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Can't Scrub Up With Ppcs...


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#1 account redo v1

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 05:01 PM

https://youtu.be/4N91fk-RN1Y?t=438

The match ended in 3 minutes and 21 seconds. My only concern is that I run this mech:
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More to the point: If I landed every single shot, I'd get 90*3 = 270 damage. With match score being the way it is, it means that the mech build would likely not be viable. Now, I don't think I've ever had a match that short, but it's concerning. I'd like some sort of bonus to match score for landing high damage shots with ppcs to offset this. Not sure how to implement it, so I can't make a detailed suggestion in the suggestion forum, but that's my take anyways.

I know, the vaper eagle is a thing, I'm saving up for one, but I like this sort of gameplay. Maybe I could go for headshots?

Edited by account redo v1, 08 January 2021 - 05:05 PM.


#2 FupDup

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 05:10 PM

This build's lack of viability has nothing to do with match score. Double Clan ERPPCs is very good and legit on several mechs up to 70 tons (Summoner).

The problems with your Viper are:

1. Trying to run double ERPPCs with just your base 10 DHS. You have to spend too much time cooling off between shots to keep applying consistent damage (the key to getting high scores with dual CERPPC builds because the initial alpha strike is fairly low).

2. Speaking of heat, investing heavily in the firepower tree to grab full Heat Gen is basically mandatory because of your damage output being heavily limited by your heat output. The Jump Jet tree is basically useless, especially more so for this mech because mediums have the best JJs of any weight class and the Viper has 8 of them hardwired to the chassis.

3. Stripped armor on a mech that is fragile even with full armor.

Basically, the Viper just isn't equipped for this job. Mechs that fit this playstyle more effectively are the Adder, Huntsman, Hunchback IIC, Nova, Linebacker, and Summoner. Or I guess Vapor Eagle works too but a simple 2 CERPC setup is a tad underkill relative to its maximum potential.

Edited by FupDup, 08 January 2021 - 05:25 PM.


#3 account redo v1

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 05:48 PM

View PostFupDup, on 08 January 2021 - 05:10 PM, said:

This build's lack of viability has nothing to do with match score. Double Clan ERPPCs is very good and legit on several mechs up to 70 tons (Summoner).

The problems with your Viper are:

1. Trying to run double ERPPCs with just your base 10 DHS. You have to spend too much time cooling off between shots to keep applying consistent damage (the key to getting high scores with dual CERPPC builds because the initial alpha strike is fairly low).

2. Speaking of heat, investing heavily in the firepower tree to grab full Heat Gen is basically mandatory because of your damage output being heavily limited by your heat output. The Jump Jet tree is basically useless, especially more so for this mech because mediums have the best JJs of any weight class and the Viper has 8 of them hardwired to the chassis.

3. Stripped armor on a mech that is fragile even with full armor.

Basically, the Viper just isn't equipped for this job. Mechs that fit this playstyle more effectively are the Adder, Huntsman, Hunchback IIC, Nova, Linebacker, and Summoner. Or I guess Vapor Eagle works too but a simple 2 CERPC setup is a tad underkill relative to its maximum potential.


For tier 2+, this sentiment is understandable to me, but I'm just trying to have fun. I shouldn't have to slave to a meta that much (imo) for tier 3. If it didn't take so much longer to join a match at tier 5, I wouldn't care about rank at all.

#4 BlaizerP

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 05:52 PM

"Slave to the meta"

Dude, not every mech can run every load-out and do well.

Run a Huntsman or Nova if you want to play a PPC clan medium that isn't the Veagle.

#5 account redo v1

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 05:55 PM

View PostBlaizerP, on 08 January 2021 - 05:52 PM, said:

"Slave to the meta"

Dude, not every mech can run every load-out and do well.

Run a Huntsman or Nova if you want to play a PPC clan medium that isn't the Veagle.


https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6363930

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What worries me is 3 minute matches.

I like to jump high, run fast, and shoot far... in that build most of all.

My current solution is farm psr, then play with this using the buffer psr. But I'd like it if I didn't have to do that as much for tier 3.

Edited by account redo v1, 08 January 2021 - 05:59 PM.


#6 JediPanther

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 06:01 PM

Your first 75 points for a clanker esp one with the hottest weapons in the game should always Go to fire power for heat gen and cool down and into mech ops for cool run and heat containment. If you really want to go only ppc get the panther with 40% velocity. Use the 75 points as you should and use the left over points for armor. 55 fire power and 20-ish into mech ops then armor.

