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Its Time To Reduce Clan Drop Weight Again


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#41 Extra Guac

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Posted 10 December 2018 - 03:35 PM

View PostGrus, on 10 December 2018 - 12:10 PM, said:

Every PIR is overpowed, untill it gets hit... you have to build your mech to be able to deal with the PIR if you have such a problem with them. I personaly LOVE the scorch for this. 4lrm15 and 2lbx20's tend to make lights think twice about brawling.


I'm not having problems with them. Balance was the topic of this thread, and I am just pointing out that they are imbalanced - probably the most glaring imbalance in the game. I agree that if you wanted to, you could do things to counter them like taking arm-mounted weapons, etc.

The closest equivalent on the IS side is obviously the flea, but they have 2/3 the firepower of a piranha, with at best a very minor durability advantage. It's pretty clear that piranhas are outperforming fleas on the battlefield. They also have a higher engine cap.

#42 Grus

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Posted 10 December 2018 - 03:47 PM

View PostDeepfryer, on 10 December 2018 - 03:35 PM, said:


I'm not having problems with them. Balance was the topic of this thread, and I am just pointing out that they are imbalanced - probably the most glaring imbalance in the game. I agree that if you wanted to, you could do things to counter them like taking arm-mounted weapons, etc.

The closest equivalent on the IS side is obviously the flea, but they have 2/3 the firepower of a piranha, with at best a very minor durability advantage. It's pretty clear that piranhas are outperforming fleas on the battlefield. They also have a higher engine cap.


I need to grab one of those fleas...

They also have the speed advantage by far with the masc version. If you have meh lag then you can get away with some crazy hit registration stuff. Watched 4ssrm6a +tag slam into one and it just blinked.

#43 Extra Guac

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Posted 10 December 2018 - 04:12 PM

The masc one is fun, but it has roughly half the firepower of a piranha. They should at least give piranhas a +33% ballistic cooldown nerf & track performance from there.

#44 Grus

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Posted 10 December 2018 - 04:17 PM

View PostDeepfryer, on 10 December 2018 - 04:12 PM, said:

The masc one is fun, but it has roughly half the firepower of a piranha. They should at least give piranhas a +33% ballistic cooldown nerf & track performance from there.


The funny thing is the 12mg one isnt the most dangerous one.

#45 Extra Guac

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Posted 10 December 2018 - 04:21 PM

The funnier thing is that it actually is the most dangerous one.

#46 Grus

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Posted 10 December 2018 - 04:36 PM

View PostDeepfryer, on 10 December 2018 - 04:21 PM, said:

The funnier thing is that it actually is the most dangerous one.


Nope, the 14 energy one is nasy, also the hero version is a monster. The 12mg one dosnt have the ammo to keep it going for very long.

#47 General Solo

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Posted 10 December 2018 - 11:51 PM

So their all dangerous glass cannons

In emergency

Break glass

#48 Bishop Six

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 02:21 AM

View PostSpheroid, on 08 December 2018 - 04:21 PM, said:

I only care about NA primetime.


Well Sir, and I dont care about NA prime time...and now?

Typical Americans who think they are the centre of the universe.

Drop Deck tonnage is fine, every side has its benefits.

#49 Curccu

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 04:01 AM

View PostGrus, on 10 December 2018 - 04:36 PM, said:

Nope, the 14 energy one is nasy, also the hero version is a monster. The 12mg one dosnt have the ammo to keep it going for very long.

How many mechs you have to kill with one 20 ton mech so it has done it's part? 3 tons of ammo = 6000 rounds + skill nodes and 3x heavy smalls or something... or even more ammo if you don't want lazors

#50 vonJerg

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 04:07 AM

Actually, they could reduce drop deck tonnage on both sides, anybody else tired of wave after wave after wave of assaults and assault-armor-rated heavies?

#51 Damnedtroll

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 04:33 AM

View PostHumble Dexter, on 08 December 2018 - 05:23 PM, said:

We could increase tonnage based on Player Tier instead :
- Tier1 : Default value
- Tier2 : +5T
- Tier3 : +10T
- Tier4 : +15T
- Tier5 : +20T


we will see alternate accounts with top players... and you need to do the same for IS side too...

I don't see the need for 20 t difference anyway. WIth all the nerfing and tinkering, it's harder now to adjust than before. THe good way was no nerf and 10 clan(2 stars) against 12 IS(3 lances),

Right now it seems quite balanced if you play your IS or Clan battlemech in their strength bracket. If you get yourself poking at 1000m with IS, it's your problem that you lose.

#52 Grus

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 04:46 AM

View PostvonJerg, on 11 December 2018 - 04:07 AM, said:

Actually, they could reduce drop deck tonnage on both sides, anybody else tired of wave after wave after wave of assaults and assault-armor-rated heavies?


