66 replies to this topic

[Nightbird]

Nascar is an advanced rotation that involves faster mechs going wide and slower mechs taking a short path, thus utilizing the top speed of all mechs to form a firing line facing the enemy.

If you do not rotate, and proceed in a straight line, the faster mechs will get ahead of slower mechs, leading to an sub-optimal firing line.

If you simply defend, a rotating firing line (Nascar) will almost always encounter part of your defense rather than all of it, leading to a loss from unfavorable attrition. As the saying goes, fortune favors the bold.

Of course, in QP, some slow mech pilots will choose to follow the faster mechs' path exactly rather than take a tighter turn closer to the center. This is because bad pilots are bad pilots, not because Nascar isn't a great strategy.

[Vorpal Puppy]

Most QP games I was in last night I wish the team would have nascar'd. Instead it seemed like everyone wanted to spread out and do their own thing. Had one mining collective game where 2 of the 4 Charlie lance assaults went to the opposite corners of our spawn line to lob their lurms. You can guess how well that worked.

[Prototelis]

Anytime I see LRM charlies in zimbabwe I know its going to be bad. They spend most of their time shooting into terrain.

[FRAGTAST1C]

Prototelis, on 14 October 2019 - 12:44 PM, said:

Anytime I see LRM charlies in zimbabwe I know its going to be bad. They spend most of their time shooting into terrain.

Is it 'cause they're using Zimbabwean LRMs? I mean....

[Dee Eight]

Nightbird, on 14 October 2019 - 09:24 AM, said:

This is because bad pilots are bad pilots, not because Nascar isn't a great strategy.

You didn't need the rest of the explanation... that sentence summed it up nicely on its own.

[Khobai]

I think one of the big problems has to do with where assaults spawn on certain maps.

if nascar is always counterclockwise then assaults should always spawn in the right-most spawnpoint to account for them being slower.

when assaults spawn in the left-most spawnpoint AND theyre slow they tend to get left behind more often.

if they just fixed the assault spawn points on all the maps it would increase the survivability of bad players even if its for reasons beyond their comprehension.

Edited by Khobai, 14 October 2019 - 09:51 PM.

[Asmosis]

PhoenixFire55, on 14 October 2019 - 09:10 AM, said:

What is the point to NOT leave your clueless team / assaults behind?

Usually what happens is the assaults engage the enemies, and while they are busy trying to do what they do, they dont notice the rest of the team has started the nascar, subconsciously thinking they can sneak around behind the enemy and be able to shoot without getting shot at.

It only takes a moments inattention to the minimap as an assault and your a sitting duck.

Suggesting its a pathing issue is silly, since the only way to catch up is to cut across the middle of the circle. In that big open area. In plain sight of both teams. Your better off finding some cover and hoping the other team are braindead zombies as well, and they just walk straight past you and you can pop out and start picking off their stragglers knowing full well their team wont turn around to help. There is no "tighter circle" to follow, since the faster mechs take the most efficient route to flank already.

Edited by Asmosis, 15 October 2019 - 11:24 AM.

[PhoenixFire55]

Asmosis, on 15 October 2019 - 11:20 AM, said:

stuff

You haven't answered my question.

[Dee Eight]

Khobai, on 14 October 2019 - 09:47 PM, said:

I think one of the big problems has to do with where assaults spawn on certain maps.

if nascar is always counterclockwise then assaults should always spawn in the right-most spawnpoint to account for them being slower.

when assaults spawn in the left-most spawnpoint AND theyre slow they tend to get left behind more often.

if they just fixed the assault spawn points on all the maps it would increase the survivability of bad players even if its for reasons beyond their comprehension.

PGI did adjust the drop points on a few maps in particular that are prone to that problem but on others they made no effort at changing them at all. Mining Collective for example had them changed so that charlie lances drop in the center of the formation. It doesn't matter though...the game is international... many players cannot understand spoken english worth a damn, so saying "don't nascar" on a mic doesn't really help when nascar itself is only a USA thing as a motorsport. It has no context in europe or asia where automobile racing involves turning both ways on a track.

[MW Waldorf Statler]

PhoenixFire55, on 14 October 2019 - 09:10 AM, said:

What is the point to NOT leave your clueless team / assaults behind?

less of firepoweer ?! 10 mechs have not the Firepower of 12 ,and the team thats run away from the other can not firing continous back, other side the leading Team with the faster Mechs can hold an continous Focus Fire of the enemy.1-2 assaults have not the Firepower to hold up 5-6 Light and Medium mechs and lost in seconds, and which team has the more agressive Mechbuilds, the Team with LRM Assaults for example lost in Nascar ,while the Assaults not can bring in her firepower in (ok most Assault pilots never bring in her firepower ), thats like a army thats not save her Artillery and let the Enemy in the Back.

Edited by MW Waldorf Statler, 15 October 2019 - 06:41 PM.

[Prototelis]

Fire power means nothing if it can't be leveraged; if you can't path in a slow assault you are throwing trying to play one.

[General Solo]

MW Waldorf Statler, on 15 October 2019 - 06:33 PM, said:

less of firepoweer ?! 10 mechs have not the Firepower of 12 ,and the team thats run away from the other can not firing continous back, other side the leading Team with the faster Mechs can hold an continous Focus Fire of the enemy.1-2 assaults have not the Firepower to hold up 5-6 Light and Medium mechs and lost in seconds, and which team has the more agressive Mechbuilds, the Team with LRM Assaults for example lost in Nascar ,while the Assaults not can bring in her firepower in (ok most Assault pilots never bring in her firepower ), thats like a army thats not save her Artillery and let the Enemy in the Back.

