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Piranha Games Refuses To Give Me A Refund.


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#41 Guy Humual

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 03:35 PM

View PostTarl Cabot, on 18 December 2019 - 07:08 AM, said:

And as for the emails, I received mine on August 6th at 5:19pm cst via a yahoo account. I debated on whether to refund or not, then submitted the request 2.5 weeks later. And that decision affected only a tiny bit it being released with Epic instead of Steam.

Well I have a Yahoo account as well. No idea why I didn't get an email then.

#42 Guy Humual

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 03:53 PM

View PostUnleashed3k, on 18 December 2019 - 06:45 AM, said:

Sorry, this smells….
And ofc, people run out of arguments and bring the "car-example"...

Sure, so let's use comic books, let's say Marvel was selling comic books and I preordered a comic and because I preordered I get web exclusive wall paper from the Marvel line. Then when the Comic is due out I find out that the comic isn't getting delivered to my local comic book store, but to one that's across town. It's not a major inconvenience to drive over there, but I want to shop and support my local store, so I cancel the order. Then Marvel says I can't cancel the order as I've downloaded all that free art. Does that example make it more palatable to you?

View PostUnleashed3k, on 18 December 2019 - 06:45 AM, said:

If you wanna use that, then say you bought a car with extras from x, but x is wasted and y took over production, you still get the same car but with another logo on it.
The logo isn't the issue in this analogy, it's having to change dealerships. If the car was being sold at the same dealership there wouldn't be an issue.

View PostUnleashed3k, on 18 December 2019 - 06:45 AM, said:

And in this case, you bought something from PGI, Steam wasn't able to make a better deal, now you get the same product from PGI, but from a different seller.
I have no issue with them changing sellers. They can do whatever they want. I don't want to deal with another seller though and I'd just like my money back.

View PostUnleashed3k, on 18 December 2019 - 06:45 AM, said:

Or do you really believe MW5 would have been better in quality, only because it would have been released on Steam?
No, I believe it would have been easier for me the consumer.

View PostUnleashed3k, on 18 December 2019 - 06:45 AM, said:

So in fact, you have the same damn product (car), only because you don't like Epic, you now tell everyone you have been cheated...
I'm saying that I wasn't informed of the change and I'd like a refund. I'd like to be able to chose which seller I buy from. I don't want to install Epic Games on my computer, I don't want to give them my personal information, and I'd have liked to have used the Steam functions to connect with my friends online while playing this game.

View PostUnleashed3k, on 18 December 2019 - 06:45 AM, said:

And ofc "I bought a Steamkey", but now the key is from Epic, but for the SAME DAMN "CAR".
Again the car isn't the issue. I was originally willing to buy the car when it was available in the dealership I liked.

View PostUnleashed3k, on 18 December 2019 - 06:45 AM, said:

Still nothing has changed on the product, the key will still remain only a KEY, the "car" is still MW5 and it drives very well.
Posted Image

Again, how the car drives is beside the point, I'm not upset with MW5, I haven't even played it yet. What I'm upset about is the service I have to use to get the car. Is that clear enough for you?

#43 Guy Humual

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 04:00 PM

View PostMcHoshi, on 18 December 2019 - 11:55 AM, said:

06.08.2019 um 23:18 Uhr

Posted Image




It has been officially announced that Mechwarrior 5: Mercenaries will now be releasing on December 10th, 2019 exclusively on the Epic Games Store.

Community Pre-order pilots will be able to access the Closed Beta to access practice missions in November prior to the game’s full launch. Our partnership with Epic Games store allows us the opportunity to make sure MechWarrior 5: Mercenaries meets our internal goal of creating the best MechWarrior game possible. Fans looking to obtain refunds from their pre-order of any tier are able to do so by September 1st.
  • Read the full announcement Here!
  • For more details read the FAQ!
  • For more information or to request a refund please contact Support! (support@mw5mercs.com)
I am guessing that everyone who preordered mw5 got this auto-email.
Those who ain´t got one didn´t preordered that game.

