84 replies to this topic

[Ruccus]

Streaks, shotguns, and SRMs can all cause a light mech a world of hurt. And even if you don't carry those, if you've got lasers sweep the legs of light mechs even if they're off in the distance - the damage will add up so it's not a fresh light at the end of a match.

If you've got a big ballistic or PPC know when to not shoot. Wait for the light to run directly towards or away from you before pulling the trigger for the best chance at killing it.

[Mycroft Sandoval-Davion]

It's going to be a hard sell to convince me that a100+ KpH mech is in severe danger from a Heavy/Assault SSRM boat that needs a lock and has a 300m range for any other reason than stupidity/carelessness. SSRMs boats are a just a fotm, because that 6 SSRM6 Catapult is 65 tons of junk if it can't get a lock or can't find a pilot dumb enough to get that close.

With a normal distribution dispersion centered on the CT (at the time of firing) means the majority of the damage will hit your torso (which you can twist), not both of your legs. I was shredding lights before the change, now it takes me a little longer to take them down, which is admittedly anecdotal. The math however, is not.

And yes, I built those SSRM builds (4x SSRM2s is not a "boat") specifically to hunt lights. Because I was sick of getting leg humped by Piranhas when I piloted Assaults. SSRMs have a couple of hard counters which is why I didn't just throw them on a KGC and call it a day. Any Stealth or ECM mech, if it runs with an ECM buddy, will shut down a SSRM boat. A skilled pilot with a couple of ER Mediums has absolutely nothing to fear from an SSRM boat. What is the hard counter to a Piranha or an Artic Cheetah running MG/Micro spam? When this fad is over, there will be a few maneuverable mediums and lights that will be solid with SSRM builds, so I sincerely doubt that they will be nerfed.

Edited by LordBaronVonVaderham, 12 February 2019 - 12:16 PM.

[Asym]

I like the anti-light gig. A Huntsman Pa with 7 Streak 4's, BAP, TAG and nuance small lasers..... Every once in a while you get a stealth mech that thinks a lot of him/herself and by the time they realize "they've been had" it's too late, most of the time. One shooting a light is quite common.........especially, half way through the match. The streaks range messes with some light pilots as well and, sometimes they forget that streaks can run out to 395 m's....and, they believe they are safe at 300 or so....

It's just fun sometimes chasing lights and some mediums that like to back stab.

Edited by Asym, 12 February 2019 - 12:07 PM.

[Darian DelFord]

I have not seen a streak cat in years. At 300 meters? Try over 400 meters? If you get in the cross hairs of one, lights have little to no chance of not being crippled. You forget that most lights are very close range fighters. Well within streak range. You also forget that most heavies can still move like a dancing ballerina. Some assaults to for that matter.

SSRM's are not a FoTM mech. They are seen in almost every game That one mech can basically nullify every light mech in the game with little skill. At least with lazor vomit, or PPFLD you have to hit the mech.

Oh btw you CAN NOT twist auto aim missiles as they hit you all at once. With damage transfer that would be bad. Also you do not need to hit both legs.

I suggest you actually know what your talking about first.

Edited by Darian DelFord, 12 February 2019 - 12:11 PM.

[Acersecomic]

Can't wait for Corsair 7R (5 missile hardpoints)and MAD2-4HP (9 missile hardpoints) to strap all SSRM2s on them and just missilemachinegun the lights xD IS SSRM2s are so fast

[RickySpanish]

Streaks are a natural counter to Light 'Mechs, and have disadvantages against most other builds. I don't think they need any sort of change to be honest. If you die to a streak boat that's just the circle of life.

[Mycroft Sandoval-Davion]

Re: range, 270m is max for IS SSRMs. My VL-BL has a 10% range quirk, so I can get 270*1.25 with full range quirks,which is 337m (I don't run clan s***, so maybe those can hit at 400m). Even at 400m a Clan ML can tickle an SSRM boat to death and there isn't anything they can do about it. I'm not even going to try to explain the damage spread thing. If SSRMs are shredding you now, they would have shredded you before the patch. I haven't been playing that long. If these weren't relatively simple tactical and mathematical problems, I wouldn't even post about them, but they are. Leaving aside stealth and ECM, if you lose an engagement where you have both a range and a mobility advantage that cannot be anything but your own fault. That is just basic combat tactics.

Edited by LordBaronVonVaderham, 12 February 2019 - 12:43 PM.

