50 replies to this topic

[sosegado]

I'm pretty much an Assault pilot that dabbles occasionally in Mediums and Lights.

I don't play Heavies because I've never seen the point of their existence. I've always thought of them as useless and weak Assault wannabees.

But I'm willing to try them out again if there are any chassis that are worth investing my time to learn.

I don't care if they are IS or Clan.

There are specific criteria I'm looking for though:

1) AMS (dual if available)
2) ECM
3) Speed (80kph or faster if available)

Dakka or Face melters please, Missile boats need not apply.

Thanks!

[FupDup]

You can grab a Loki for ECM and 1 AMS if you're willing to sacrifice the head laser. You also get 20% radar derp with the AMS head.

Sun Spooder can also do ECM + 1 AMS if you have the Manul.

Night Gyr can too (with 25% radar derp in the head), as can the Mad Cat Mk 1. There's a handful of IS heavies that can too.

I don't think there are any current heavies capable of dual AMS and ECM at the same time. It's a choice between dual AMS or 1 AMS + ECM.

Edited by FupDup, 03 May 2022 - 02:08 PM.

[TheCaptainJZ]

Timberwolf BH from the Warden pack.

[Sawk]

YES I AGREE -- THE timberwolf has been reborn, it is a true JACK of all trades MECH, but you to think in terms of how many platforms you can build with and how many QUIRKS you can get.

They were upgraded few months back, speed if you can twist, and learn jump jets, no light will stay near you, you get omni PODS, i have 6 timberwolfs, LRMS and lazer no PROBLEM , oh you like CANNONS you get total of 4, LAZER VOMIT, the one i use has 46 alpha at 300- and full range with 2 large at 1400 meters.

MY one play mech has an alpha of 59 points, and i named it SNOWFLAKE because i build him in the WINTER LOL, good luck with your build : )

SAWK CLANNER

[w0qj]

1. Just goto [MechDB 2.0]>>[Table_View]>>[Expand_All]
https://mwo.nav-alpha.com/mechs

Click [Medium] on left hand corner, and make sure [Any] is chosen for both IS/Clan.

You may even enter [Top_Speed]>=[81 kph]

You the get a filtered list of which chassis/variant from both IS & Clan that fits above criteria.

2. Then in [Table_View] visually look for variants with the orange [ECM] circle.
Then inspect to see how many [AMS] hardpoints are there on the mech (if any).
Note that Clan OmniMechs can swap in torso parts for [AMS] hardpoints with [ECM] !

3. [Spoiler Alert]:

Results:
No, unfortunately there are neither IS nor Clan Heavy mechs with 1x [ECM], and 2x [AMS].

In fact, the only mech I can think of that fits your requirements is: any Kit Fox KFX chassis, with that lovely KFX-C Right Arm. And yes, that's a Clan Light mech, and it goes at 97.2 kph.

Edited by w0qj, 03 May 2022 - 03:43 PM.

[B1ack Dragon]

TheCaptainJZ, on 03 May 2022 - 03:20 PM, said:

Timberwolf BH from the Warden pack.

That’s a good one but I prefer the Timberwolf -S with the ECM RT and 3 Energy in the LT. Jumpjet with 3 high mount energy hard points going 87 with all 4 speed skills.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Stab Wound, on 03 May 2022 - 01:59 PM, said:

I don't care if they are IS or Clan.

There are specific criteria I'm looking for though:

1) AMS (dual if available)
2) ECM
3) Speed (80kph or faster if available)

Dakka or Face melters please, Missile boats need not apply.

Thanks!

You're not going to find an IS heavy that meets all those criteria unless you sacrifice some speed. You can do all that with a Thunderbolt 10SE, but only at reasonable firepower: https://mwo.nav-alph...c7b0af_TDR-10SE

If you're running IS heavies, you'll want to drop some speed to pick up better firepower. Aim for something in the 60-70 kph range. And for an even better selection, you'll need to lose the ECM.

[Andrewlik]

I agree with Scapaton - the 10SE is good for ECM + MASC (70 kmh pre, 92 with masc)
You can run 5 LL but it runs fairly hot, though the ECM and MASC gives you wiggle room for that.

