59 replies to this topic

[Feezou]

I have a friend who is starting to play MWO. He has tried all the trial mechs, and he says his favorite class is heavy mechs. He personally liked the Ebon Jaguar LPL Gauss trial mech. Even though he liked that mech, I think he might've wanted something a bit more balanced and maneuverable. What would be a mech with decent speed, firepower and armor that wouldn't punish him for bad positioning. I've heard that the Hunckback 4G is a good starter, but I don't know about how he'd do with an AC/20. Then again, he still likes the Ebon Jaguar, so I think he'll enjoy clan heavies.

[Feezou]

Something easy to outfit with weapons would be good, too.

[Eisenhorne]

The Ebon Jaguar is a pretty good mech, why not just get that?

[Leone]

The hunchback is touted as a good training mech because it teaches good habits and is a solid workhorse of a mech, and is rather cheap to outfit well, and you can get a missile ballistic and energy version of the mech, all of which'll teach torso-twisting to protect the vaunted hunch. (Or you could go SP for missiles.)

But if it's about speed, firepower and armour, then yeah, Ebon Jag is a solid choice, and you know he already enjoys it.

~Leone.

Edited by Leone, 02 February 2018 - 04:12 PM.

[Feezou]

Leone, on 31 January 2018 - 09:26 AM, said:

The hunchback is touted as a good training mech because it teaches good habits and is a solid workhorse of a mech, and is rather cheap to outfit well, and you can get a missile ballistic and energy version of the mech, all of which'll teach torso-twisting to protect the vaunted hunch. (Or you could go SP for missiles.)

But it it's about speed, firepower and armour, then yeah, Ebon Jag is a solid choice, and you know he already enjoys it.

~Leone.

I'll tell him to get a Ebon Jaguar in that case. Thanks.

[Ruccus]

To start I think it would be best to get a mech he feels comfortable in, and if he feels comfortable in the Ebon Jaguar it seems like the right choice.

After getting more matches under his belt and more c-bills he might want to try experimenting with other loadouts for his Ebon Jaguar, and by then there may be a mech or two he's met out on the battlefield that piqued his interest, so he might want to look in that direction to increase his stable of mechs for the future.

[Barkem Squirrel]

The Ebon Jag is a good mech, and with omni pod changes he can learn other ways to play to make him a better player. Normally we say start with shadow hawks or hunchbacks, but if he is comfortable with the Jag, it can work.

Just remember, even though he like the Ebon Jag, there are other mechs and other ways to play. Have him get good at what he likes, then play what he is not comfortable playing.

Why, to be able to do unto other as they do unto you.

That means pure laser vomit, pure dakka, LRM boat, SRM bombers, MRM builds, ATM builds.

Then being able to run lights, bouncy mediums, fast mediums and the assaults.

A good second mech for him is the maddog with LRM, ATM and SRM builds. Just for working outside the comfort zone. Learning to LRM will make you a better player on how to avoid LRMs to a point of not needing AMS or ECM to not be hit.

One thing to remember, there are mechs out there that will find him. It may take a while, but when that mech finds him, it will be like a well worn glove or an old friend. Me I have been lucky, with finding the Griffins, wolverines, maddogs and for some reason the Jenner Oxide.

Edited by Barkem Squirrel, 31 January 2018 - 09:50 AM.

[Metus regem]

I've said it many, many times I really push a list of four mechs that all stress different skills for making one a well rounded pilot:


Locust family:

This chassis family, really teaches map knowledge and how not to get hit. Now by map knowledge, you learn how to find the optimal path for navigation as well as where you can find cover to mask your approach for flanking.

Hunchback family:

This chassis family really drives home good gunnery, as well as shielding a side.

Centurion family:

This family is fantastic at teaching the various weapon types, as the 9A and 9D both pack a hard point or two of each weapon type. They also teach torso twisting to maximize taking a hit better than other chassis, as they roll damage very well.

Dragon family:

This family is really good at teaching you how to make the most of less than ideal hit boxes, as well as teaching a cavalry style game play.

Barkem Squirrel, on 31 January 2018 - 09:49 AM, said:

The Ebon Jag is a good mech, and with omni pod changes he can learn other ways to play to make him a better player. Normally we say start with shadow hawks or hunchbacks, but if he is comfortable with the Jag, it can work.

