8 replies to this topic

[Jonathan8883]

Rather than spamming up the forum, I decided to consolidate this into a portmanteau topic. I've been playing for 3-4 months, so I guess that still makes me new. There are several questions scattered throughout this post. Answer as you will.

Here's what I have now, and how each is configured:
[spoiler=Spoilered for Length]
In Actual Use
Arctic Cheetah, ECM variant
4 HMLs, 1 machine gun/0.5 tons ammo
It scouts, but mostly it backstabs. If the player I target is oblivious, I can open even an assault mech's rear in 1-2 salvos. My best match was a River City loss (ran out of time) where I racked up over 1,000 damage, 4+ kills, and also kept a Kodiak and one other mech distracted for 3 minutes. This is probably my favorite mech because it's so effective. I only get 2-3 alphas out before overheating. Typical match damage probably 200-400 unless I run afoul of enemy lights or an alert medium and simply get splattered before hitting 100 damage. Just finished a Domination loss with 700 damage inflicted.

Marauder IIC-D (ECM variant) - I just got this one
2x UAC20 (alternating fire to avoid ghost heat), 2 SSRM4 for lights & extra punch, 1 large pulse laser for some ranged damage, LAMS.
Unless I screw up my positioning, 500-800 damage per match. As long as I measure my AC20 fire, it takes a long time to overheat. I have 6 tons of ammo and don't run out unless it's a long match.

Hellbringer (ECM variant)
2 large pulse lasers, 3 HMLs, LAMS. I try to reserve the HMLs for sure shots, as using them drives my heat way up.

Mad Dog
2x LRM15, 4x LRM5 (different weapon groups), large pulse laser, machine gun
LRM boat, high mobility, good damage.

On the Shelf
Spyder (ECM variant)
Anything it can do, the Arctic Cheetah can do better. 2 ER MLas, 1 flamer (tried various configs, the flamer can help in close combat)

Kit Fox (ECM variant)
AMS, LAMS, HML. I've tried various missile combos and am not happy with this mech. I may buy a ballistic omnipod at some point.

Blackjack
2 ER LLas, 2 SSRM4
Fun-ish sniper, but overheats too quickly to be very good.

Hunchback
UAC 20, MLas, 2 flamers
The flamers seemed more useful than extra lasers in close combat. Mech doesn't seem very durable despite its reputation.

Marauder
My first real mech. 2 ER PPC, 1 LBX10, nothing else. Reasonably successful in T5, but far too prone to overheating.

Highlander 732B
Supposedly tanky, but I have never figured out a great config for this mech. I finally got it to be combat-viable by eliminating the 6 tons of jump jets. I really don't see a point in a non-JJ Highlander.
[/spoiler]

Aside from the Kit Fox, I bought all my IS mechs first. Once I got my first non-KF clan mech, I started buying exclusively Clan. Clantech is a night-and-day difference as far as mobility and firepower goes. The mechs feel better.

So - why should I ever buy another sluggish IS mech? They have a few techs that Clan doesn't have (RAC, MRM), but they are all so slow and under-gunned! I have not experienced the supposed cooler-running performance, and armor matters less than dead enemies. I like the idea of running IS mechs, but aside from perhaps a RAC-wielding rifleman harasser, I don't see a point. Convince me, please. This is probably my biggest question/issue.

I have learned to stay away from Faction Play due to the imbalanced teams... too many 12men pre-mades vs PUGS. It's not worth my 30 minutes unless there's an event, and even then I just spam Scouting.

Hero mechs - When are they likely to go on sale again? I may pick up one or two, perhaps the Shadow Cat one if the sale is soon. I need a good Clan medium, and the Hunchback IIC is not quite what I'm looking for. I am planning to build the Shadow Cat like a heavier, longer-ranged version of my arctic cheetah (backstab/harasser).

Killing lights - What's a high-maneuverability heavy light or light medium that can take down the locusts, arctic cheetahs, etc. of the world? I am assuming TAG + active probe + SSRM, a bank of quick-firing lasers or an AC (rotary?), jumpjets, and preferably ECM so that they don't see me coming. The Shadow Cat doesn't have enough weapon mounts. Huntsman? Maybe a Shadow Hawk or Wolverine if IS? Maneuverability is a big component of this.