#7 account redo v1

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 06:25 PM

View PostJediPanther, on 08 January 2021 - 06:01 PM, said:

Your first 75 points for a clanker esp one with the hottest weapons in the game should always Go to fire power for heat gen and cool down and into mech ops for cool run and heat containment. If you really want to go only ppc get the panther with 40% velocity. Use the 75 points as you should and use the left over points for armor. 55 fire power and 20-ish into mech ops then armor.


It's too slow for me and doesn't jump high enough (jump jet height is like dakka in a way for me).

Thought of a Targeting Computer Mark 8 build for the fastest erppcs ever, but :/

Edited by account redo v1, 08 January 2021 - 06:26 PM.


#8 FupDup

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 06:43 PM

View Postaccount redo v1, on 08 January 2021 - 05:48 PM, said:

For tier 2+, this sentiment is understandable to me, but I'm just trying to have fun. I shouldn't have to slave to a meta that much (imo) for tier 3. If it didn't take so much longer to join a match at tier 5, I wouldn't care about rank at all.

The tier system doesn't really work very well because it was built with an upward bias that pushes people up as long as they do okay in each match. There's still plenty of derpiness at the top.

Anyways, it's not about being a meta slave so much as picking something that is at least kinda sorta decent at the job you want to do. Something like the Adder for example is sure as heck not meta in any loadout but it can handle dual ERPPCs decently.

You can be practical without being meta.

Edited by FupDup, 08 January 2021 - 06:44 PM.


#9 account redo v1

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 06:46 PM

View PostFupDup, on 08 January 2021 - 06:43 PM, said:

The tier system doesn't really work very well because it was built with an upward bias that pushes people up as long as they do okay in each match. There's still plenty of derpiness at the top.

Anyways, it's not about being a meta slave so much as picking something that is at least kinda sorta decent at the job you want to do. Something like the Adder for example is sure as heck not meta in any loadout but it can handle dual ERPPCs decently.

You can be practical without being meta.


If the match length goes down to 3 minutes reliably it may be a problem. As you can see by the screenshots, I can handle the current match lengths (though not always). I'd just like a bit more psr for using ppcs.

#10 FupDup

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 06:57 PM

View Postaccount redo v1, on 08 January 2021 - 06:46 PM, said:

If the match length goes down to 3 minutes reliably it may be a problem. As you can see by the screenshots, I can handle the current match lengths (though not always). I'd just like a bit more psr for using ppcs.

In really short matches it's harder for anybody to make good bank, not just ERPPC Vipers.

In your case you do have the mobility to engage very early but that mech sacrifices precious time ventilating heat (hence my recommendation for better heat efficiency, so you can keep shooting more and thus do more damage in the same time frame).

#11 Quicksilver Kalasa

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 07:24 PM

So let's get this straight, you want a bigger reward for doing things with a fun mech? Or do you think that you should get more points for doing concentrated damage (not this mech is really known for that). TBH, the more you try to quantify a person's performance the more problems you end up creating rather than just rewarding simple things like wins, kills, and assists.

#12 account redo v1

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 07:40 PM

View PostQuicksilver Kalasa, on 08 January 2021 - 07:24 PM, said:

So let's get this straight, you want a bigger reward for doing things with a fun mech? Or do you think that you should get more points for doing concentrated damage (not this mech is really known for that). TBH, the more you try to quantify a person's performance the more problems you end up creating rather than just rewarding simple things like wins, kills, and assists.


I don't think I need much in the way of extra cbills for it, but I'd like to not lose psr.

Basically, if you hit with ppcs and deal at least 15 points of damage, give +1000 cbills and some match score, can't occur more than once every so often (maybe 15 seconds at least). Extra points for disabling ecm/stealth perhaps.

#13 LordNothing

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 07:40 PM

so you stripped all your armor and then tried to compensate by getting all the survivability nodes? yea that will work great. totally legit.

fiy the viper is more of a close in knife fighter with small and micro lasers. run it like your typical back stabby light and you will do well. it however does not have enough free tonnage to be a dual ppc boat. you were looking for the veagle, or the scat if you are one of THOSE kind of players.

Edited by LordNothing, 08 January 2021 - 07:43 PM.


