Donats of the minimap ...by the Way ...what is a Minimap

Edited by Old MW4 Ranger, 30 August 2017 - 02:10 AM.

[Skipmagnet]

Smites, on 29 August 2017 - 09:07 AM, said:

Judging by the AI of Escort? I sincerely doubt that one could or even should be awarded for defeating any number of bot-controlled mechs. Plus it breaks TT lore.

AI are canon in table-top BattleTech, both in the form of the Caspar drone systems developed for planetary defense during the late Star League (later rebuilt to devastating effect by the Word of Blake), and the subsequent iteration by the CCAF on Nostromo that resulted in The Broken.

Know your lore before popping off about what is or is not breaking it.

[Brizna]

Luminis, on 29 August 2017 - 09:07 AM, said:

[Redacted]

A redacted post! Have my like sir!

[Jingseng]

Anything nice I could say would get redacted by the mods, so I'm not going to make work for them.

I will note that I would actually be interested in watching 12bots v 12bots just to see what happens.

I'd also like to be able to regularly watch the various devs and management play the game (with, against each other, other players, etc., whatever).

But yeah, I know. =p

Exilyth, on 29 August 2017 - 12:47 PM, said:

Writing perfect AI is a relatively easy task, 'just' pathfinding on a navmesh, some steering behaviours and aiming is trivial (see base turrets - near pin point accuracy).

The hard task is making a believable AI which makes proper mistakes, like aiming a little off, pulling lasers across mechs, twisting to the wrong side, taking a bit of time to notice enemy mechs (depending on movement & distance), remembering a 'last seen' position and acting upon that instead of just using the players position (no omniscience), panicing when outnumbered or on low health, e.t.c....

All the little things which make a computer controlled enemy feel alive.

Would you like to play a game of chess?

[TWIAFU]

Tralik, on 29 August 2017 - 12:32 PM, said:

Find a good unit to drop with. Solo queue is the potato fields. Actually, it is more like organizing a group of 3 year olds with ADHD in a room full of shiny objects to focus on a common goal. Having a group to drop with who will try to work together goes a long ways towards enjoyment in this game.

Yep, stay out of QP. With the potential of 8v8, REALLY stay away.

[draiocht]

[mod]As the original question has been answered and
this topic is leading to tangential or unconstructive discussion,
this thread has been moved to Kaetetôã.

Constructive discussion on strategy and tactics
may be moved to threads relevant to those topics.[/mod]

[Mechwarrior4670152]

Welcome to K-Town folks.

Semi-hemi-demi on topic.

Was finally convinced to play Heroes of the Storm the other day

(not much of one for those MOBA games)

Had an AI Muradin (melee hero) on our team

Spent half the match pacing back and forth inside our base.

Rather doubt PGI would be able to offer better than the "Great and glorious" Blizzard

But there is always hope

[MechWarrior380523]

I agree; bots WOULD be easier to deal with...

[Bespoke Cheese Cake]

Today I did the poops