Mech roles - I buy mostly for the roles, not for the aesthetics. Here's what I see as general roles:
Filled
Scout: Covered by Arctic Cheetah
Sneaky ninja Backstab: AC, and later a Shadow Cat
Light support: Kit Fox, if I can ever get it working; the loyalty urbie?
LRM boat: Mad Dog
Medium/heavy support: Hellbringer
Assault brawler: Marauder IIC
Not Filled
Sniper: Not filled. Not happy with Blackjack. Maybe another Shadow Cat? Rifleman?
Light brawler: Not filled. Should have a free Urbie soon for this.
Medium that kills lights & does other stuff: Not filled
Assault sniper: Not filled, not sure if needed.
Scouting mode mech for events: Not filled.
Fast in-your-face mech: Not filled. Timber Wolf?

Not sure what other roles I need. I'll take suggestions.

I greatly favor ECM mechs - if 25% of the enemy team forgets to shoot you because you're not on the radar - that's a lot of extra armor!

[Leone]

Jonathan8883, on 17 October 2017 - 06:08 PM, said:

So - why should I ever buy another sluggish IS mech? They have a few techs that Clan doesn't have (RAC, MRM), but they are all so slow and under-gunned! I have not experienced the supposed cooler-running performance, and armor matters less than dead enemies. I like the idea of running IS mechs, but aside from perhaps a RAC-wielding rifleman harasser, I don't see a point. Convince me, please. This is probably my biggest question/issue.

In this guide, I've a quick vid of what a well built IS assault can do in 50 seconds. (From 'bout 1:25 to 2:15)

I've also a showcase of an Atlas push in my CW Primer. Speaking of which, I think my best showcasing of IS tech versus clan tech would be the second post of that last thread. Two Units I consider to both be very good going up against each other doing their best to eek out every advantage they can get with their tech.

Also, as to your cooler running question, well, your IS mechs brough ErPpcs and Large Lasers to the party. They're not really the cool running options.

~Leone.

Edited by Leone, 17 October 2017 - 10:26 PM.

[Burning2nd]

not a bad start... But as that locust pilot i can tell you how and why your logic is flawed...

First off.. clan tech isnt that much better thats probably a personal preference more then anything

you loose configuration ability (when not being able to change your motor) so pretty much anyone can calculate what your carrying and what you can or can not do

honestly as a Pirates bane pilot.. cheeta's don't scare me half as much as a javlin or a fire starter

kitfox is a waste of time unless your A AMS dome, adder can be ok from time to time...

you should get your self a hero mech or two... start grinding some cbills

[Jonathan8883]

Leone, on 17 October 2017 - 10:16 PM, said:

In this guide, I've a quick vid of what a well built IS assault can do in 50 seconds. (From 'bout 1:25 to 2:15)

I've also a showcase of an Atlas push in my CW Primer. Speaking of which, I think my best showcasing of IS tech versus clan tech would be the second post of that last thread. Two Units I consider to both be very good going up against each other doing their best to eek out every advantage they can get with their tech.

Nice brawling. I'm not seeing anything a clan mech can't do faster - unless it's about having more armor? I have read your Assault guide.

Quote

Also, as to your cooler running question, well, your IS mechs brough ErPpcs and Large Lasers to the party. They're not really the cool running options.

~Leone.

Well, that's what they're supposed to carry isn't it?
I just refitted my BJ-2 with 2 erMedlas, 2 SRM4, 2 SRM6. No Artemis due to weight limits, and it's all gear I had on-hand. I'll try it. edit 2 for 2 failed before getting 100 damage. The BJ has insufficient speed and no ECM or other way to protect itself while closing.

Burning2nd, on 18 October 2017 - 01:01 AM, said:

not a bad start... But as that locust pilot i can tell you how and why your logic is flawed...

First off.. clan tech isnt that much better thats probably a personal preference more then anything

Higher move speed, larger payload, more ways to kill the enemy?

Quote

you loose configuration ability (when not being able to change your motor) so pretty much anyone can calculate what your carrying and what you can or can not do

Is motor changing that common? Engines are very very expensive!