[foamyesque]

The thing about heavies is that (depending on build) you can get assault level fire power (at the cost of sustainability) on a platform that can actually get around the battlefield reasonably responsively. The Orion IIC, for example, has an absolutely brutal brawler configuration, the Night Gyr's a fantastic sniper, there's a classic Hellbringer lasvom (or its bigger brother variant, a Timberwolf BH), the Marauder is a very good machine with good hitboxes and high mounts and has some very nice ballistic + laser setups, there's a Grasshopper for Sphere lasvom with JJs, there's the Jester Catapult as a smaller version of that, you can do double 20s on a Jagermech and bushwhack people...



My own personal two favourite heavy mechs right now are the Bounty Hunter Timberwolf in a 2xLPL 4xMPL configuration, and the C1 Catapult in a 2xLRM15 4x ERML 1x AMS one. Both are very reliable damage dealers with lots of mobility and enough armour to take a shot or two in open combat.

Edited by foamyesque, 03 May 2022 - 08:54 PM.

[ScrapIron Prime]

I agree with the C1 Catapult, but he said no missiles… so that rules out MRM monster builds too. The Warhammer 7S and it’s 40% velocity buff is dead scary with 60 MRMs and a couple light PPCs… but not on his list due to speed, ECM, and missiles.

[sosegado]

Wow!

I honestly don't know what I expected to find this morning when I logged in but I guarantee you it wasn't this many helpful responses.
Thank You!

A quick explanation for the criteria is that I'm going to be training to play this chassis type from the ground up and the AMS, ECM and Speed are designed to let me make mistakes while keeping my mech on the battlefield as long as possible.
I plan to refine my loadout later after I have some sort of feel for how this weight class works.
Also, as far as missiles go..I love them! I love using them more than receiving them but hey, I'm weird like that.
But using them during training isn't going to make me a better Heavy pilot. In fact I don't want to lean on them as a crutch during this adjustment period, they'll be added to some mechs in my hanger later, after I learn the basics.

The biggest hurdle I'm going to face is NOT playing this chassis like an assault!

Thanks for all your help!

Feel free to keep adding mechs to the list, I'm sure others can benefit from the communities knowledge of this weight class.

Cya on the battlefield!

Edited by Stab Wound, 04 May 2022 - 05:05 AM.

[RickySpanish]

Definitely sounds like you want Clan Heavies with speed requirements you listed. I would argue ECM is not as important, and if you drop that then you get many more options like the Ebon Jaguar or even Rifleman IIC 2 (slightly slower than your desired speed, though).

[Bud Crue]

About the closest you will get in an IS mech is probably a Thanatos, a Warhammer 4L, or the aforementioned Thunderbolt 10SE. For my money if you want max survival-ability, don't worry about the ECM, and get yourself a Jester. 2AMS, JJs, 6MPL and a std 300, or whatever laser vomit configuration you want with a 300LE or thereabouts. Its got the smallest frontal profile of any heavy in the game. It's pretty forgiving of bad life choices.

[Lajur Kas]

Stab Wound, on 03 May 2022 - 01:59 PM, said:

I don't care if they are IS or Clan.

Shame!

Stab Wound, on 03 May 2022 - 01:59 PM, said:

There are specific criteria I'm looking for though:

1) AMS (dual if available)
2) ECM
3) Speed (80kph or faster if available)

Dakka or Face melters please...

Stab Wound, on 04 May 2022 - 05:01 AM, said:

...I don't want to lean on them as a crutch during this adjustment period,

...NOT playing this chassis like an assault!

What are you a Blakist? Skip the AMS and ECM crutches too! Next you'll be asking about MASC, Jump Jets and Stealth Armor

Peddle to the metal and start running Dragons! They don't play like assaults, do the dakka, melt faces, and even carry XL engines better than most.

[foamyesque]

Stab Wound, on 04 May 2022 - 05:01 AM, said:

A quick explanation for the criteria is that I'm going to be training to play this chassis type from the ground up and the AMS, ECM and Speed are designed to let me make mistakes while keeping my mech on the battlefield as long as possible.
I plan to refine my loadout later after I have some sort of feel for how this weight class works.
Also, as far as missiles go..I love them! I love using them more than receiving them but hey, I'm weird like that.
But using them during training isn't going to make me a better Heavy pilot. In fact I don't want to lean on them as a crutch during this adjustment period, they'll be added to some mechs in my hanger later, after I learn the basics

It sounds like you're primarily talking about LRMs when you say missiles. If that's so, there's some fun MRM and SRM builds out there. The Archer Tempest is ECM capable and does MRM60 + lasers very well; the C1 Catapult is also good but trades out the the ECM for JJs. You can SRM-bomb with a variety of mechs, potentially mixing in ballistics or lasers for additional punch as the Orion IIC LBX20 + SRM24A build does depending on how the tonnage works out.

