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Rapid Fire Review Angry Joe


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#1 Jabilo

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 07:00 AM

https://youtu.be/4jBGA6ou4sg

I do not post this to bash the game, but I think he nailed many of the big problems:

Spawn issues - both placement, number of enemies and unlimited spawns
Economy issues
Team AI
Balance and fun factor

The thing is I believe these things CAN be fixed and the game can rise to be more than the sum of its parts and be good fun.

It just requires PGI to take on board the feedback and react with some patches.

Edited by Jabilo, 30 December 2019 - 07:00 AM.


#2 Void Angel

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 07:27 AM

Did you post this on the MW5 boards, as well?

#3 Five by Five

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 07:44 AM

The unlimited spawns thing is bugging me less and less. Here's why:

Warzone: That is the nature of the mission, it core to the mission type. It's okay.

Demolition: The spawns while you are destroying the objective seem to be tied to the objective %. The unlimited spawns don't seem to start up until the object is destroyed. It's okay.

Raids . . . not sure on this one. I've taken to using a Hero Spider and three heavies or assault. Use the spider to knock out the targets at full speed as fast as you can before the rest of the lance gets too beat-up. I can see the logic of, "it's a raid, you aren't suppose to kill them all", I'm just not sure it's working quite right. I think there were enough enemies spawns on the last one I ran through that it affected their aim.

#4 Void Angel

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 09:25 AM

I'm in Qatar right now, so I haven't been able to actually download and play the game yet - despite having preordered.

But the problem I'm seeing with what was in the review video isn't the number of spawns; instead, it's that they're throwing a bunch of lights at you. I'd expect that to get repetitive, especially while the spawn positions are still right next to the player. It's less interesting to fight enemies that -always- under-ton you, and getting into an attrition war with vast swarms of Light 'mechs isn't my ideal use of time.

If you're starting to treat Raid missions like I used to treat Oblivion gates in Oblivion - I stopped story progress, slogged through the mage guild quests with my fighter character so I could enchant, slapped damage resistance on every piece of gear I could, then sprinted through to the end to close the gate - well... that's indicative of a larger problem.

#5 Sabertooth1966

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 10:02 AM

I tuned him out as soon as he said the game play graphics and affects were poor. The UI and in ship characters defiantly need some love but the environment, maps, effects and general combat, other than some still present spawn issues, are great. Even other reviewers who have had issues with the UI and drop ship things that I have seen have at worst said the actual combat area design, maps and affects were good. Some said they may be a bit dated but still never called them poor or "crap".

#6 Void Angel

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 01:05 PM

Well, he shows a screen where he can't read the letters on his King Crab's foot, so I can see his point there. In any case, he doesn't say they're bad, overall - just "dated," and he thinks they should be better.

#7 Hawk_eye

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 01:32 PM

View PostFive by Five, on 30 December 2019 - 07:44 AM, said:

The unlimited spawns thing is bugging me less and less. Here's why:

Raids . . . not sure on this one. I've taken to using a Hero Spider and three heavies or assault. Use the spider to knock out the targets at full speed as fast as you can before the rest of the lance gets too beat-up. I can see the logic of, "it's a raid, you aren't suppose to kill them all", I'm just not sure it's working quite right. I think there were enough enemies spawns on the last one I ran through that it affected their aim.


I'm not really advanced very far in the game, so perhaps this changes later on, but on difficulty 30 to 40 or so missions, raids don't seem to have unlimited spawns.

Usually, I put my lance-mates on a hill or something, some 600 to 800 meters from the target, run in with a fast mech (got a Wolfhound recently, which is perfect for this) and draw the defenders out.
After finishing all target areas, I often hang around a bit if my lance isn't too beat up and aside from a couple of VTOLs, no new enemies will appear.

Edited by Hawk_eye, 30 December 2019 - 01:34 PM.


#8 Five by Five

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 02:00 PM

View PostHawk_eye, on 30 December 2019 - 01:32 PM, said:

I'm not really advanced very far in the game, so perhaps this changes later on, but on difficulty 30 to 40 or so missions, raids don't seem to have unlimited spawns.


Well according to Russ in this (sorry forgot the timestamp)

Demolition is the only mission type (besides Warzone) that has unlimited spawn, though he does state that higher level difficulty Raids can seem like they have unlimited spawns.

#9 AurioDK

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 04:01 PM

I would gladly pay 100 dollars for Mechwarrior 6 if CD Project Red made it.