Quote

honestly as a Pirates bane pilot.. cheeta's don't scare me half as much as a javlin or a fire starter

Right, my Cheetah doesn't fight other lights very well.

Quote

kitfox is a waste of time unless your A AMS dome, adder can be ok from time to time...

After posting last night, I reconfigured it to basically what I'd been thinking of doing for a Shadow Cat. 2 Heavy Large Lasers, ECM, AMS, 2 MGs. It's definitely a support build.

Quote

you should get your self a hero mech or two... start grinding some cbills

Based on past history, when will they probably go on sale?

Edited by Jonathan8883, 18 October 2017 - 05:55 AM.

[Leone]

Jonathan8883, on 18 October 2017 - 04:53 AM, said:

Nice brawling. I'm not seeing anything a clan mech can't do faster - unless it's about having more armor? I have read your Assault guide.

Awesome, good to know you read the guide, hope it helped some. As for clan mechs doing it faster, the triple ac 5 build is the one classic thing I miss terribly whilst my unit's been clan. Uac's jam too often, Lbx spread, and clan acs don't start their cooldown till the last shell leaves the barrel, so I can't recreate that sorta brawler with clan tech, not quite. It's why I picked the banshee to show off a successful IS build.

Jonathan8883, on 18 October 2017 - 04:53 AM, said:

Well, that's what they're supposed to carry isn't it?
I just refitted my BJ-2 with 2 erMedlas, 2 SRM4, 2 SRM6. No Artemis due to weight limits, and it's all gear I had on-hand. I'll try it. edit 2 for 2 failed before getting 100 damage. The BJ has insufficient speed and no ECM or other way to protect itself while closing.

Higher move speed, larger payload, more ways to kill the enemy?

Honestly, at this point I don't think I'll be able to convince you. I'm not saying someone else might not, but it seems what you're looking for is something the clanners do a bit easier. You seem to enjoy the range, which is fine, just, not my playstyle so I don't pay attention to the best way to mitigate the clan range advantage besides positioning and brawling.

Hopefully someone'll stop by and discuss the battlemaster in all the configurations I don't use.

As for speed, I personally under engine in order to over-gun my mechs often, though with the way my unit runs, I can't take 'em inna CW much, so half my builds are more higher engine builds to keep up. The trick with a short range build is to limit your engagements till the enemys already in range. Shorter range weaponry has less heat per damage an faster refire rate, meaning if you can get a long range mech into brawl range, you can 1v1 the sucker down. Problem is, you gotta find those optimal approaches.

Jonathan8883, on 18 October 2017 - 04:53 AM, said:

Is motor changing that common? Engines are very very expensive!

And that's why folk'll say that IS mechs are no cheaper'n clan mechs. They'll often swap out the motor.

Edited by Leone, 18 October 2017 - 09:10 AM.

[PurplePuke]

If one of the things you're looking for is an assault sniper, you already have a fantastic one: the MAD IIC D.

Take off the weapons you have mounted, and mount a gauss in each arm, and 2 ERLL. It's a deadly sniper, and plenty of armor for mid to late game too.

Also, have you tried the MAD IIC D build with one AC20 and one LB20X? No ghost heat, works pretty good.

[Jonathan8883]

Do the hero mechs (+30% c-bills) ever go on sale for reduced $$, or do they stay the same price year-round?
With omnimechs, I assume it's the CT that matters and I can swap out pods?
I spend a lot of time in my Arctic Cheetah and can swap parts over to Shard. I'll have to re-skill it up but that doesn't take too long.

[Tier5 Kerensky]

Jonathan8883, on 17 October 2017 - 06:08 PM, said:

Marauder IIC-D (ECM variant) - I just got this one
2x UAC20 (alternating fire to avoid ghost heat), 2 SSRM4 for lights & extra punch, 1 large pulse laser for some ranged damage, LAMS.
Unless I screw up my positioning, 500-800 damage per match. As long as I measure my AC20 fire, it takes a long time to overheat. I have 6 tons of ammo and don't run out unless it's a long match.

You can also also try 2 ERL 2 gauss 2 SRM4, with some XL 300/320/340. Or with stock engine LRMs instead of SRM, as I can understand XL engines are expensive when you are new.