[Darian DelFord]

LordBaronVonVaderham, on 12 February 2019 - 12:39 PM, said:

Re: range, 270m is max for IS SSRMs. My VL-BL has a 10% range quirk, so I can get 270*1.25 with full range quirks,which is 337m (I don't run clan s***, so maybe those can hit at 400m). Even at 400m a Clan ML can tickle an SSRM boat to death and there isn't anything they can do about it. I'm not even going to try to explain the damage spread thing. If SSRMs are shredding you now, they would have shredded you before the patch. I haven't been playing that long. If these weren't relatively simple tactical and mathematical problems, I wouldn't even post about them, but they are. Leaving aside stealth and ECM, if you lose an engagement where you have both a range and a mobility advantage that cannot be anything but your own fault. That is just basic combat tactics.

Again, you need to understand the root problem of the streak vs light problem. However you are new here, and welcome, you were the 692,961 person to registered on this site. I was here when the most feared mech in the game was an ECM Raven with Dual Streak 2's. They were the king of the battlefield. I was here when everyone ran away from the Streak Cat (A1). I have seen the evolution of streaks and the de-evolution of light mechs.

Again the vast majority of light mechs are very short range. <300m ML's and SL's. There are a few outliers but not many. Your example of using a clan ML tells me you do not understand the problem. You seem to think that lights have a range advantage on a streak boat..... they do not. In fact some mediums can go JUST AS FAST as a light mech. Again this shows your lack of experience with the light vs streak boat problem.

There is no damage spread thing. The "spread" as you call it comes from the RNJesus dictating where they will hit. As most light pilots know, you DO NOT turn away from a boat that has fired at you, this is a sure way to die in one alpha.

I would be very careful about you trying to quote "combat tactics" I have been facing streak boats much longer than you have been playing them. Once you gain more experience, you will see just how EZ mode they are against most light mechs.

Edited by Darian DelFord, 12 February 2019 - 01:23 PM.

[Shadowomega1]

Maddermax, on 12 February 2019 - 01:02 AM, said:

Run Stealth lights. Laugh at streak boats.

/No, TAG isn’t useful, because of uncounterable ECM up close.

Incorrect, as I have tagged stealth armor commandos, but I also have CAP on that Mad Dog.

[thievingmagpi]

Acersecomic, on 12 February 2019 - 12:17 PM, said:

Can't wait for Corsair 7R (5 missile hardpoints)and MAD2-4HP (9 missile hardpoints) to strap all SSRM2s on them and just missilemachinegun the lights xD IS SSRM2s are so fast

100 tons to only be able to kill lights, lolll

[Mycroft Sandoval-Davion]

@Darian

Streaks are absolutely a problem for lights. That is why I run them. It negates the advantages of being tiny and fast. That doesn't make them OP. They have hard counters and are most effectively used by lights and fast mediums because they are short range. Micros and MGs do no have hard counters. Do you understand what I mean by "hard counter?" Stealth flat out negates SSRMs. Any ratio of ECM to B/CAP over 1:1 flat out negates SSRMs. Your choice to run exclusively short range weapons is your choice. A ML's damage degrades in a linear fashion from it's optimal range to it's max range, so it can trump the SSRM even though they have the same "range." My SSRMs cannot travel past 337 meters. At max range a fast light can even outrun it like they do LRMs. A light pilot trying to use the same leg hump or circle tactics will have issues with streaks, but nobody is forcing you to stick with those tactics.


EDIT: I thought of a way to explain what I mean about damage spread. Before the spread for Streaks was 1D6 or one die. So the damage was spread evenly arcoss the mech. Now the damage is 2D6 (2 dice) divided by 2. That means the center of your mech takes more damage and the edges take less. Because your legs are your life in a light, the recent change did not make them better against lights. It made them slightly worse, but still quite dangerous. The change made them more effective against heavier targets, which they were pretty pointless against before. That is why I think people are running them more now.

Combat Tactics are not exclusive to MWO. All things being equal, in any fight, advantages in mobility & range give the initiative entirely to the side that has them.

The way I see it, you can either continue to complain about them, you can exploit their weaknesses to your advantage, or you can run them yourself. Personally, I'd prefer you complain. I gives me joy to know I am annoying light pilots like they have often annoyed me. I've stopped running the Javelin and I rarely run the Commando, but I am going to add an Assassin to the Vulcan soon. Frankly, the tears of light mech pilots are just too delicious for me to stop hunting them and being able to do it in a medium is just icing on the cake.

Edited by LordBaronVonVaderham, 12 February 2019 - 02:49 PM.

[Acersecomic]

thievingmagpi, on 12 February 2019 - 01:25 PM, said:

100 tons to only be able to kill lights, lolll

The Marauder II still has 4 energy points.
And Corsair has 1 ballistic and 2 energy point.
I don't see much waste here

[Maddermax]

Shadowomega1, on 12 February 2019 - 01:08 PM, said:

Incorrect, as I have tagged stealth armor commandos, but I also have CAP on that Mad Dog.