Just remember, even though he like the Ebon Jag, there are other mechs and other ways to play. Have him get good at what he likes, then play what he is not comfortable playing.

Why, to be able to do unto other as they do unto you.

That means pure laser vomit, pure dakka, LRM boat, SRM bombers, MRM builds, ATM builds.

Then being able to run lights, bouncy mediums, fast mediums and the assaults.

A good second mech for him is the maddog with LRM, ATM and SRM builds. Just for working outside the comfort zone. Learning to LRM will make you a better player on how to avoid LRMs to a point of not needing AMS or ECM to not be hit.

One thing to remember, there are mechs out there that will find him. It may take a while, but when that mech finds him, it will be like a well worn glove or an old friend. Me I have been lucky, with finding the Griffins, wolverines, maddogs and for some reason the Jenner Oxide.

I got lucky, for me it was the Bushwacker and the Warhammer, I took to them like a duck takes to water.

[Xaat Xuun]

I started with the Ebon, and liked it, . then picked up a Hellbringer . . the Helbringer became my favorite and I did well with it, always fall back to it, if I find myself falling.
for my aggressive way of play, the Linebacker was a awesome fit,
only medium I liked was the Hunchback IIC, and now the Assassin, The Ice Ferret was fun, but we haven't sync yet, Viper is fun but again, I can't sync with how it's meant to be used.

When Unit did a tour of IS, I found I liked the WarHammers, just as much as I liked the Helbringers , WarHammers are A great starter as well.
till the Dsync to the engine, the only Assault I did descent with was the Kodiak 3&4, after dysnc I avoided ever piloting a Assault, but I came to liking the Banshee, and Battle Master, Also trying to make that Stalker work for me, but lately playing with the Cyclopes and MKII.

what we wind up learning, after each patch, are likes keep changing.

But Mechs like the Ebon Jag, WarHammer, Helbringer . . they still are my favorites and still functional, (there are a couple others but can't pull them out of my head to recall which ones)

It was suggested to get the timber wolf get the Timber wolf. . I did finally . . and it was not the mech for me, sold it, and stayed with the ebon

Edited to correct mech name

Edited by Xaat Xuun, 03 February 2018 - 02:56 PM.

[Spare Parts Bin]

Warhammer Black Widow, Orion Protector,Orion ll-C Skoll, Hero mechs+ premium time= fun for profit.

[Jonathan8883]

The Hunchback is sluggish. I wish I had not bought one as one of my first mechs.
Fast (80kph+) mechs with good maneuverability give a n00b the chance to back out and get away from bad positioning without dying.

What did he think of the trial Hellbringer? ECM helps a lot in lower tiers also.

[Nothar]

Thunderbolts, i recommend thunderbolts.

[justcallme A S H]

HBR is good, but HBR with ECM will teach bad habits early, because of ECM.

So my suggestion would be do NOT get a HBR... You will become lazy and not learn IMO.


If the EBJ does not handle well enough (fast enough) then try a Med - HBKIIC-A. Even after 2 nerfs it is still one of the best Meds and versatile for all sorts of energy builds which are strongest right now.

I wouldn't really go IS at this stage. Clan is easier to learn and perform better in due to cXL

[Feezou]

Jonathan8883, on 01 February 2018 - 07:55 PM, said:

The Hunchback is sluggish. I wish I had not bought one as one of my first mechs.
Fast (80kph+) mechs with good maneuverability give a n00b the chance to back out and get away from bad positioning without dying.

What did he think of the trial Hellbringer? ECM helps a lot in lower tiers also.

I think he liked the Gauss Rifle on the Ebon Jaguar. He said the Hellbringer was good, but he preferred the Ebon Jaguar. I told him an ECM would be beneficial, but I think he has his mind set on the Ebon Jag.

[Metus regem]

Feezou, on 02 February 2018 - 08:05 AM, said:

I think he liked the Gauss Rifle on the Ebon Jaguar. He said the Hellbringer was good, but he preferred the Ebon Jaguar. I told him an ECM would be beneficial, but I think he has his mind set on the Ebon Jag.

Between the Hellbringer and Ebon Jag, I'd suggest Ebon Jag, as it it less likely to teach bad habits early due to ECM.

[TAKTCOM]

Ebon Jaguar is OK. It's a solid machine.