#10 50 50

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 04:46 PM

I would disagree with a lot of what he was saying. My experience has been quite different so far but perhaps I am just playing the game differently.
I also have to say that looking at a review by someone called 'Angry Joe' instantly had me thinking he is one of these internet ***** and moan about everything types so that didn't start well.

Not sure why he made a point about the lack of PvP in the game, that was a fact stated right from the outset so just seems misinformed or ignorant where as PGI have stuck to their guns on that one which I am pleased about. I still enjoy MWO for the PvP and I'll enjoy MW5 as a co-op game.

The management of the economics is pretty much the same as it has been in the Battletech game and I would suspect the earlier titles. I've found it consistent and am enjoying that you can struggle with maintaining the mechs and supplies and keeping things operational. If you didn't have these outgoing costs then there is really no point in earning c-bills and that changes the whole purpose of taking the contracts, trying to find equipment on the market and everything else. I actually think it might be a little too easy in this regard and it should be harder to find the components you might need and the costs should be higher. I mean, I'm only paying that Lt Freeman character 12k.

Graphics. Personally I think it looks good. I particularly like the effects of the burning trees and the laser when they rake along the ground and there is more of a neon glow to things on the volcanic map where it's so dark which was visually striking.
Maps are really nice.

I know the spawning issue has been raised and there has been some fixes made. Got to say that I have not really noticed it much as I've been caught up in the heat of combat or rushing to the next objective so not had time to sit on my arse wondering where the next lot of enemies will come from.

For me, I'm enjoying playing co-op through the game.
I tend to never use AI team mates in any game so at the moment it's just been me and one other running in under gunned and under tonnage (sometimes by quite a bit) into the missions which has meant having to make some desperate attacks at objectives and then a mad dash back to the dropship before having the mech shot out from under us.

There would be a few additional features and updates I would like to see added to the game but overall it's a blast.

#11 Suko

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 04:57 PM

His comments about having very few "unique" mission experiences is dead-on. I have to say that this is my biggest issue with MW5. When you think back to MW2, 3, 4 (even Mech Assault), there are unique and memorable missions in each of them that have you doing something more than just "shoot unlimited enemies until mission is complete".

Every single mission is the same. They all feel the same. They need to have some more unique experiences to make this game enjoyable.

#12 Appogee

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 05:11 PM

View PostJabilo, on 30 December 2019 - 07:00 AM, said:

It just requires PGI to take on board the feedback and react with some patches.

Oh well...

#13 50 50

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 05:20 PM

View PostSuko, on 30 December 2019 - 04:57 PM, said:

His comments about having very few "unique" mission experiences is dead-on. I have to say that this is my biggest issue with MW5. When you think back to MW2, 3, 4 (even Mech Assault), there are unique and memorable missions in each of them that have you doing something more than just "shoot unlimited enemies until mission is complete".

Every single mission is the same. They all feel the same. They need to have some more unique experiences to make this game enjoyable.


I don't remember playing MW2, 3 or 4 other than maybe just doing some arena matches for a laugh.
Can you provide some examples for different missions?

#14 Suko

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 05:26 PM

MW2 has a mission (as Clan Wolf) where you have a captured Jade Falcon mech and the mission requires you to enter a heavily guarded base under the guise of one of their own to destroy a specific target building (or vehicle).

Another mission in MW2: Mercs has you ambushing a Ghost Bear facility to capture a Kodiak mech. Once you get it, you feel like a demi-god (after only getting to use IS tech for most of the game up to that point).

Mechwarrior 4 had a ton of dialogue over the missions that really gave you a sense of how your campaign was affecting the story of the entire Inner Sphere. They even had mission(s) where you participated in the Solaris 7 matches during the campaign.

I think it was MW2 had a mission where a friendly mech was severely damaged and you escort a repair team to the mech and then escort said mech out of harms way after repairs were complete.

And one of my favorite mission(s) is in MW2: Mercs, where you first encounter the clans after completing a routine raid mission and get captured. Then, the next mission has you driving a frickin' hover tank during a prison escape and trying to hook up with a friendly drop ship to get the heck out of dodge! (Such a fun campaign).

The list can go on-and-on. Feel free to browse the Wiki's for some of the old games. It'll give you an idea of what is available.

https://www.sarna.ne...Combat#Missions
https://www.sarna.ne..._2:_Mercenaries
https://www.sarna.ne..._4:_Mercenaries

Edited by Suko, 30 December 2019 - 08:03 PM.