CAP, as mentioned previously, does not affect stealth lights at all. If you tag a commando and hit him with streaks, that means he’s spent at least a few seconds in the open, both in your short SSRM range but not within disruption range, which is obliging of him, but difficult to set up in practice.

[Grus]

I'd be more concerned about dual HGAUSS or Gauss or dual LBX20... Streaks cant go very far.

[Maddermax]

Darian DelFord, on 12 February 2019 - 12:06 PM, said:

SSRM's are not a FoTM mech. They are seen in almost every game That one mech can basically nullify every light mech in the game with little skill. At least with lazor vomit, or PPFLD you have to hit the mech.

I know you’re an exceptional light pilot, but there’s no reason for hyperbole about streaks. One steak boat in a game does not nullify lights, they are really not low skill weapons most of the time due to lock-on-only nature (which is a drawback in many situations) and short range, various forms of disruption and nerfs to lock on angle (which is a big deal in light hunting).

I run both lights and streak boats, and I don’t feel countered by Streaks when I’m running lights, and most of my damage when running streaks comes from mediums and heavies. Part of the reasons for that is that lights will often see a streak boat before the streak boat sees them and simply avoid them, or the couple of seconds to lock on will allow the light to dive to cover, and reposition the hell away from the streak boat. Yes, a light caught unaware is going to die, but they would die to many other things as well in that case (dual gauss, multi-AC/LBX10, pulse laser spam).

Edited by Maddermax, 12 February 2019 - 03:57 PM.

[BrunoSSace]

Lights should avoid streaks. Streak boats hunt lights. Lights eat Assults. I don't see a problem here, the circle of life is in full effect.

[Dee Eight]

This is my track record on my twin ERML / triple SSRM6 / ECM maxed armor shadow cat so far this month. 323 Dee Eight 43 30 1.43 88 34 2.59 74 332

this is my overall for the month
2224 Dee Eight 60 38 1.58 114 46 2.48 99 326

I have spent less than 10 matches in either lights or heavies (and thus don't show on the leaderboards for them) and only 15 in assaults. Combine streaks and high ground and you can kill lights and assaults just fine. Solaris City is turning into my new favourite map for the mech. All the buildings I'd want to use are within reach and when you fire on mechs from significantly above, you're more likely to hit the rear torso hit boxes because...you know...PGI can't do mech modeling properly on many chassis. Locusts and Piranhas especially... about 30 degrees of elevation above them and you hit the rear torso from the front. I one-volley killed a fresh PIR-1(S) that was charging across HPG while I was up on the wall ahead of him. Thanks to PGI now directing more streaks towards the center torso... this is working even better.

[RickySpanish]

Maddermax, on 12 February 2019 - 03:55 PM, said:

I know you’re an exceptional light pilot, but there’s no reason for hyperbole about streaks. One steak boat in a game does not nullify lights, they are really not low skill weapons most of the time due to lock-on-only nature (which is a drawback in many situations) and short range, various forms of disruption and nerfs to lock on angle (which is a big deal in light hunting).

I run both lights and streak boats, and I don’t feel countered by Streaks when I’m running lights, and most of my damage when running streaks comes from mediums and heavies. Part of the reasons for that is that lights will often see a streak boat before the streak boat sees them and simply avoid them, or the couple of seconds to lock on will allow the light to dive to cover, and reposition the hell away from the streak boat. Yes, a light caught unaware is going to die, but they would die to many other things as well in that case (dual gauss, multi-AC/LBX10, pulse laser spam).

How dare you! He has been here Since The Beginning! He was here when the great Raven Lords devoured mortals who foolishly set foot upon their travels at night. He has seen, witnessed the terror in the eyes of The Atlas on Forest Colony as Splat Cat after Splat Cat did wring forth from Cave, which was unguarded. He hath laid witness to the perpetual green screen of doom. When LRMPocalypse Chapter 1 began, he was there on the front lines in his Awesome 8R giggling like a maniac. He has popped every tart; he is the one that knocks down.

My God. Have some respect.

[dario03]

BrunoSSace, on 12 February 2019 - 04:18 PM, said:

Lights should avoid streaks. Streak boats hunt lights. Lights eat Assults. I don't see a problem here, the circle of life is in full effect.

The problem is there is no circle right now. Its bigger is better. So there is no need for an anti-light weapon, if anything if there is going to be a weapon that hard counters a class it should hard counter the bigger classes.

[Roughneck45]

dario03, on 12 February 2019 - 05:36 PM, said:

The problem is there is no circle right now. Its bigger is better. So there is no need for an anti-light weapon, if anything if there is going to be a weapon that hard counters a class it should hard counter the bigger classes.

Its called aim. The hard counter for everything in this game is aim.

If you cant aim, and lights terrify you, you bring streaks.

Bigger =/= Better