144 replies to this topic

[DucPilot]

Seriously, there are good players out there, and I’m not knocking them for being good. But I do get tired of the typical response “Get Gud Bro”. Not everyone has that much time, and some that do may never become elite. Something needs to be done with these unbalanced matches. Constantly being stomped while in tier one or two, is not fun for the teams being stomped, or the teams doing the stomping (I would hope), and I have been on both ends of that spectrum.

If you are that good, don’t you want to be challenged by other players of the same caliber? I know I would. Why should I spend time investing into a game (although much slower than others) where the top tier is going to be so unbalanced? Should I go create a smurf account so I can go stomp on the newer players? Yea, fun right? Guess I have to start over and buy all those mechs again (don’t see there being any other option). I mean if you want end game, go play invasion, leave QP alone, it’s obviously beneath you.

Perhaps PGI should force you into an elite tier? How does PGI do this you ask? Well this game has been around long enough where PGI can tell based on your stats. So what about an elite player in a unit with less elite players? How about you limit the number of elite players that can drop in a QP match? Well my buddy and I play together and....so PGI how about custom made QP matches? Probably not enough player base right? Nah, that’s a whole different topic.

The tier system is obviously not working now as is, and I’m not sure I have the answer. We all have our good games, and our bad games, i am referring to those who constantly out class others. They need to be dealt with. They need to move onto other things to challenge themselves while not ruing the game for others. I can’t tell you how many times I have heard players wishing they were still in tier 3, those matches were more balanced than the higher tiers where elite players have nowhere else to go.

For now I guess game developers will continue to weed out players that are not good enough to hang with elite players. Time to move on to a different game I suppose and start the cycle all over again.

Edited by DucPilot, 26 May 2019 - 06:57 PM.

[RickySpanish]

I'd love an Elite tier, I imagine I would reach it eventually. Heck I'm maintaining decent stats this month piloting unskilled Riflemen *muscle flex*.

But you know, try harding isn't so much about playing the game 24/7. At the moment I'm a newly minted Mechdad with a 2 month old going through a growth spurt with an hour a day shared with all other recreational activities, but my stats are alright.

IMO half the battle is won in the Mechlab, so why don't you post your favourite build and maybe GD can give you a hand and some helpful tips? To start with, have you had a look at the builds up on the Grimm Mechs website? It's here:

grimmechs.isengrim.org

[Y E O N N E]

Let me tell you a secret: being decent at this game is less a function of time invested and more a function of how much attention you pay toward how you are playing and how interested you are in improving. There are resources out there that can help you to get better almost over night, but you have to first accept that you are not good as you are and that you want to get better.

[Snowhawk]

The Problem are not the good Players..... the Problem is the matchmaker.

Please read this: https://mwomercs.com...aker-is-unfair/

I made also some screenshoots where I compared the ranks (ranks from jarls-list) and sometimes I was really schocked. In some Matches there was clearly an Imbalance between the two Teams. One Team with a lot of 90% Players and in the Canon-fodder-Team more of 80% Players. Pgi Need to improve the matchmaker. Sort the Teams by Tier and their average matchscore of the last 5 months. You recognize good Players by high average matchscores. I mean there are Players who have in the end of the month a score of 120 and then there are realy good Players with 300, 400 or even more Points....

[Phoenix 72]

First of all I am wondering: How would you classify try hard in this scenario? Everybody above a certain match score? K/D? W/L?

Secondly, there is so much going wrong with the match maker it is not even funny anyway... Aside from the points above regarding player skills, there is also the problem that Mechs are not created equal, either. There are times when I know my team is going to lose just judging by the Mechs I see on our team. Some people pick Mechs because they look cool, for RPG reasons and whatever else, not just by performance. An updated MM would need to take that into account, too.

And my third and last point, a lot of it depends on when you play. For some reason, whenever I play very early in the morning european time, I get stomps out the wazoo. Can't do anything about it. No matter my performance or match score. Most of the time I end up in the stomped team. Played two matches today, 1/12 and 4/12. I was highest damage in both, 327 and 388 match score respectively. When I play at other times, later in the day, the teams are seeded much more evenly. Stomps become much more rare. Matches become much closer. And I have no idea why that is.