You only missing out on 1 or 200 damage max from such assault pilots.

Besides damage dont win games, kills do.

Better to get one or two kills than save those sub 200 damage assualt, for the win.

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 15 October 2019 - 07:44 PM.

[PhoenixFire55]

MW Waldorf Statler, on 15 October 2019 - 06:33 PM, said:

less of firepoweer ?! thats like a army thats not save her Artillery and let the Enemy in the Back.

No its not, because army artillery knows what its doing. If I'm a light that does 200 dmg per minute in a match and I have an assault that does 200 dmg per entire match, i.e. 30-40 dmg per minute, then in order to win it is a right decision to "abandon" that assault in favor of my own damage and survival. Firepower is pointless when you don't know how to use it.

Slow mechs come in two types ... Those who do have a clue, and those who get left behind.

[MW Waldorf Statler]

PhoenixFire55, on 16 October 2019 - 03:41 AM, said:

No its not, because army artillery knows what its doing. If I'm a light that does 200 dmg per minute in a match and I have an assault that does 200 dmg per entire match, i.e. 30-40 dmg per minute, then in order to win it is a right decision to "abandon" that assault in favor of my own damage and survival. Firepower is pointless when you don't know how to use it.

Slow mechs come in two types ... Those who do have a clue, and those who get left behind.

Artilery is splash Damage..thats not real dangerous for a Mech over Lightsize
.A good Assault Pilot can kill with 200 dmg 2 enemy mechs with exact fire on the weakest points (not alone standing in the fireline of the reds),or destroing the half Firepower of a mech ...Kills ist good, fast kills better

200 Dmg each Minute with a light ????

and 200Dmg in a Assault 200 is good in a Light , ok in a Medium ...not good in a heavy
Assaults like Aircraft Carrier or Battleship ,withourt Supportfleet only a Big slow target for Submarines for example, with a good Fleet a giant deadly weapon.

In my Mind im thinking the most Boys was never in the Army and learn basic tactics like Firelines and Firesupport, overlapping Firelines , Fire by movement in different Formations for each Situations of the Field
and not teamplayers and more Rambos

Edited by MW Waldorf Statler, 16 October 2019 - 07:42 AM.

[Stormpaw]

MW Waldorf Statler, on 16 October 2019 - 07:29 AM, said:

Artilery is splash Damage..thats not real dangerous for a Mech over Lightsize
.A good Assault Pilot can kill with 200 dmg 2 enemy mechs with exact fire on the weakest points (not alone standing in the fireline of the reds),or destroing the half Firepower of a mech ...Kills ist good, fast kills better

200 Dmg each Minute with a light ????

and 200Dmg in a Assault 200 is good in a Light , ok in a Medium ...not good in a heavy
Assaults like Aircraft Carrier ,withourt Supportfleet only a Big slow target, with a good Fleet a giant deadly weapon.

In my Mind im thinkingthe most Boys was never in the Army and learn basic tactics like Firelines and Firesupport
and not teamplayers and more Rambos

I'd say assaults are more like battleships, not that it matters.

In the army you'll probably have all your friends at least reasonably trained with at least usable gear and trying to achieve the same objective. In mwo qp you have guys that are trained and equipped like special forces, guys that never shot a gun with a one shot sawn off shotgun and guys that only bring grenades and say you guys up front tell me where the enemy is, I will never face them with you, but I will toss grenades where you tell me to while you're getting shot. All these people are on the same team with massive disparity of skill and equipment, and to make it worse they don't even know each other and don't care about helping each other. So you get what you get.

If you want any resemblance of teamwork find people to play with and drop FP or comp. Solo QP is NOT a team game.

[Dee Eight]

MW Waldorf Statler, on 16 October 2019 - 07:29 AM, said:

Artilery is splash Damage..thats not real dangerous for a Mech over Lightsize
.A good Assault Pilot can kill with 200 dmg 2 enemy mechs with exact fire on the weakest points (not alone standing in the fireline of the reds),or destroing the half Firepower of a mech ...Kills ist good, fast kills better

It is splash damage, and given the number of assault players who never torso twist and just front load almost all their armor, and stick ammo in their torso... its quite possible to score an ammo critical hit thru a rear torso on an assault... killing it using a well placed strike. But how would you even know that... you've barely played the game in 3 1/4 years. You've not managed to do 10 matches per month in QP in the previous 39 months to show on the leaderboards at all and have done less than 40 so far this month.

[PhoenixFire55]

MW Waldorf Statler, on 16 October 2019 - 07:29 AM, said:

stuff

[GuardDogg]

Prototelis, on 13 October 2019 - 02:05 PM, said:

Don't play slow assaults unless you know how to path. EZ.

Some Assault mechs are omni, and you can not change the engines. So, in all do not bring out Assault omni mechs you are saying as well.

[Monkey Lover]

We always have to 1 assault in our group. I fiND it funny most the time he is in the front and someone on voip starts crying about nascar.

If it's 3 minutes into the game it's your fault 99% of the time. Just an easy way to blame the team because you can't watch the minimap.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 16 October 2019 - 12:26 PM.

[Prototelis]

GuardDogg, on 16 October 2019 - 12:02 PM, said:

Some Assault mechs are omni, and you can not change the engines. So, in all do not bring out Assault omni mechs you are saying as well.

And that has what to do with not playing slow assaults if you don't know how to path?