#15 50 50

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 06:02 PM

Ah ok, I get the drift of it now. Thanks. Posted Image

#16 FRAGTAST1C

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 07:17 PM

I felt that there was nothing memorable in this game besides shooting things and making them explode. That isn't good for a SP game. I'd give this 6.5/10 or 7/10 when I'm feeling generous. It might look like a solid score but lot of games reach the 70% score mark easily while having nothing in them essentially. So, getting 7/10 isn't actually good for an ambitious developer.

#17 Mumuharra

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Posted 01 January 2020 - 09:47 AM

I think this thread and its posts hit the nail why MW5 feels like a very mediocre game and will not be remembered (well).
Boring repetititiv missions in a non existing campaign and nothing to remember.
What a gem is MWO compared to this game.

#18 Suko

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Posted 01 January 2020 - 08:26 PM

What I don't understand is that they have AI working in this game. Why not offer some convoy escort missions or VIP escort missions (like in MWO). Now, I loathe escort missions in games, but at least it could be another mission type, or maybe even reserve those for the "story" campaign missions so they were a bit unique.

They have all the pieces to the puzzle already there, they just need to put them together in a way that makes things more "fun".

Edited by Suko, 01 January 2020 - 08:32 PM.


#19 HellJumper

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Posted 01 January 2020 - 08:37 PM

View PostSuko, on 30 December 2019 - 05:26 PM, said:

MW2 has a mission (as Clan Wolf) where you have a captured Jade Falcon mech and the mission requires you to enter a heavily guarded base under the guise of one of their own to destroy a specific target building (or vehicle).

Another mission in MW2: Mercs has you ambushing a Ghost Bear facility to capture a Kodiak mech. Once you get it, you feel like a demi-god (after only getting to use IS tech for most of the game up to that point).

Mechwarrior 4 had a ton of dialogue over the missions that really gave you a sense of how your campaign was affecting the story of the entire Inner Sphere. They even had mission(s) where you participated in the Solaris 7 matches during the campaign.

I think it was MW2 had a mission where a friendly mech was severely damaged and you escort a repair team to the mech and then escort said mech out of harms way after repairs were complete.

And one of my favorite mission(s) is in MW2: Mercs, where you first encounter the clans after completing a routine raid mission and get captured. Then, the next mission has you driving a frickin' hover tank during a prison escape and trying to hook up with a friendly drop ship to get the heck out of dodge! (Such a fun campaign).

The list can go on-and-on. Feel free to browse the Wiki's for some of the old games. It'll give you an idea of what is available.

https://www.sarna.ne...Combat#Missions
https://www.sarna.ne..._2:_Mercenaries
https://www.sarna.ne..._4:_Mercenaries


this and many others like this as well..

if i remember correctly in MW4 mercs there was a mission where a high value meeting was going on and you get the choice between the mission to either destroy them to earn more from the other side (you then have to fight against all the defenders alone) or you can help defend them against the raiders...

also those news would keep you kind of updated about the major things happening in IS..

and if i remember correctly MW4 mercs had multiple endings as well depending on which house you had sided with or if you had stayed neutral...

#20 Asmosis

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Posted 01 January 2020 - 09:14 PM

View PostFive by Five, on 30 December 2019 - 07:44 AM, said:

The unlimited spawns thing is bugging me less and less. Here's why:

Demolition: The spawns while you are destroying the objective seem to be tied to the objective %. The unlimited spawns don't seem to start up until the object is destroyed. It's okay.



I'm temporarily stuck on a Demolition match on a 3 part mission, since the waves come in thick and heavy from the start and i'm neck deep in enemy lances by the time I reach 800m from the base.

I don't see it as a problem though, your sieging a city. I expect w/e defense force the planet has is going to send everything they've got until the threat (me) is either neutralized or gone.

It also keeps the game challenging. You can't simply setup a safe zone, pick off the defenders one by one then waltz in and wreck the place at your leisure. It keeps the pressure on, Kinda like how Xcom2 has you racing against the clock to complete missions so you don't just do the same thing.

Mission variety is a bit annoying, but you have to realise their experience is with MWO and how players play that (mostly by ignoring w/e the objective is and shooting everything that moves, and also everything that doesnt). There's only so many variations of "go and shoot xxx thing" you can do. A few rescue/recon type objectives would be nice though.

Edited by Asmosis, 01 January 2020 - 09:52 PM.






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