124 replies to this topic

[Tier5 Kerensky]

Just wondering why. People advance for some point, but then they don't even poke.

[martian]

Tier5 Kerensky, on 01 June 2021 - 08:27 AM, said:

Just wondering why. People advance for some point, but then they don't even poke.

It is simple: The latest patches made many weapons more destructive, while keeping the amount of armor of 'Mechs unchanged. Thus, everybody is afraid of being hit.

Edited by martian, 01 June 2021 - 08:30 AM.

[Tier5 Kerensky]

Well, this sounds plausible.

[Trontastic1]

I've noticed this happening more as well since I returned to MWO in April.

It can be frustrating to see assault mechs pilots just standing and afraid to move forward, but on the flip side when I run a assault mech with max armor, it can get chewed to pieces in the matter of seconds. I really can't blame players for being hesitant to charge in and engage.

[Nightbird]

Sounds good to me, this gives the flank more time to get damage and kills.

[Khobai]

martian, on 01 June 2021 - 08:29 AM, said:

It is simple: The latest patches made many weapons more destructive, while keeping the amount of armor of 'Mechs unchanged. Thus, everybody is afraid of being hit.

its this exactly

lethality has gone up while survivability has stayed the same

theres so many builds now that can just alpha you for like 60-75 damage.

Trontastic1, on 01 June 2021 - 09:56 AM, said:

I've noticed this happening more as well since I returned to MWO in April.

It can be frustrating to see assault mechs pilots just standing and afraid to move forward, but on the flip side when I run a assault mech with max armor, it can get chewed to pieces in the matter of seconds. I really can't blame players for being hesitant to charge in and engage.

can you blame them when most assaults are bad at poking, slow, and have massively huge hit boxes?

assaults are supposed to be the tankiest mechs in the game, but arnt really. their massive hitboxes are completely counterintuitive to them being tanky.

its better to just play the waiting game as an assault and only push when youre either ahead on kills or theres a clear opportunity to push like when half the enemy team is out of position. the problem is when the rest of your team gets themselves killed in the meantime while youre waiting for the perfect moment to push.

Edited by Khobai, 01 June 2021 - 10:21 AM.

[MrTBSC]

i would be carefull to not buff assaultarmor too much for lightmechs to be able to do too little damage..

Chassisrescale may help with assaults maybe being hit less often aswell as further mobilitybuffs ...

[Brom96]

You cannot even flank. Most of the enemy team just run you down, leaving 2 of their number to hold the rest of your team who is afraid to push. Then they go back and finish those off.

But then, if you stand whit your assaults you will never get enough points to keep your ratings up. This way you actually have chance to deal more 150 or so damage per game.

[Leone]

Incorrect. I've run plenty of flanks even in heavies. The problem is I tend to build brawlers, so if neither team is really engaged I just sit there, on the flank looking at the enemy team trying to decide who to pounce on knowing the rest of their team'll turn and take me out. ~200 damage and a solo kill is apparently not enough to maintain PSR. Which I could care less about.

Though I do kinda feel bad about running around in a light flanker on the lower tiers from time to time. Fighting a pilot who knows to twist and slam their back to a wall the moment thier backstabbed is a rewarding challenge if you win. Assassinating someone who never turns around feels too easy. So then I just go about hunting enemy lights.

~Leone.

[Khobai]

Even 500 damage in a medium isnt enough to maintain PSR on a loss sometimes which I dont really get. I guess it all depends how much tonnage is in the game.

Theres pretty much always a weak flank though. No team can cover all their flanks perfectly. The problem I have is ill be flanking successfully then the rest of my team will just melt away lol. So it becomes a question of whether or not I can trust my team to hold the line while I flank the enemy team.

The answer is no you cant.

Edited by Khobai, 01 June 2021 - 12:42 PM.

[Uetur]

I am a new player so I don't have the history of experiences but it seems if I push and I run into multiple mechs on the other team that combined firepower can easily cripple/kill me in an alpha. Where as if I stay back some and react to where I know the enemy might be, my chances of accidently running into 3ish Mechs are much lower and the reverse might be true, we get a enemy running into us.

The other thing I have been learning is ECM is really strong, and it seems the Mechs who get to move the most are those with ECM which as far as I can tell is rarely assaults which is why I think they tend to camp more.

[Vlad Ward]

You mean matches might start lasting more than an average of 4 and a half minutes - a minute of which is just running from spawn?

