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Analyzing Match. Cheats? Or Sh*tty Netcode?

Gameplay General Balance

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#1 uwuziel

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Posted 19 December 2020 - 09:47 PM

https://youtu.be/Cw-6fRBuEx8

To summarize if you dont feel like clicking;
I was in a solaris match facing 'arabidhamster,' His Victor VS my Piranha. He spotted me, took a shot and missed...But it didnt miss?? The AC20 went over my mech and to my left. Missed my a mile (god bless you speed tweak) but then outta nowhere my right leg goes red. My only assumption is that the shot hit. But it didnt?? It missed? But it hit????? Not 20 seconds later the same thing happens. He fires a shot at a steep angle, and this time I dont even see where it flys! And it hits my RL again. I was in a match with him before and ive seen him around for a while. I know hes at least good at the game but this??

I think his scorecard shows hes got a 30/2 W/L ratio or something. If anyone can back him up cool. I'm not upset he hit, im upset the game told me he missed. I find it funny there isnt a "bug report" tag or forum topic...





unless he was cheating after all in which case bro imagine dropping 4.99 a month to cheat in MWO Solaris. But hey. im open minded. I dont would like to think no one is THAT sad.

#2 Nightbird

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Posted 19 December 2020 - 09:59 PM

All damage in game is based on where the shooter sees you. In a fast mech with 120ms total ping difference, it will appears that all shots miss you from your angle.

#3 uwuziel

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Posted 19 December 2020 - 10:12 PM

View PostNightbird, on 19 December 2020 - 09:59 PM, said:

All damage in game is based on where the shooter sees you. In a fast mech with 120ms total ping difference, it will appears that all shots miss you from your angle.



damn

#4 GuardDogg

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Posted 19 December 2020 - 10:22 PM

Notice lag helped on that. He shot you way before you seen the shot. That is how some are able to make it to T1. When you fire, and other mech is not taking damage.

#5 Elizander

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Posted 19 December 2020 - 10:37 PM

The game is calculated server side so it helps that the game is 'slow' to give time for the data to reach the server and be calculated. This wouldn't work at all in a twitch-based shooter because the illusion of a stable connection and responsiveness would be broken instantly.

There are times when I peek then take massive CT damage, but I play on 250-300ms so it's just something I roll with. On the plus side, I shot two gauss on a close-range strafing Stormcrow and I shot way ahead of its nose. The crosshairs didn't turn red to indicate a hit, but about 0.25-0.30 second later the Stormcrow keeled over and I got the kill. :P

#6 w0qj

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Posted 19 December 2020 - 11:05 PM

Sounds like Asia-based players are at a (ping) disadvantage then :(

View PostGuardDogg, on 19 December 2020 - 10:22 PM, said:

Notice lag helped on that. He shot you way before you seen the shot. That is how some are able to make it to T1. When you fire, and other mech is not taking damage.

View PostElizander, on 19 December 2020 - 10:37 PM, said:

The game is calculated server side so it helps that the game is 'slow' to give time for the data to reach the server and be calculated. This wouldn't work at all in a twitch-based shooter because the illusion of a stable connection and responsiveness would be broken instantly.

There are times when I peek then take massive CT damage, but I play on 250-300ms so it's just something I roll with. On the plus side, I shot two gauss on a close-range strafing Stormcrow and I shot way ahead of its nose. The crosshairs didn't turn red to indicate a hit, but about 0.25-0.30 second later the Stormcrow keeled over and I got the kill. Posted Image


#7 LordNothing

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Posted 20 December 2020 - 03:18 AM

the secret of the games industry is that all netcode sucks. until we get ftl networking (its on the list labeled 'things that will never happen') its going to stay that way. my game figured it out one way, your game figures it out a different way, both go to the server with timestamps, it rewinds time to see what actually happened and it may be completely different from what either player saw.

#8 Monkey Lover

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Posted 20 December 2020 - 02:25 PM

View Postw0qj, on 19 December 2020 - 11:05 PM, said:

Sounds like Asia-based players are at a (ping) disadvantage then Posted Image


Not that i have seen once they start warping you can't hit them.

#9 General Solo

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Posted 21 December 2020 - 09:12 AM

Its like match maker, the netcode is set and forget
PGI do not have the skills to do anything with it
They are an Arthouse dev, drag and drop type dev

They buy a game engine and can work the buttons
Beyond that is beyond them

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 21 December 2020 - 09:12 AM.


#10 General Solo

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Posted 21 December 2020 - 09:43 AM

View Postuwuziel, on 19 December 2020 - 09:47 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/Cw-6fRBuEx8

To summarize if you dont feel like clicking;
I was in a solaris match facing 'arabidhamster,' His Victor VS my Piranha. He spotted me, took a shot and missed...But it didnt miss?? The AC20 went over my mech and to my left. Missed my a mile (god bless you speed tweak) but then outta nowhere my right leg goes red. My only assumption is that the shot hit. But it didnt?? It missed? But it hit????? Not 20 seconds later the same thing happens. He fires a shot at a steep angle, and this time I dont even see where it flys! And it hits my RL again. I was in a match with him before and ive seen him around for a while. I know hes at least good at the game but this??

I think his scorecard shows hes got a 30/2 W/L ratio or something. If anyone can back him up cool. I'm not upset he hit, im upset the game told me he missed. I find it funny there isnt a "bug report" tag or forum topic...





unless he was cheating after all in which case bro imagine dropping 4.99 a month to cheat in MWO Solaris. But hey. im open minded. I dont would like to think no one is THAT sad.


