27 replies to this topic

[Reposter]

Hi guys just wondering how does the Match Maker system for MWO work now?

Are the Mech Chassis suppose to be a Mirror matchup, meaning Team A and Team B are suppose to have the same number of Weight Class, for example Team A has 3 Lights, 3 Mediums, 4 Heavy and 2 Assaults, Team B would have a Mirror of Team A as well.

[martian]

Reposter, on 28 July 2020 - 09:30 AM, said:

Hi guys just wondering how does the Match Maker system for MWO work now?

Are the Mech Chassis suppose to be a Mirror matchup, meaning Team A and Team B are suppose to have the same number of Weight Class, for example Team A has 3 Lights, 3 Mediums, 4 Heavy and 2 Assaults, Team B would have a Mirror of Team A as well.

No, there is no mirror match-up. It is completely random.

To put it simply, one team can have four Assaults and the other team can have none.

[GARION26]

It's buried in some of the announcement threads but to my understanding in descending order of priority

Criteria 1 - match equal numbers of grouped players on both sides
Criteria 2 - PSR matching
Criteria 3 - match by weight class

Because the first two criteria are prioritized higher weird things happen on criteria 3.

[Reposter]

Is it a good thing to not match by Weight Class? Are there imbalances?

[martian]

Reposter, on 28 July 2020 - 09:58 AM, said:

Is it a good thing to not match by Weight Class? Are there imbalances?

Expect your games to look like this:

My team
525 tons, 0 Assault 'Mechs

The enemy team
770 tons, 3 Assault 'Mechs (Fafnir, Mad Cat Mk. II, Marauder II)

Yes, Russ Bullock would probably call it "a small imbalance". Just 245 tons difference between both teams.




Have "fun".

[Willard Phule]

GARION26, on 28 July 2020 - 09:38 AM, said:

It's buried in some of the announcement threads but to my understanding in descending order of priority

Criteria 1 - match equal numbers of grouped players on both sides
Criteria 2 - PSR matching
Criteria 3 - match by weight class

Because the first two criteria are prioritized higher weird things happen on criteria 3.

Also, and this is important, premade groups aren't even considered for weight class matching. The MM is incapable of that. So, if the premade 4 man in your group drops with lights, you might be stuck with 8 lights on your team. Same with Assaults.

[OneTeamPlayer]

Reposter, on 28 July 2020 - 09:30 AM, said:

Hi guys just wondering how does the Match Maker system for MWO work now?

It doesn't. It was modified from a mostly functional system that placed solo players well to a system that tosses groups in and then fills essentially randomly with no regard to tonnage or enjoyable play.

This change was made to appease a fractional segment of the population (groups) at the expense of the most populated segment of the population (solo queue players) despite the fact that they had two separate queues of their own that they murdered.

[VonBruinwald]

How many matched matches would the matchmaker match if the matchmaker could match matches?

[JediPanther]

It slams 24 players into a match. That's how it works now. Or have you not seen the molten metal video going around with ten assaults on one side?

[GARION26]

Willard Phule, on 28 July 2020 - 10:31 AM, said:

Also, and this is important, premade groups aren't even considered for weight class matching. The MM is incapable of that. So, if the premade 4 man in your group drops with lights, you might be stuck with 8 lights on your team. Same with Assaults.

Are you sure? I thought that finding was because tonnage slots are the lowest criteria rather then an artifact of group vs non group.
There isn't a reason the groups tonnage couldn't be included in the tonnage criteria. Groups are the first thing balanced so it's they are the players 'set' in the drop first.

[Aidan Crenshaw]

Willard is assuming, of course, as is anyone when it comes to the details of the matchmaking process. It's just serving their negative perspective.

[Brauer]

GARION26, on 29 July 2020 - 05:59 AM, said:

Are you sure? I thought that finding was because tonnage slots are the lowest criteria rather then an artifact of group vs non group.
There isn't a reason the groups tonnage couldn't be included in the tonnage criteria. Groups are the first thing balanced so it's they are the players 'set' in the drop first.

Groups are balanced, as far as we know, just based on the number of players in groups on each side and (possibly) group tier. Tonnage really doesn't factor into it. Weight class balancing went completely out the window when groups were introduced. Sure, the matchmaker may be able to prioritize weight class balancing more, but it's also pretty clear that there isn't much of a way to balance group tonnage with the system as is.

[Willard Phule]

GARION26, on 29 July 2020 - 05:59 AM, said:

Are you sure? I thought that finding was because tonnage slots are the lowest criteria rather then an artifact of group vs non group.
There isn't a reason the groups tonnage couldn't be included in the tonnage criteria. Groups are the first thing balanced so it's they are the players 'set' in the drop first.