Metus regem, on 31 January 2018 - 10:02 AM, said:

Locust family:
Hunchback family:
Centurion family:
Dragon family:

I would not advise any of them for newplayer. Locust light and light difficult to use. Hunchback and Dragon in the middle of medium and heavy class and this not in the best sense. Hunchback have low mobility for med and low armor for heavy. Dragon? I get a lot of fun with this chassis as a fast cavalery but Bushwaker makes it better. Centurion time is long gone. Even quirks not save him from obsolete.

[Koniving]

Jonathan8883, on 01 February 2018 - 07:55 PM, said:

The Hunchback is sluggish. I wish I had not bought one as one of my first mechs.
Fast (80kph+) mechs with good maneuverability give a n00b the chance to back out and get away from bad positioning without dying.

My Hunchback goes over 81 kph. O.o;
Just needs an engine upgrade to the 250 engine.

The sluggish speed it starts with, though, helps to teach a pilot to be cautious so as to never get in the bad positioning in the first place.

Anyway, Ebon Jaguar is solid. Might have him stray from the Gauss Rifles though one can't argue with its range and how the lack of heat compliments the LPLs. Just a bit complicated to start with.

[Koniving]

(Posted these to show that Hunchbacks don't ~have~ to be slow and sluggish.)
92.7 kph Hunchback 4G chasing down lights to butcher them. (Note the stuff before the match is actually an editing mistake by putting in the wrong clip and not checking it after. )

Spoiler includes more recent slow Hunchbacks and examples of how being slow is not actually a bad thing.

Spoiler

On slow Hunchbacks.. Skip to 2:30 to skip positioning, but after making my way into good solo positioning I start to mess with the enemies. (Included for "slow makes good cautious positioning habits.")


Here skip to 4 minutes for awesomeness. But leading up to that is how I built this mech, and how I tank like crazy with only 320 points of armor.


Skip to 7 minutes. (Though beginning shows the skill tree I used for this one).

Edited by Koniving, 02 February 2018 - 10:21 AM.

[Metus regem]

TAKTCOM, on 02 February 2018 - 09:44 AM, said:

Ebon Jaguar is OK. It's a solid machine.
I would not advise any of them for newplayer. Locust light and light difficult to use. Hunchback and Dragon in the middle of medium and heavy class and this not in the best sense. Hunchback have low mobility for med and low armor for heavy. Dragon? I get a lot of fun with this chassis as a fast cavalery but Bushwaker makes it better. Centurion time is long gone. Even quirks not save him from obsolete.

That list, if one can master them, and I do not mean by the skill tree, I mean truly master them, then they will make you a well rounded pilot. The Hunchback 4G will make you a good gunner, as you have a limited amount of shots in an easy to target section. Yet the Hunchback 4G can take a few hits to that section so that you can learn: Twist--->shoot--->twist

The Centurion is still a viable chassis, if you are not at T1 game play, where a new player should not be in the first place. The Centurion 9A or 9D also teach the same twist, shoot, twist of the Hunchback, but are more forgiving due to packing more ammo. They also let the new player experiment with most of the weapon types on one chassis, not something to be over looked. Centurions are also rather robust with Standard engines and LFE's, with skill and practice they can also work well with XL engines.

The Dragon is not about being a good mech, it's about teaching how to work with less than ideal hit boxes, as well as teaching how to shoot behind you. Yes you read that right, with out arm lock a Dragon can shoot behind itself, an often underrated and under trained skill I see in a lot of players.

The Locust, again is about learning the maps, no mech will teach you maps faster (save perhaps the new Piranha) than the Locust, as it demands your attention at all times, you have to learn how to navigate maps quickly and efficiently so that you do not die.

Yes all of those mechs are hard mode for learning, but they also teach skills, important skills for MWO, better than most mechs, they will also punish you for being sloppy or counting on good hit boxes / quirks / gimmicks to save your backside.

[Mercworks]

I would consider recommending a Stormcrow. It's got a lot of flexibility, and just enough extra speed that he can get out of trouble as fast as he got into it. It's also pretty durable since your weapons tend to be spread. It won't teach torso twisting quite as well since you have to protect your arms (firepower) as well as your torsos.
At least once he "grows up", he'll have a training mech that is very usable.