22 replies to this topic

[Rhialto]

Is there a calculator to know how much damage is required to destroy a part? Forget crits and ammo explosion and such.

A quick example, if I put 10 armor for back CT, If someone sneak in my back, what alpha is required to instant kill me?

[Spheroid]

That information is easily viewable in mechlab. The damage required is the sum of the armor and internal structure values.

[Rhialto]

Spheroid, on 04 March 2018 - 10:54 AM, said:

That information is easily viewable in mechlab. The damage required is the sum of the armor and internal structure values.

Not that I've heard of, there is a formula I think like armor value is higher than what it is shown. No?

[Spheroid]

Its very simple. Look at this Blackjack.

I have full armor on my legs. That is 44 points of armor stock. Skill tree nodes give an additional six points which is listed in teal. Without quirks internal structure is half of max armor per section. The default structure for leg is 22 on a 45 ton mech. Arrow chassis quirks give me six more and the remainder is from the skill tree. The values ARE displayed correctly.

The damage required to take the leg is 50 + 35. Its very obvious, not arcane. The damage to core out the mech from the rear is 6 + 44.

Edited by Spheroid, 04 March 2018 - 11:52 AM.

[Rhialto]

Ha great, thanks!

[Seranov]

Rhialto, on 04 March 2018 - 10:57 AM, said:

Not that I've heard of, there is a formula I think like armor value is higher than what it is shown. No?

There is no such thing. Outside of extreme edge cases like the Trebuchet's chest missile bay, what you see is what you get.

[Antares102]

Rhialto, on 04 March 2018 - 10:38 AM, said:

Is there a calculator to know how much damage is required to destroy a part? Forget crits and ammo explosion and such.

A quick example, if I put 10 armor for back CT, If someone sneak in my back, what alpha is required to instant kill me?

Wait... you are Tier 1 and dont know how the HP system works?
You must have played many games to get to Tier 1 and you never stumbled across this problem before?
WTF?

[Tarogato]

Also, if you wanna be super cereal, you can multiply the structure value by 0.9, which will somewhat account for typical average crit damage.

So like a Blackjack with 35 leg structure really can only take 31.5 damage, the remaining 3.5 will be dealt instantaneously by crits.

[Rhialto]

Antares102, on 04 March 2018 - 02:17 PM, said:

Wait... you are Tier 1 and dont know how the HP system works?

Well I had a good idea but thought there was also a formula applied I didn't care before and today I wanted to clear this out.

[Jackal Noble]

tell that to a Wolfhound.

[Asym]

Antares102, on 04 March 2018 - 02:17 PM, said:

Wait... you are Tier 1 and dont know how the HP system works?
You must have played many games to get to Tier 1 and you never stumbled across this problem before?
WTF?

Antares102, ah, how to put this, this is a game.......you know, have a beer, have fun chasing each other around a silly map with less than lethal weapons......... Game. Not too many people want to know about made up and fake physics, imaginary armor and weapons data.....all they want to know is: does it shoot and can I blow the stompy red robot to pieces.... You, and a few others have taken the time to figure out the fake physics and made up imaginary mech data ! That's cool ! But, really, no one needs to know that since all you have to do is put the reticle on the target and pull the trigger and POOF, stompy robot pieces or a cloud of stompy robot plasma..... That's why we're headed to SOLARIS !!! So, all you have to do is "see stompy red robot - kill stompy red robot..." Sorry, I like what you write but I think your assumption that Tier 1 or 2 means something other than "I play a game that shoots stompy robots a lot means I know something other than how to pull the trigger....." isn't valid.

[Seranov]

Asym, on 04 March 2018 - 04:09 PM, said:

Antares102, ah, how to put this, this is a game.......you know, have a beer, have fun chasing each other around a silly map with less than lethal weapons......... Game. Not too many people want to know about made up and fake physics, imaginary armor and weapons data.....all they want to know is: does it shoot and can I blow the stompy red robot to pieces.... You, and a few others have taken the time to figure out the fake physics and made up imaginary mech data ! That's cool ! But, really, no one needs to know that since all you have to do is put the reticle on the target and pull the trigger and POOF, stompy robot pieces or a cloud of stompy robot plasma..... That's why we're headed to SOLARIS !!! So, all you have to do is "see stompy red robot - kill stompy red robot..." Sorry, I like what you write but I think your assumption that Tier 1 or 2 means something other than "I play a game that shoots stompy robots a lot means I know something other than how to pull the trigger....." isn't valid.

The fact that it is a game doesn't change the fact that if you have managed to get enough experience under your belt to reach T1, you really should have at least a passing understanding of how something as simple as the damage model works. But then again, "it's just a game," has been code for "I'm too lazy and ignorant to even attempt to find out how things work," for longer than video games have existed.

[Tarl Cabot]

Seranov, on 04 March 2018 - 04:15 PM, said:

The fact that it is a game doesn't change the fact that if you have managed to get enough experience under your belt to reach T1, you really should have at least a passing understanding of how something as simple as the damage model works. But then again, "it's just a game," has been code for "I'm too lazy and ignorant to even attempt to find out how things work," for longer than video games have existed.