The view on your screen is delayed and not in perfect sync with the server
I have the same issues
Closer the range the worse it is

Like me, you can forget about competitive any thing with those net issues
Unbelievably their was a time when it just worked
Then they changed data centre and general neglect while monetizing mech packs till the game sinks

Games in maintenance I doubt anything will improve

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 21 December 2020 - 09:47 AM.


#11 RickySpanish

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Posted 21 December 2020 - 11:11 AM

ITT: people who don't understand that PGI cannot change the speed of light. Sorry folks this isn't "sh*tty netcode", it's just reality that data is not transmitted immediately, and that's before we even consider computation. The guy with the AC 20 was aiming and firing at where OP was on his screen, but by the time that action reached OP's client, OP was already in a different position.

#12 VonBruinwald

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Posted 21 December 2020 - 12:07 PM

View PostLordNothing, on 20 December 2020 - 03:18 AM, said:

the secret of the games industry is that all netcode sucks. until we get ftl networking (its on the list labeled 'things that will never happen') its going to stay that way.


I don't think ftl will make a difference. All it will do is allow devs to get lazier, resulting in poorer optimisation.

#13 LordNothing

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Posted 21 December 2020 - 08:23 PM

View PostVonBruinwald, on 21 December 2020 - 12:07 PM, said:


I don't think ftl will make a difference. All it will do is allow devs to get lazier, resulting in poorer optimisation.


give somone a computer thats twice as fast, and they will find a way to lose half their performance.

#14 General Solo

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Posted 21 December 2020 - 10:26 PM

View PostRickySpanish, on 21 December 2020 - 11:11 AM, said:

ITT: people who don't understand that PGI cannot change the speed of light. Sorry folks this isn't "sh*tty netcode", it's just reality that data is not transmitted immediately, and that's before we even consider computation. The guy with the AC 20 was aiming and firing at where OP was on his screen, but by the time that action reached OP's client, OP was already in a different position.


Dude stop shilling or is that your honest opinion?
Just coz you don't have the problems don't mean they don't exist
Do you live on the same continent as the server?

People complain and your counter
To protect PGI's feelingz I guess as I can't see your point or anything good coming out of it.

Recent Same Ole


Old Same ole


Games FINE!
Guess thats why is population is so big
More Wrong Posted Image

#15 General Solo

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Posted 21 December 2020 - 10:39 PM

To add the net code has been neglected like match maker

The game is simply programmed to not show rubber banding anymore, its not fixed.
Thats why hit reg seems bad, the target on your screen is not synced to the server.
If the hidden rubberbanding is too bad it disconnects the client. NOT FIXED, HIDDEN

Like match maker HSR needs regular monitoring and tuning to keep it functional within parameters.
Instead PGI monitors mech pack sales and not much else.

I'm not saying PGI are totally bad, after all the game has lasted a long time.
Jjust that they PGI have made some dumb decisions and are now paying the price.

But hey its PGI's game they will do what they will.

But other forum users making like the game has no netcode iusses, that their is not room for improvement for netcode over less than perfect connections is bollocks and I have to say so.

I wouldn't want other forum users to believe that to be true.

#16 Quicksilver Kalasa

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Posted 22 December 2020 - 09:11 AM

View PostVonBruinwald, on 21 December 2020 - 12:07 PM, said:


I don't think ftl will make a difference. All it will do is allow devs to get lazier, resulting in poorer optimisation.

:wat: this legitimately doesn't make sense.

View PostOZHomerOZ, on 21 December 2020 - 10:39 PM, said:

To add the net code has been neglected like match maker

The game is simply programmed to not show rubber banding anymore, its not fixed.
Thats why hit reg seems bad, the target on your screen is not synced to the server.
If the hidden rubberbanding is too bad it disconnects the client. NOT FIXED, HIDDEN

They don't hide rubberbanding, the game CANNOT look into the future to show you where the enemy will be once they react to your movement. The best it can do is go back in time according to your average latency and do what it does and "rewind" the state of the game and adjust accordingly. Not saying there isn't room for improvement because other games handle this better (looking at you Overwatch) and something still feels wonky about laser hit reg but it is still better than without HSR. I don't miss those days.

#17 General Solo

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Posted 23 December 2020 - 05:13 AM

Thats all I'm saying, their room for improvement and thank you for the Over watch example.

I will have to try it out

So you know I was a tiny tiny tiny bit ranty.

Changing the Driver has improved my outlooks

https://mwomercs.com...36#entry6366036

Case closed

#18 Gagis

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Posted 23 December 2020 - 05:28 AM

The netcode is actually pretty good.

But absolutely no netcode can fix high latency. Theres only so much you can do if people are connecting to same match from different continents.

But thats not a netcode problem. Thats a geography problem.

#19 General Solo

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Posted 23 December 2020 - 09:09 AM

Was a driver problem Posted Image

#20 Sergeant Destroy

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Posted 23 December 2020 - 11:17 AM

View PostOZHomerOZ, on 23 December 2020 - 09:09 AM, said:

Was a driver problem Posted Image


Still has packet loss written all over it, even connecting to a wlan access point through 2 walls full of lead paint sounds more reasonable. But hey, its not stupid if it works... i guess
Enjoy it while it lasts..

Edited by Sergeant Destroy, 23 December 2020 - 11:26 AM.






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