#14 account redo v1

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 07:41 PM

View PostLordNothing, on 08 January 2021 - 07:40 PM, said:

so you stripped all your armor and then tried to compensate by getting all the survivability nodes? yea that will work great. totally legit.


See attached screenshots listed above. I've taken more damage in some cases too. Range + Survivability gives survivability a bit of an amplifier (coupled with peeking weapons like ppcs and poptarting options).

Posted Image

Though, in fairness, I painted it battleship grey after getting the color for free.

Also, I rearranged nodes a little (no artillery nodes) to get 100% radar deprivation.

Vaper eagle and S.Cat are too slow and don't jump high enough. Masc is one more thing to keep track of. I'd prefer not to have to do that. Not fun for me.

Edited by account redo v1, 08 January 2021 - 08:05 PM.


#15 LordNothing

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 08:11 PM

View Postaccount redo v1, on 08 January 2021 - 07:41 PM, said:


See attached screenshots listed above. I've taken more damage in some cases too. Range + Survivability gives survivability a bit of an amplifier (coupled with peeking weapons like ppcs and poptarting options).

Posted Image

Though, in fairness, I painted it battleship grey after getting the color for free.

Also, I rearranged nodes a little (no artillery nodes) to get 100% radar deprivation.


thats about the scores id expect from that build though, running as a ranged camper with an emphasis on survival at moderate skill. if you are going to strip the armor you would be better off with the scat, and if you want to poptart go with the veagle (that thing has jj quirks and is one of the best jumpers in the game). if you build mechs to their strengths then you would get better scores, easily done without going full meta. of course i have a huge number of mechs so i have less opportunities to try and put square pegs in round holes.

battleship grey, heh, thats what i picked. i needed a shade of grey between jaguar black 2 and i think wolf grey.

#16 Snowhawk

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 10:46 PM

View Postaccount redo v1, on 08 January 2021 - 05:55 PM, said:




I like to jump high, run fast, and shoot far... in that build most of all.



Did you ever hear about the shadow cat? Jump Jets, Ecm and high mounted weapons and last but not least.... Masc!

#17 account redo v1

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 11:30 PM

View PostSnowhawk, on 08 January 2021 - 10:46 PM, said:


Did you ever hear about the shadow cat? Jump Jets, Ecm and high mounted weapons and last but not least.... Masc!


View Postaccount redo v1, on 08 January 2021 - 07:41 PM, said:

Vaper eagle and S.Cat are too slow and don't jump high enough. Masc is one more thing to keep track of. I'd prefer not to have to do that. Not fun for me.


As per earlier response. Also, viper-b has +10% range, +30% ppc velocity.

It's not that I want super high scores, I just don't want to have to wait a long time to join a match. If decreasing match lengths becomes a problem, that's troubling. Survival isn't always an issue, shorter matches might be. But it's not impossible to accommodate because of psr farming as an option for me. I'd just like to have to farm psr less.

Edited by account redo v1, 08 January 2021 - 11:32 PM.


#18 Elizander

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 11:47 PM

The OP has a post history of being very stubborn about things and wanting things done his own way. Advice given here may be falling on deaf ears.

#19 J O K E R

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 11:56 PM

View Postaccount redo v1, on 08 January 2021 - 11:30 PM, said:

It's not that I want super high scores, I just don't want to have to wait a long time to join a match. If decreasing match lengths becomes a problem, that's troubling. Survival isn't always an issue, shorter matches might be. But it's not impossible to accommodate because of psr farming as an option for me. I'd just like to have to farm psr less.


what is the problem? you want to keep playing a bad mech/build and enjoy doing it, you should be trying to lower your psr, not "farm" it to have better matches

#20 cougurt

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Posted 09 January 2021 - 02:42 AM

View Postaccount redo v1, on 08 January 2021 - 11:30 PM, said:

As per earlier response. Also, viper-b has +10% range, +30% ppc velocity.

It's not that I want super high scores, I just don't want to have to wait a long time to join a match. If decreasing match lengths becomes a problem, that's troubling. Survival isn't always an issue, shorter matches might be. But it's not impossible to accommodate because of psr farming as an option for me. I'd just like to have to farm psr less.

play a more effective mech if you're concerned about your PSR. if not, then just continue having fun and don't sweat it. if you want something similar but a bit more sane, the shadow cat would be your best bet.





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