Except "balancing" of groups amounts to making sure that both sides have one if more than one is available. It doesn't do squat about the weight of the mechs they're using.

[Knight Captain Morgan]

Matchmaker takes a group, then provides said group with live targets ignoring weight and talent.

[C E Dwyer]

match maker picks a card puts it back in the back, forgets what the card is then, throws them at the wall and hopes for the best.

[BTGbullseye]

C E Dwyer, on 29 July 2020 - 12:55 PM, said:

match maker picks a card puts it back in the back, forgets what the card is then, throws them at the wall and hopes for the best.

That's a little off...

It's basically the same, just without the cards.

[Howitzer 108]

Personally, i dont have any issues with how matchmaker is working. I think the biggest issue is allowing 3 and 4 man teams to drop light. There should be a minimum tonnage requirement for those teams so that they don't wildly tilt the MM system. Sorry, but as much fun as it is to watch 8 lights run amok, I rarely see those matches go well. Wouldnt be such a huge issue if the 4 man team had to at least hit 240 tons as a group.

[Blind Baku]

Howitzer 108, on 17 September 2020 - 06:49 PM, said:

Personally, i dont have any issues with how matchmaker is working. I think the biggest issue is allowing 3 and 4 man teams to drop light. There should be a minimum tonnage requirement for those teams so that they don't wildly tilt the MM system. Sorry, but as much fun as it is to watch 8 lights run amok, I rarely see those matches go well. Wouldnt be such a huge issue if the 4 man team had to at least hit 240 tons as a group.

As much as I do like playing the light, this is almost an acceptable solution for me... It's so rough with the tonnage.

Also obligatory "it doesn't work" comment...

[MrMadguy]

Reposter, on 28 July 2020 - 09:30 AM, said:

Hi guys just wondering how does the Match Maker system for MWO work now?

Are the Mech Chassis suppose to be a Mirror matchup, meaning Team A and Team B are suppose to have the same number of Weight Class, for example Team A has 3 Lights, 3 Mediums, 4 Heavy and 2 Assaults, Team B would have a Mirror of Team A as well.

Ability to win doesn't depend on Weight Class. And PSR takes this ability into account, no matter what weight class you play. You may be pro player in Light and you may be noob player in Assault. Therefore it's better to balance SKILLS, than WEIGHTS. It was implementation of forced 4x3, that ruined balance of matches at some point and caused so many stomps. And today if some team has skill advantage, at least it can be offset by weight advantage for other team.

Most problems are caused by groups, that have higher PSR, but can't be split to balance teams. Their skill should be offset by weight advantage for other team.

And another thing. Reversed balance. Majority of Assaults are just big slow target dummies with low wide hardpoints. Even Mediums have enough firepower to two-shot their STs. This problem is especially bad for IS Assaults, that constantly suffer from XL ST-death penalty. There are very few truly deadly Assaults. Annihilator, Dire Wolf, Kodiak, Blood Asp. But I see them in my matches very rarely. And, I guess, that's exactly because player, who play them, have much higher PSR, so I just isn't matched with/against them.

So, don't to find problems somewhere outside. If you lose - it's just because you're bad pilot, not due to some weight imbalance.

Because overall I see better match balance today. Stomps happen. But when they happen, I don't feel, that I'm stomped, because it's not deathball stomps, i.e. they don't happen so fast, so at least I have some time to actually "play" the game and therefore be satisfied by match results. And not 100% matches are stomps, as it was prior to implementation of new PSR. Many matches are even and balanced.

Edited by MrMadguy, 17 September 2020 - 08:29 PM.

[Willard Phule]

GARION26, on 29 July 2020 - 05:59 AM, said:

Are you sure? I thought that finding was because tonnage slots are the lowest criteria rather then an artifact of group vs non group.
There isn't a reason the groups tonnage couldn't be included in the tonnage criteria. Groups are the first thing balanced so it's they are the players 'set' in the drop first.

Aidan Crenshaw, on 29 July 2020 - 06:20 AM, said:

Willard is assuming, of course, as is anyone when it comes to the details of the matchmaking process. It's just serving their negative perspective.

Pretty sure the description came out in the patch notes when they added groups to QP.

The Group queue had it's own parameters....a 4 man couldn't drop with 4 assaults, they had a tonnage limit involved. That transferred over to QP. That being said, those parameters aren't used in any way to determine the other 8 guys on a side.

That part is subject to population, events, etc. Even then, the whole thing is supposed to be limited by a +/- 1 Tier limit when putting together matches. IE: T1s shouldn't drop with brand new, T3 Cadets. But, if the MM is putting together a T2 match, then both T1s and T3s become fair game ( makes you wonder why PGI decided to start new players out in the middle instead of T5 where they're safe from T2s and T1s, but that's what "features" are all about).

Prove me wrong.