Wont change anything really, some of thier med mech have clan heavy level armor.

#53 vonJerg

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 04:59 AM

View PostGrus, on 11 December 2018 - 04:46 AM, said:

Wont change anything really, some of thier med mech have clan heavy level armor.


True, but might shake up the game play a bit.

#54 Grus

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 05:16 AM

View PostCurccu, on 11 December 2018 - 04:01 AM, said:

How many mechs you have to kill with one 20 ton mech so it has done it's part? 3 tons of ammo = 6000 rounds + skill nodes and 3x heavy smalls or something... or even more ammo if you don't want lazors
the better question is how many kills befor its OP. The PIR dosnt have enough ammo to go on a 12 kill spree without help. I.e. a team coring out a mech to "1 touch" levels and telling the PIR to finish it as the move on.

So you can understand my point of view; i can get 3-4 kills in a pir sometimes but... PIR kd at 1.73 (184 games played)
For comparison my Deathknell kd 2.62 ((214games played) (( max kill count in one game 11))

So i ask.. is the deathknell op?

Edited by Grus, 11 December 2018 - 05:18 AM.


#55 Shanrak

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 05:20 AM

Random idea, give IS side a drop deck size of 5, keep tonnage the same. This ratio would be roughly the same as the 12:10 someone mentioned earlier, and it'll reduce average IS mech weight.

#56 Curccu

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 05:45 AM

View PostGrus, on 11 December 2018 - 05:16 AM, said:

the better question is how many kills befor its OP. The PIR dosnt have enough ammo to go on a 12 kill spree without help. I.e. a team coring out a mech to "1 touch" levels and telling the PIR to finish it as the move on.

So you can understand my point of view; i can get 3-4 kills in a pir sometimes but... PIR kd at 1.73 (184 games played)
For comparison my Deathknell kd 2.62 ((214games played) (( max kill count in one game 11))

So i ask.. is the deathknell op?

no death knell isn't OP, maybe it works better with your playstyle. Most likely your 1,73 KD with piranha isn't because you ran out of ammo, instead you died.
And yes TDK is way more durable because well quirks armor/structure, it goes faster (harder to hit) and doesn't require same face time as piranha to do it's work.

#57 Grus

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 06:09 AM

View PostCurccu, on 11 December 2018 - 05:45 AM, said:

no death knell isn't OP, maybe it works better with your playstyle. Most likely your 1,73 KD with piranha isn't because you ran out of ammo, instead you died.
And yes TDK is way more durable because well quirks armor/structure, it goes faster (harder to hit) and doesn't require same face time as piranha to do it's work.


Youre all most there, the "kernal" per say, is the pilot. The mech dosnt matter. You can get the best player in MWO and put them in a kitchen sink and they will do really good in w/e they pilot.

Its the pilot, not the mech.

#58 Nightbird

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 07:11 AM

View PostGrus, on 11 December 2018 - 06:09 AM, said:

Youre all most there, the "kernal" per say, is the pilot. The mech dosnt matter. You can get the best player in MWO and put them in a kitchen sink and they will do really good in w/e they pilot.

Its the pilot, not the mech.


Really good relative to other pilots in that mech, but still horribly compared to what they can do in other mechs.

#59 November Juliet

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 07:42 AM

Average damage as a clan pilot versus is probably 1800-2500 range
Average damage as an is pilot versus clan probably 1400-1800.

Clans have considerably less armor and don’t need a weight drop at all. You can drop a clan heavy in 200-250 damage versus an is mech which should be able to absorb 300-400 damage at the least. I once had a last wave huntsmen do almost 600 damage do to srm spread on a basically stick maurader. The game was won so it didn’t matter that the damage was farmed. But that amount of damage would kill a huntsmen twice over.

#60 Void Angel

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Posted 11 December 2018 - 10:01 AM

View PostGrus, on 11 December 2018 - 05:16 AM, said:

the better question is how many kills befor its OP. The PIR dosnt have enough ammo to go on a 12 kill spree without help. I.e. a team coring out a mech to "1 touch" levels and telling the PIR to finish it as the move on.

So you can understand my point of view; i can get 3-4 kills in a pir sometimes but... PIR kd at 1.73 (184 games played)
For comparison my Deathknell kd 2.62 ((214games played) (( max kill count in one game 11))

So i ask.. is the deathknell op?

I don't have an opinion either way - but I do want to know if that data was collected over the same period of time, since the Death's Knell has been around a lot longer than the Piranha. If we look at data from different meta periods (for example if there was a period where no Light could match a Firestarter on the Clan side, and we take lifetime data sets comparing it to the Pirhana) our conclusions might be in error.





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