Huh, well that's what I didn't receive I guess. I preordered it but didn't receive this email. Would have been nice to have known so I could have made my decision.

#44 Knight Captain Morgan

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 05:17 PM

@ OP GUY HUMUAL when Piranha Games said I could have a full refund because they welched on their end of the bargain of a steam key in exchange for my money, I tried to take it. Then they tried to welch on their offer of a refund by claiming, since I preordered more than 6 months ago, I couldn't get a refund in the same way I paid and would have to jump through their additional hoops by setting up a paypal account through which to get a refund. I called them out on their ******** rather vocally through their general forums and was eventually offered a refund through the credit card by which I originally paid.

Bottom line; don't take their ****, call them out on it publicly, after all, they were the ones who publicly advertised preorder steam keys when they knew full well the were going to ditch steam for epic exclusive bull ****.


edit - anti-consumer companies like epic have no reason to oil a wheel until it starts squeaking loudly enough

Edited by Knight Captain Morgan, 18 December 2019 - 05:22 PM.


#45 ingramli

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 06:21 PM

OK, my reply got removed again (2nd time), I merely suggest the OP to go for a charge-back / express his frustration in PGI' twitter, I am not aware that any rule of the forum is violated, it seems the moderator of PGI is trying their best to conceal all the negative things, but i am not going to keep silent unless they got my account banned.

Edited by ingramli, 18 December 2019 - 06:21 PM.


#46 Dee Eight

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 06:41 PM

View Postingramli, on 18 December 2019 - 06:21 PM, said:

OK, my reply got removed again (2nd time), I merely suggest the OP to go for a charge-back / express his frustration in PGI' twitter, I am not aware that any rule of the forum is violated, it seems the moderator of PGI is trying their best to conceal all the negative things, but i am not going to keep silent unless they got my account banned.


That's probably because you continue to advise someone to commit fraud since its now excessively outside the time limit that any bank or credit card company would allow to even attempt a chargeback. If the moderators were trying to conceal negative things they'd have deleted the whole thread, but they haven't so that throws a wrench into that conspiracy theory of yours. But yes, continually trying to circumvent the work of moderators can get you suspended/banned. Also the OP expressing his angst in the twitter won't do anything. PGI has blocked thousands on twitter for far more egregious things they've complained about than not giving a refund to game they gave out nearly twenty thousand refunds on already, months after the time limit they gave for issuing refunds.

#47 ingramli

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 06:49 PM

View PostDee Eight, on 18 December 2019 - 06:41 PM, said:


That's probably because you continue to advise someone to commit fraud since its now excessively outside the time limit that any bank or credit card company would allow to even attempt a chargeback. If the moderators were trying to conceal negative things they'd have deleted the whole thread, but they haven't so that throws a wrench into that conspiracy theory of yours. But yes, continually trying to circumvent the work of moderators can get you suspended/banned. Also the OP expressing his angst in the twitter won't do anything. PGI has blocked thousands on twitter for far more egregious things they've complained about than not giving a refund to game they gave out nearly twenty thousand refunds on already, months after the time limit they gave for issuing refunds.


The refund limit is invalid in fact. You cant enforce something that is not written in the contract at the first place. PGI never mention the game will be launched in Epic Games during the time of pre-order. If PGI want to enforce the one month refund rule, it is their responsibility to PROVE that the customer who make a pre-order does actually received the notification about the intention to make modifications to the sales agreement, AND the customer EXPRESSIVELY MADE A CONSENT to the intended change, otherwise the change itself is invalid. Either PGI needs to release the game on steam as announced during the time of pre-order, or alternatively, the sales agreement itself is void, and PGI needs to refund to the customer. The OP has no obligation to follow the instruction about the platform change and refund arrangement, unless it can be proved that he heard about that, and agreed to the changes.

Edited by ingramli, 18 December 2019 - 06:50 PM.


