11 replies to this topic

[Saved By The Bell]

Summoner-prime probably worst mech without changing omni.

First, I never like summoners: walking-flying refrigerator with bad armor and weak weapons.

So in the case of prime, you have only 3 different weapon points: energy, ballistic, missile. No ams, no ecm.

No place to hide ammo.

The arrogant cockpit point is near energy place, so its ok for shooting PPC by one hand. But its very far from ballistic hand, so its unable to snipe gauss properly, if you try. This mech made for long range combat, and its just unable to do it properly.

If I use ppc and some ballistic, I always must remember which hand I am shooting, because some rock or teammate could be near. With such crazy cockpit location its really mazo style.

Shooting any light with energy and ballistic is problem too, you just can hit it with your low hands.

If you go for missiles, its ok, but only one missile isnt enough, plus such huge bulk above torso just asking, shoot me there, baby.

After some struggle, errppc and lbx20 is barely ok.

Others combinations do less 300 damage in game, so no need for me to blame anybody.

Edited by Saved By The Bell, 15 November 2024 - 11:08 AM.

[Bud Crue]

Saved By The Bell, on 14 November 2024 - 04:05 AM, said:

Summoner-prime probably worst mech without changing omni. (emphasis added)

If not changing the omni pods is a required part of your standard, then the Shadow Cat H is a stronger contender, I think.

[Ttly]

If you want to play it So8 you need to stay at 600m range away from the enemy because there's just no reason for you to be any closer, helps that it's fast and durable (though in form of structure quirks) for a 70t too.
Just use an C-LB10 (1.5t ammo, sucks even with the ammo quirk yes, I mean only 540 damage worth of ammo?), C-LRM10 (1t ammo, no ammo quirk because SOMEONE is allergic to giving mechs with loadouts that synergizes with LRM ranges missile ammo quirks apparently, only 240 damage worth of highly inaccurate [spread] damage by the way that will likely get eaten by cover), C-ERPPC (or beam laser if you're scared of lights or something), max armor except on the legs/cockpit, T.Decay if you can be bothered to, poptart snipe-spot all day long.

As far as clan heavies go it doesn't really have a real role overlap since there's just no other clan heavy as fast+as many JJs and poptart loadout quirks (or as underarmed really) unless you count the Linebacker, the TBR-S doesn't really poptart that well either. Though by that argument you can also say it's really nothing more than an overarmored (and somewhat sluggish) medium too, so an Vapor Eagle/Huntsman without the firepower quirks from being an heavy and because it has an overweight engine and no cEndo.

Personally I'd say the only worthwhile So8 variants for it are the B (+top speed on CT quirk seriously what the heck, on top of being a self sufficient spotter LRMer), or the C (UAC So8 quirks, in MWO civilization you have to use UACs to make ballistics worthwhile afterall) for frankenpodding just refer to netbuilding your average boring SRM splatter grimmechs build or whatever. You can also get the F for 2C-UAC5/2 I guess.

Oh by the way, Viper-Prime sucks more. Or the Mist Lynx-C but that one has the funny factor of being an annoying ECM sniper light.
And if you thought things couldn't get any worse. Remember, you could've been playing the Grand Summoner and regretting wasting your money on what amounts to an 70t Orion IIC that has the option of mounting overweight JJs.

Edited by Ttly, 16 November 2024 - 04:25 AM.

[crazytimes]

Summoner was meta a few years ago. It hasn't been nerfed - everything else has just kiind of crept past it. The older builds still work. 3 x cERPPC if you can heat manage. 2 x cERPPC + TC if heat management isn't your style. 2 x LPL/HLL + ERML to fill for laser vomit + JJ. Slightly edgier builds are 2 x cUAC10 or 2 x HAG20 if you maximise ballistic quirk pods.

Other useful builds can be found here: https://grimmechs.is...chname&s=summon

[kalashnikity]

Summoner with two torso mounted HAG20 is pretty nice. Have to shave a lot of armor to have enough ammo, but it does work.

[Saved By The Bell]

After patch, err-ppc and lbx20 combination is much better.

I had some good fights, so not worse mech now.

Thanks, cauldron.

[Valdarion Silarius]

Summoners are great in MW:O. Very agile, excellent jump jet capability, excellent pop tarts and pretty decent hitboxes. Can't speak on the Summoner II since I do not have experience with that mech. The only thing I can think of is that it's slightly weak on the armor and the hardpoint geometry is pretty awkward.

In regards to the stock prime config, it's supposed to be a "trainer" mech to teach new mechwarriors different weapon systems. I never understood the stock configuration, until I read more into the lore and realized you can alpha strike all three systems with no heat penalty.

[Ttly]

Valdarion Silarius, on 20 November 2024 - 09:57 AM, said:

In regards to the stock prime config, it's supposed to be a "trainer" mech to teach new mechwarriors different weapon systems. I never understood the stock configuration, until I read more into the lore and realized you can alpha strike all three systems with no heat penalty.

The Prime is just rather disappointing in context of MWO though when the C which is highly similiar, not only does more damage (thanks to quirked for UAC) and with easier to use weapons (quirked for lasers on the right arm instead of C-ERPPC), it also carries more ammo thanks to large laser+medium laser that you can switch it for on that arm being 1 ton less than C-ERPPC.

Edited by Ttly, 20 November 2024 - 02:23 PM.

[caravann]

You don't have to use summoner prime with standard omniparts.

[Ttly]

caravann, on 21 November 2024 - 12:00 PM, said:

You don't have to use summoner prime with standard omniparts.

Yeah wow, let's just turn it into a 2UAC10 (which you can just play the Trial Huntsman for) or another cookie cutter 2HAG20 sniper, much original builds, very fun sniping gameplay!

[confracto]

Saved By The Bell, on 14 November 2024 - 04:05 AM, said:

Summoner-prime probably worst mech without changing omni.

It's the Nova - D.
It's not even close.
I've seen internal MWO stats to back this up.

...also I was handed one as my replacement 'Mech in tabletop once and oh wow is it bad.

[Ttly]

confracto, on 21 November 2024 - 05:08 PM, said:

It's the Nova - D. It's not even close. I've seen internal MWO stats to back this up. ...also I was handed one as my replacement 'Mech in tabletop once and oh wow is it bad.

Meh, it's been buffed already this year so it can do funny builds like the -60%cd C-UAC10/20, it's like if the IS Hunchback is an actual *glass* cannon (and with JJs and worse weapon placements) now.

Edited by Ttly, 21 November 2024 - 06:29 PM.