But if I only counted my matches prior to 7 am in this month, I would be something like 0.5 W/L at best.

[Curccu]

Y E O N N E, on 26 May 2019 - 07:44 PM, said:

Let me tell you a secret: being decent at this game is less a function of time invested and more a function of how much attention you pay toward how you are playing and how interested you are in improving. There are resources out there that can help you to get better almost over night, but you have to first accept that you are not good as you are and that you want to get better.

https://leaderboard....%0ACurccu%0D%0A
Lies

But back to topic, PGIs tier system is just **** and player numbers are going down so that's why we get potatoes into our matches and potatoes get us, probably neither is happy.

[Hierarch]

Join a real unit, attend practice learn to play

[GoodTry]

The problem IMO is just balancing the teams. I don't think there is a whole lot MM can do about who is in a match, but I regularly see stomps with 3 99% players on one side and no one notable on the other. Just split them up, and matches will significantly improve.

[Y E O N N E]

Curccu, on 26 May 2019 - 08:55 PM, said:

https://leaderboard....%0ACurccu%0D%0A
Lies

But back to topic, PGIs tier system is just **** and player numbers are going down so that's why we get potatoes into our matches and potatoes get us, probably neither is happy.

That is only reinforcing what I said, dude.

[theplayerx4734]

The crap matchmaker makes for 4-12 stomps, its life. Get in kills before you get roflstomped.

If your doing sub 300 damage, in tier 1, there's something wrong with your play, and since the matchmaker is a XP and not actual tier, your will constantly move up untill you reach T1 - even if you dont belong there.

PGI designed a flawed matchmaker, with its design assuming time=skill which is only semi true.

[denAirwalkerrr]

[Snowhawk]

GoodTry, on 26 May 2019 - 09:07 PM, said:

The problem IMO is just balancing the teams. I don't think there is a whole lot MM can do about who is in a match, but I regularly see stomps with 3 99% players on one side and no one notable on the other. Just split them up, and matches will significantly improve.

That's what I'm Talking About....

Last week I saw some streams on twich and one of the streamer was often in the same Team with other well known Players (Quick-Play). This players are not "sync-dropping", so it's not their fault or their Intention if they are dropping together. I saw the Chat of the red-Team and one Player complained that he knows exactely the Outcome of the match because the good Players are again on one side.

As I mentioned, I can confirm this strange behavior from the matchmaker because I tried to analyze some screenshoots with the Rankings from the jarls-list.

[johntherussian]

There are simply not enough players to support a diverse enough matchmaker without unreasonably long wait times. That's just how it is and how it will be until the game dies or some miracle happens that brings in a huge new population.

[DucPilot]

First off let me say I appreciated the constructive feedback. I may have been harsh when I referred to players of exceptional talent as try hards. I’m was not trying to say that all these players take the game to seriously. We all want to win, winning feels good. I would suspect though that they would like to be more challenged, and compete with others at their level.

Yes there are some great resources out there to help you improve your game, and I suggest that anyone who enjoys stomping around in battle mechs to check them out. Not only are they fun to watch, but they will definitely help improve your game play, as already mentioned.

That said, you may never become one of the elite, and that’s ok, were all here because we love Battletech. The point I was trying to make was for those that are looking for that higher level of challenge there is not much to be found. Still I wonder if they find enjoyment solely out of consistently stomping on others. They deserve better PGI, and so do the rest of us.

[FRAGTAST1C]

* The population isn't large enough to further keep dividing the players and creating different buckets.

* I had made a topic a while ago stating that the MM isn't the sole problem but it's also the way the mechs are created. For e.g., a Highlander IIC isn't going to be better than a Mad Cat. So, MM can't solve the problem when one team gets loaded with that kind of mech-imbalance despite players in those mechs being slightly better than the others in the enemy team. You can counter that imbalance by having teammates around but that doesn't quite work for everybody in Instant Action.

What needs to happen is to make Instant Action mode less fun for the experienced players and FW to be more enticing with great rewards and better balance. Unfortunately, as long as that doesn't happen, imo, Instant Action is where people will need to make the most of and put up with stomps on a regular basis. So, just try to do 500 damage and get a kill or so and move on. If you feel like typing some sarcastic comment at the end of the game or something funny, please do. But move on.