Quote

Hellbringer (ECM variant)
2 large pulse lasers, 3 HMLs, LAMS. I try to reserve the HMLs for sure shots, as using them drives my heat way up.

There's zero point to have 2 large pulse and 3 heavy mediums. Heavy mediums have so poor range, you will never use them, they just waste slots and tons.

Instead, try this. 4 ERM and 2 HLL, all in high mounts. 64 alpha, you can fire twice and then cool off. If enemy is close, keep heat buildup low and only fire one alpha.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...9cb8b2adad6fbd0

If you want to keep large pulse, you can do it with them too, just less heatsinks and little less good convergence of ranges. If you survive with this into late game, anything you see, you kill, expect maybe that Annihilator who is still fresh at 10 minute mark because he never got there. Prior to that, you do a lot of good concentrated damage.

Another classic hellbringer is 4 ERL, but now that the above is possible, I doubt the 4 ERL is any good anymore.

Quote

Mad Dog
2x LRM15, 4x LRM5 (different weapon groups), large pulse laser, machine gun
LRM boat, high mobility, good damage.

Can you use the large pulse often? If not, drop it. You can run Mad Dog perfectly fine without other weapons but LRMs, or maybe take 3-6 ERM.

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Marauder
My first real mech. 2 ER PPC, 1 LBX10, nothing else. Reasonably successful in T5, but far too prone to overheating.

Which model, can you do a pair of RAC5 along with some ERM with it? It's so awful to have your assult's health taken away by RAC Marauder. I get that often, they are not lethal, but really annoying.

Quote

So - why should I ever buy another sluggish IS mech? They have a few techs that Clan doesn't have (RAC, MRM), but they are all so slow and under-gunned! I have not experienced the supposed cooler-running performance, and armor matters less than dead enemies. I like the idea of running IS mechs, but aside from perhaps a RAC-wielding rifleman harasser, I don't see a point. Convince me, please. This is probably my biggest question/issue.

I have to agree. I've mainly brought IS mechs for FP. In quickplay I mainly play with Clan mechs. I think it's made it difficult to build up IS mechs as I somewhat try to make them similiar to Clan mechs, and that just doesn't work so well.

Quote

Hero mechs - When are they likely to go on sale again?

We get all these things more or less randomly. I think major American holidays and spesial days are good bets for some sales, but I'm not familiar with them. Black Friday should be pretty good sales.

Quote

Killing lights - What's a high-maneuverability heavy light or lidght medium that can take down the locusts, arctic cheetahs, etc. of the world? I am assuming TAG + active probe + SSRM, a bank of quick-firing lasers or an AC (rotary?), jumpjets, and preferably ECM so that they don't see me coming. The Shadow Cat doesn't have enough weapon mounts. Huntsman? Maybe a Shadow Hawk or Wolverine if IS? Maneuverability is a big component of this.

Againts good player, SRM and skill. Generally you should try to take out targets of your own size and one step bigger. Let someone better deal with the more difficult ones.

Streak aren't really that good.


"Scouting mode mech for events: Not filled."

For Clan, Huntsman with SRM and maybe few lasers. You can use it on QP too. Maybe fight those lights.


"Do the hero mechs (+30% c-bills) ever go on sale for reduced $$, or do they stay the same price year-round?"

Heroes for MC are 50% every now and then. Their dollar prices are also sometimes on sale, but I think it's something like 30% off then. And that of course applies only to heroes that are available alone.

Yes, the cbill bonus is on the mech, you can swap the pods and can only lose some 8/8 full set quirks.

[The Cyberserker]

Jonathan8883, on 18 October 2017 - 04:53 AM, said:

Is motor changing that common? Engines are very very expensive!

I've literally never owned an IS mech that used the stock engine. And clan mechs are more expensive for the stock version because you're paying for that XL in the original purchase price instead of after. It pretty much balances out.

Teer Kerensky, on 23 October 2017 - 02:32 PM, said:

Streak aren't really that good.

Correction, streaks are god mode vs lights. It's everything else they're not that good against.

Edited by The Cyberserker, 02 November 2017 - 01:41 PM.