I would also say I think you probably really only need one of the three criteria to make the adjustment gentler, and if I had to choose one, it'd be the ECM. It can make you sloppy, but if it's converting a firing line blasting you apart when you peek to 'just the guy actively watching that space returns fire', it is supplying massive value for money right there.

You need to remember: heavies don't have the tonnage of assaults but also require pretty hefty engines in order to get beyond 75kph -- the Timber Wolf, for example, is rocking an XL375. Sphere side most heavies are using something around a LFE300. Giving up the speed requirement will allow you to mount more and bigger weapons, or cool the ones you have better, or maybe buy a couple of JJs, which are generally more valuable than a few KPH of speed as well IMO.

Likewise, dual AMS is certainly nice (I have it on my Jester) but it eats into that tonnage budget more rapidly than it looks. It's more situational than ECM, and the effect of reducing incoming missile damage is weaker than ECM making you simply not be noticed at all. If you have to pick one, pick the ECM. And if you've got a mech with ECM and a single AMS system, you need to be thinking about whether or not that AMS is worth potentially giving away your position when it lights off, which very much depends on what you're planning to do with the 'mech.

[Sawk]

hmm i'll give you one more build, and some one already spoke of, it was made by freind of mine many years ago to escort SAID ASSUALT mechs, and that is the EBON JAG, tough as nails mech, no jump jets, so you need twist like a IS PILOT, but with 7 or 8 MED CLAN PULSE LAZERS, is a killer.
YOU HAVE omni pods, i am sure you can find what you need : ).

SAWK CLANNER

[sosegado]

Ok, so here is the list of mechs I've got.
I didn't buy the Jester yet but don't think I'm not looking real hard at it!

I just wanted to pay with C-Bills before I commit hard won MC.

There's a great sale going on right now so the timing could not have been better for me,
although I have more c-bills then I can spend at the moment.

Grasshopper 5J
Rifleman IIC-2
Timberwolf S
Nightgear H
Catapault C4
Black Knight KNT
Ebon Jaguar B

Now I've got some configuring to do before I flop all over the battlefield this weekend

Thanks for all the suggestions, keep them coming, you guys are great!

Edited by Stab Wound, 04 May 2022 - 02:36 PM.

[ScrapIron Prime]

If you’ve got a grasshopper 5J, then you’ll want a build with 5 Large Lasers and 2 AMS. https://mwo.nav-alph...35d016ed_GHR-5J. If you have that, no real need to get a Jester, it does about the same thing.

Which Black Knight was that again?

[sosegado]

The Black Knight is the BL-6-KNT.

I'm relieved about the Jester because I'd really rather spend C-bills instead of MC until I decide whether or not
to keep piloting heavies.

There's a lot of assault habits that, on the surface, look like they translate to piloting a heavy but will ultimately get me killed.

Years of staring down heavies and other assaults and laughing as I walked over their corpses will probably be my biggest challenge to put aside.

I dabble in lights and mediums because neither of them can do that, so the instinct to try that isn't there except in very rare circumstances (meaning those enemy mechs are mostly dead already!)

Lajur Kas, on 04 May 2022 - 08:04 AM, said:

Shame!

What are you a Blakist? Skip the AMS and ECM crutches too! Next you'll be asking about MASC, Jump Jets and Stealth Armor

Peddle to the metal and start running Dragons! They don't play like assaults, do the dakka, melt faces, and even carry XL engines better than most.

I'm still thinking about Dragons for the reasons you describe. I'm looking for different gameplay from assaults. But I put a lot on my plate by picking up 7 mechs to try.

Also, I seriously don't know what a "Blakist" is.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Stab Wound, on 05 May 2022 - 01:57 PM, said:

The Black Knight is the BL-6-KNT.

Cool. That Black Knight has medium laser and Pulse Laser quirks, so its best built as a knife fighter with dual AMS. It's only weakness is that it doesn't jump and all hard points except the head are shooting from just above hip level.

https://mwo.nav-alph...c743c7_BL-6-KNT

Edited by ScrapIron Prime, 05 May 2022 - 02:03 PM.