Not really. Remember PSR has an upward movement emphasis. Play enough games while doing just enough damage+ to get a halfway decent MS and there you are. A player does not need to be a rocket scientist, or an engineer or mathematician /chuckles.. Just remembering one of my engineer professors who would drop remarks of something along the line that many times an engineer and a mathematician tend to not agree on things, ie the real world vs abstracts, a 2x4 vs a piece of paper... hey, that was over 30 years ago, I forgot some parts of those remarks...

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 04 March 2018 - 05:46 PM.

[Seranov]

Tarl Cabot, on 04 March 2018 - 05:45 PM, said:

Not really. Remember PSR has an upward movement emphasis. Play enough games while doing just enough damage+ to get a halfway decent MS and there you are. A player does not need to be a rocket scientist, or an engineer or mathematician /chuckles.. Just remembering one of my engineer professors who would drop remarks of something along the line that many times an engineer and a mathematician tend to not agree on things, ie the real world vs abstracts, a 2x4 vs a piece of paper... hey, that was over 30 years ago, I forgot some parts of those remarks...

If you are not good at this game but still manage to get to T1, that implies a very significant number of rounds played. I'm about halfway through T2 with roughly 1700 total games played since I started in the middle of last year. I'm hardly good (something like a 0.9 W/L and 0.8 KDR) but I've seen that if you put a full AC20 round into a Light Mech with ~20 armor on that location, it's not gonna have armor anymore. The way Crits work is kind of arcane, but it's hardly impossible to get the general jist of it (Structure is less good than an equal amount of Armor, obviously).

[Jman5]

Rhialto, on 04 March 2018 - 02:43 PM, said:

Well I had a good idea but thought there was also a formula applied I didn't care before and today I wanted to clear this out.

Don't worry about it. You shouldn't have to defend yourself yourself for asking a question and wanting to learn. There have been lots of things that I didn't learn or misunderstood until much later and I'm sure there are plenty more things I will learn that others would consider obvious.

If anyone out there has a question about the game, but don't want to ask on the public forum, you're welcome to PM me and I'll try to answer it as best I can without judgement.

Edited by Jman5, 04 March 2018 - 06:06 PM.

[PocketYoda]

Seranov, on 04 March 2018 - 05:53 PM, said:

If you are not good at this game but still manage to get to T1, that implies a very significant number of rounds played. I'm about halfway through T2 with roughly 1700 total games played since I started in the middle of last year. I'm hardly good (something like a 0.9 W/L and 0.8 KDR) but I've seen that if you put a full AC20 round into a Light Mech with ~20 armor on that location, it's not gonna have armor anymore. The way Crits work is kind of arcane, but it's hardly impossible to get the general jist of it (Structure is less good than an equal amount of Armor, obviously).

You don't have to do anything to get to tier 1 other than play the game, the down arrow after a loss is just for show.. Trust me i've tried to go down it wont.

[Antares102]

Asym, on 04 March 2018 - 04:09 PM, said:

Antares102, ah, how to put this, this is a game.......you know, have a beer, have fun chasing each other around a silly map with less than lethal weapons......... Game. Not too many people want to know about made up and fake physics, imaginary armor and weapons data.....all they want to know is: does it shoot and can I blow the stompy red robot to pieces.... You, and a few others have taken the time to figure out the fake physics and made up imaginary mech data ! That's cool ! But, really, no one needs to know that since all you have to do is put the reticle on the target and pull the trigger and POOF, stompy robot pieces or a cloud of stompy robot plasma..... That's why we're headed to SOLARIS !!! So, all you have to do is "see stompy red robot - kill stompy red robot..." Sorry, I like what you write but I think your assumption that Tier 1 or 2 means something other than "I play a game that shoots stompy robots a lot means I know something other than how to pull the trigger....." isn't valid.

It just seriously astonished me that he nevered wondered about calculating his total HP before becoming Tier 1.
That's all.

[C337Skymaster]

PocketYoda, on 05 March 2018 - 05:08 AM, said:

You don't have to do anything to get to tier 1 other than play the game, the down arrow after a loss is just for show.. Trust me i've tried to go down it wont.

That's not as true as it used to be. One easy way to go down is to play 'mechs with 0 skill points. Every time I try to level up a 'mech, I drop tier ranking. I don't start to go up again, consistently, until I get to around 80 skill points on the chassis.

[Meep Meep]

The old psr method was an always climbing green arrow. The new method is directly tied to your personal performance as ranked against both teams. So while yes you can gain psr off a relatively poor performance you only get to do that when everyone else was bad too. This is why tier 3 is a brick wall for many in that they still do well enough facing the lower tiers with some higher tiers mixed in but once they hit tier 2 and the low tiers are cut off so does their progression and most get tossed quickly back into tier 3. This is why tier 3 is the largest pool of players with tier 4 and 5 the next largest and finally tier 1 and 2 being the least populated because of the barrier to entry.

[LordNothing]

just press r and shoot the red thing.