#48 FRAGTAST1C

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 07:19 PM

View Postingramli, on 18 December 2019 - 06:49 PM, said:

The OP has no obligation to follow the instruction about the platform change and refund arrangement, unless it can be proved that he heard about that, and agreed to the changes.


Like I said, we got an email about the EGS exclusivity and also the option to refund the order WHILE keeping all of the MWO swag, no strings attached. If that email got pushed into your spam folder or if you didn't bother checking the MWO website or any site for that matter, then how is it hard to prove that you've been living under a rock?

If you say that you have no obligation to follow the changes, then take them to court. Clearly you're confident of yourself being right. Clearly.

#49 ingramli

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 07:25 PM

View PostFRAGTAST1C, on 18 December 2019 - 07:19 PM, said:


Like I said, we got an email about the EGS exclusivity and also the option to refund the order WHILE keeping all of the MWO swag, no strings attached. If that email got pushed into your spam folder or if you didn't bother checking the MWO website or any site for that matter, then how is it hard to prove that you've been living under a rock?

If you say that you have no obligation to follow the changes, then take them to court. Clearly you're confident of yourself being right. Clearly.


Court may be the answer. I strongly believe email is not a proper way for a "silent consent" though (As one may not check their email regularly, not an obligation IMO). A registered mail would be the minimum requirement for achieve such silent consent.

#50 FRAGTAST1C

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 07:29 PM

Yes, but make sure you can prove that the specific email wasn't sent to ANYONE.

#51 ingramli

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 07:37 PM

View PostFRAGTAST1C, on 18 December 2019 - 07:29 PM, said:

Yes, but make sure you can prove that the specific email wasn't sent to ANYONE.


As I said, it is PGI' obligations to ensure the receipt of mail of all who made a pre-order, not the customer, because it is PGI who wanted to make the changes. IMO PGI should considered silent as a denial to the changes and proceed to refund, if they cannot ensure everyone who made the pre-order are properly notified of the intended changes.

#52 FRAGTAST1C

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 07:41 PM

View Postingramli, on 18 December 2019 - 07:37 PM, said:

As I said, it is PGI' obligations to ensure the receipt of mail of all who made a pre-order, not the customer, because it is PGI who wanted to make the changes. IMO PGI should considered silent as a denial to the changes and proceed to refund, if they cannot ensure everyone who made the pre-order are properly notified of the intended changes.


As I said, PGI sent the email AND also announced it in multiple avenues. Do you want them to knock on your door like Jehovah's Witness?

#53 MischiefSC

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 07:42 PM

Clearly OP is frustrated. I've dealt with support numerous times and refunded several mech packs and never had an issue. The switch to epic was in gaming news, all over every single channel of communication PGI has. I also got all the emails talking about it.

I don't feel PGI was unreasonable or lacking in diligence in notifying customers of the change nor in how they handled refunds. They did hundreds of them that got discussed here and elsewhere. I get that life stuff happens. It does to all of us.

Also the idea that federal laws related to buyer's remorse and return periods are only enforceable if explicitly restated in the terms is 100% false. The preorder included content for MWO and like any ordered product you have a certain timeframe in which you can cancel the order.

None of which impacts OPs frustration however. Sorry anyone feels burned.

#54 MischiefSC

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 07:47 PM

View Postingramli, on 18 December 2019 - 07:37 PM, said:


As I said, it is PGI' obligations to ensure the receipt of mail of all who made a pre-order, not the customer, because it is PGI who wanted to make the changes. IMO PGI should considered silent as a denial to the changes and proceed to refund, if they cannot ensure everyone who made the pre-order are properly notified of the intended changes.


No. This is 100% false. You may FEEL that way but there's limits to due diligence and reasonable expectation of notification. If, for example, you have a family emergency and are away from home and don't notice a notification of a change in your utility rates you're still responsible for them. If there's changes to a business agreement then there's a reasonable expectation of notification. That's it. It's way less than what PGI did with repeated notifications on every available digital channels plus repeated AMAs.

You're allowed, obviously, to feel however you want about PGI and the situation but to be crystal clear neither PGI nor any other similar business or service is required to ensure receipt of notifications.