[FupDup]

Bruh, people have been complaining about the tier system not working since like the first week it was added. Whether to reform or replace it is up for debate, but the ultimate factor is that the current system is basically like an XP bar that will increase over time if the player is able to attain even average performance. Thus, even at the "top" you still see a massive skill gap because almost anybody can get there if they just play long enough regardless of skill level.

PGI deliberately designed the system with a bias towards pushing people up unless they really, really screw up hard on a consistent basis. And even then they still might get pushed up because reasons. Any changes or replacements for the system cannot have such a massive upward bias.

[Lykaon]

DucPilot, on 26 May 2019 - 06:56 PM, said:

Should I go create a smurf account so I can go stomp on the newer players?

Apparently yes...

[KhanBhacKeD]

I edited a bit my answer cause I musunderstood some things you have said.

If you want to smurf to bash new player, it's just you don't want to improve in any way.

Tbh, yes MM is not decent, only 20% of the match are decent and event there cause of low population 40% of both teams are not decent.

But don't complain about good player if you do bad and they told you to improve yourself (especially if you whine or cry during match).

Cause actually good players are not welcome anywhere. The comment (not yours) about they need to go to FP is dumb cause even there if they play (sometimes not in group) they are told to stop farming poor guys...

I don't blame you to don't like the state of MM but you have to deal with.


PS : if you do group queue remember there is literally no tier here cause of low pop.

Edit : and BTW you don't need to play a lot to be in a "top tier" (let say it's 95%+) and even there you have a world between 95% and 99%

Edited by KhanBhacKeD, 26 May 2019 - 11:00 PM.

[Vellron2005]

DucPilot, on 26 May 2019 - 06:56 PM, said:

Seriously, there are good players out there, and I’m not knocking them for being good. But I do get tired of the typical response “Get Gud Bro”. Not everyone has that much time, and some that do may never become elite. Something needs to be done with these unbalanced matches. Constantly being stomped while in tier one or two, is not fun for the teams being stomped, or the teams doing the stomping (I would hope), and I have been on both ends of that spectrum.

If you are that good, don’t you want to be challenged by other players of the same caliber? I know I would. Why should I spend time investing into a game (although much slower than others) where the top tier is going to be so unbalanced? Should I go create a smurf account so I can go stomp on the newer players? Yea, fun right? Guess I have to start over and buy all those mechs again (don’t see there being any other option). I mean if you want end game, go play invasion, leave QP alone, it’s obviously beneath you.

Perhaps PGI should force you into an elite tier? How does PGI do this you ask? Well this game has been around long enough where PGI can tell based on your stats. So what about an elite player in a unit with less elite players? How about you limit the number of elite players that can drop in a QP match? Well my buddy and I play together and....so PGI how about custom made QP matches? Probably not enough player base right? Nah, that’s a whole different topic.

The tier system is obviously not working now as is, and I’m not sure I have the answer. We all have our good games, and our bad games, i am referring to those who constantly out class others. They need to be dealt with. They need to move onto other things to challenge themselves while not ruing the game for others. I can’t tell you how many times I have heard players wishing they were still in tier 3, those matches were more balanced than the higher tiers where elite players have nowhere else to go.

For now I guess game developers will continue to weed out players that are not good enough to hang with elite players. Time to move on to a different game I suppose and start the cycle all over again.

OP I understand your frustration with getting stomped by big names and even bigger units..

Problem is, there is not many "normal" players left in this game..

Most people playing are here long enough to be in a high tier, and then they get to be stomped by the top players.

Some people are calling for a tier reset. I'm thinking maybe it would not be such a bad thing..

Again, problem is, there are not enough players to insure T1 players drop only with T1 and T2 players..

What PGI needs to do is this:

1) Reset the tiers
2) Calculate tiers based on average match score in a certain weight class, and only in 100 last matches played in that weight class.
3) Invest HEAVILY into marketing, attract new players
4) Consider introducing Bots for certain mods that are low in population (FP, GQ, Solaris)

[Bowelhacker]

So... the matchmaker is shite because the tier system rewards grind rather than talent but a bunch of people consistently wave the rankings based on this around to prove how enormous their e-peens are?