[Brizna]

You only need 1 build that can do plenty of damage to have short time to kill. Everyone can play that very same build to achieve meta deadliness.

Cauldron's patch made a lot more builds viable but it didn't improve the best builds.

Thus TTK didn't change significantly, with only one exception: PPFLD (pinpoint front-loaded damage), this did decrease time to kill, but mostly against light mechs. Getting one shot is a lot easier now that PPFLD is more competitive, it used to have appalling DPS, now it's closer to DPS builds.

Honestly, I think that more camping == less nascar, so it's not entirely bad.

[Khobai]

TTK has definitely gone down. More viable PPFLD weapons = lower TTK. Heavy lasers also hit like trucks again so you have 75 damage laser vomit alphas.

Uetur, on 01 June 2021 - 12:39 PM, said:

The other thing I have been learning is ECM is really strong, and it seems the Mechs who get to move the most are those with ECM which as far as I can tell is rarely assaults which is why I think they tend to camp more.

The problem with ECM on assaults is you have to dip deep into the sensor tree to take both ECM skills to make ECM actually do anything productive.

Giving assaults like the direwolf ECM doesnt really help them if they have to cough up the skill points for the sensor tree. It takes too much away from the other trees they need points in. Especially if the direwolf also has to give up its prime CT armor bonus to take the ECM CT which probably wont have an armor bonus. I definitely dont think ECM will really help the direwolf at all.

Its generally better for light mechs to use their ECM to cover assaults then for assaults to dilute their builds to try and ECM themselves. since lights actually benefit more from the other skill nodes in the sensor tree.

Edited by Khobai, 01 June 2021 - 01:59 PM.

[Gagis]

Does this mean nascar has become less prevalent?

Hallelujah!

[Xeno Phalcon]

Gagis, on 01 June 2021 - 02:33 PM, said:

Does this mean nascar has become less prevalent?

Hallelujah!

Edited by Xeno Phalcon, 01 June 2021 - 02:42 PM.

[crazytimes]

I had a work phone call waiting for a match this week. I didn't get back to the computer until almost 5 minutes into the match. The score was 0-0 and there was no Nascar going on. I joined the fight when it was still relevant and stole some kills even.

There has been a number of matches with strategy other than "rotating mech ball goes pewpewpew". This is improvement.

[Tarl Cabot]

(chuckles) There is also timezones to consider too. For NA prime time one would not see it as much as when playing during other times. The Old World tends to be less aggressive than New World players

[Dauntless Blint]

Trontastic1, on 01 June 2021 - 09:56 AM, said:

I've noticed this happening more as well since I returned to MWO in April.

It can be frustrating to see assault mechs pilots just standing and afraid to move forward, but on the flip side when I run a assault mech with max armor, it can get chewed to pieces in the matter of seconds. I really can't blame players for being hesitant to charge in and engage.

Assaults generally can't poke as a drawback of their architype, they often need range, chokepoints and ambush to get the most out of them, speedy smaller silhouettes can poke and peek.
The slowest, biggest target you can't miss is not a tank when there is no game mechanic to "bounce/reflect" rounds.
Lights in the past were effectively a better (dodge) tank negating damage by causing the enemy players to shoot the ground
It's nice when players support friendly assaults but when they do it using them as cover instead of creating a second line of cross fire where possible all they do is help converge enemy fire on the easiest archetype in the game to hit. It's all subjective of course.

[martian]

Vlad Ward, on 01 June 2021 - 12:42 PM, said:

You mean matches might start lasting more than an average of 4 and a half minutes - a minute of which is just running from spawn?

The matches might last longer, but those additional one or two minutes are just the time spent standing still behind buildings or rocks. Those minutes add nothing to the enjoyment from the game.

Uetur, on 01 June 2021 - 12:39 PM, said:

I am a new player so I don't have the history of experiences but it seems if I push and I run into multiple mechs on the other team that combined firepower can easily cripple/kill me in an alpha.

You are right. Two or three enemy 50-60 point alphastrikes can cripple your 'Mech easily.

Uetur, on 01 June 2021 - 12:39 PM, said:

The other thing I have been learning is ECM is really strong, and it seems the Mechs who get to move the most are those with ECM which as far as I can tell is rarely assaults which is why I think they tend to camp more.

ECM is useful, but not gamebreaking. Once you learn the game, you will know how to play even without ECM protection.