#55 ingramli

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 07:49 PM

View PostFRAGTAST1C, on 18 December 2019 - 07:41 PM, said:


As I said, PGI sent the email AND also announced it in multiple avenues. Do you want them to knock on your door like Jehovah's Witness?


Commercial contracts are not to be taken lightly. Like i said registered mail would be a widely accepted way for the notification. If an alternative means must be chosen, wide advertisement on multiple major TV channels, newsapapers, and online media (if appropriate) for a sustained period would be necessary.

To avoid confusion/disputes, silent considered as denial is always the safe move.

#56 FRAGTAST1C

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 07:55 PM

View Postingramli, on 18 December 2019 - 07:49 PM, said:

Commercial contracts are not to be taken lightly. Like i said registered mail would be a widely accepted way for the notification. If an alternative means must be chosen, wide advertisement on multiple major TV channels, newsapapers, and online media (if appropriate) for a sustained period would be necessary.


Again, they sent emails and also posted the notifications on websites.

#57 ingramli

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 08:04 PM

View PostFRAGTAST1C, on 18 December 2019 - 07:55 PM, said:


Again, they sent emails and also posted the notifications on websites.


Just a matter of fact, I dont check mails for months (i use it only when i register in a forum, or make a purchase, so the interval may be months), I also never use discord or AMA, so I am the one to blame?

Edited by ingramli, 18 December 2019 - 08:04 PM.


#58 FRAGTAST1C

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 08:08 PM

View Postingramli, on 18 December 2019 - 08:04 PM, said:

Just a matter of fact, I dont check mails for months (i use it only when i register in a forum, or make a purchase, so the interval may be months, I also never use discord or AMA, so I am the one to blame?


Yes.

Let's take your logic about registered mails and TV channels further. Suppose you say, "I didn't get the mail. The postman must've not delivered them to me. I didn't find out about the announcement 'cause I don't watch TV". Then, you're still to blame.

The fact that PGI sent a mail and also announced it on their website as well as Twitter and EVEN announced it in their AMA proves that they made sure they got their announcement out. Did they announce it when we were still placing pre-orders thinking it was on Steam? No. But they make the announcement and also offered to refund it while allowing us to keep the MWO rewards.

So, you tell me. Do you still want the postman and TV channels when someone can quite as easily say, "Oh, I didn't get any mail and I don't watch TV"?

#59 Vxheous

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 08:09 PM

@OP, just request a credit card chargeback and be done with it.

#60 ingramli

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Posted 18 December 2019 - 08:49 PM

View PostFRAGTAST1C, on 18 December 2019 - 08:08 PM, said:


Yes.

Let's take your logic about registered mails and TV channels further. Suppose you say, "I didn't get the mail. The postman must've not delivered them to me. I didn't find out about the announcement 'cause I don't watch TV". Then, you're still to blame.

The fact that PGI sent a mail and also announced it on their website as well as Twitter and EVEN announced it in their AMA proves that they made sure they got their announcement out. Did they announce it when we were still placing pre-orders thinking it was on Steam? No. But they make the announcement and also offered to refund it while allowing us to keep the MWO rewards.

So, you tell me. Do you still want the postman and TV channels when someone can quite as easily say, "Oh, I didn't get any mail and I don't watch TV"?
To blame or not to blame is to be decided by the judge of the court, not you or me. Having said that, it has better chance for me to be blamed if i missed both registered mail and TV advertisements (It is more reasonable to assume an average Joe to watch TV or receive a registered mail, also, the send of the mail can confirm the receipt through mail tracking).

In addition, even if the customer is out of luck (eg. Working in uniformed service, in a position where internet connection and/or home is unreachable for a certain period of time), even if the company is not obligated by the law to do so, it is still a good idea to entertain the late refund request as a goodwill gesture, for the public image, it does more harm than good being harsh to the customer.

Edited by ingramli, 18 December 2019 - 08:56 PM.






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