54 replies to this topic

[Kraktzor]

Riptor, on 06 February 2012 - 11:32 AM, said:

Wich begs the question why anyone would choose the Assault/Defense roles over scout or Commander.

Let them take their commanders and their Airstrikes and artillery with their cool downs, I'll be in my Archer over on the other side of the hill with my little scout buddy spotting for me, my cooldown is only as long as it takes me to reload.

[Cur]

Lets have a look at how a commander role works in a different game, to get an idea on how it will work in MWO!


Battlefield 2142


The commander gets bonus XP if he order squads around and they actively work to complete the tasks they've been given.

The commander has about 5 active abilities:

Drop a UAV
Drop a Supply Crate
Drop a EMP Bomb on a selected area
Quick Satelite Scan of the Map, shows enemies everywhere for 5secs.


Because of the abilities the commander's been given, he pretty much has to sit up in the titan messing around with the map screen for 90% of the game, ordering diff squads in diff areas, reacting to if one encounters a mech and needs an EMP bomb to help disable it, or dropping a UAV so a squad about to come up on the position you designated isnt going into a blind trap.



While the commanders powers are excelent, the game can easily be played without him, tho having him there, actively using all his abilities for the benefit of the team gives a great advantage, it has is own handicaps by restricting the commander, by making it so he has to choose if he wants to run in and start pewpewing for fun, or sit back and be the tactical thinker, delegating commands to you're squad.




Wait for MWO to come out - a commander type role in a game like this allways has a great balance of advantage, and disadvantage for becomming a commander.

[CobraFive]

If someone with straight assault/defense modules, and someone with straight commander modules, met on the field, I would assume that the assault/defense specced mech would be at a significant combat advantage because that is the whole point of the assault/defense spec.

I really doubt artillery/air strikes are going to be half as powerful as people are freaking out its going to be. I really, really doubt that a commander-specced mech is going to be able to just drop airstrikes on some guy that is maneuvering and, much less, shooting at him...

[Bluey]

That role wont work without proper communications like voip

[Vernius Ix]

You can't even begin to create a topic like this until beta.

Edited by Vernius Ix, 22 February 2012 - 01:21 PM.

[Aegis Kleais]

Vernius Ix, on 21 February 2012 - 04:14 PM, said:

You can't even create a topic like this until beta.

I think people are allowed to have opinions before, during and after the beta. Same goes for assumptions.

My concern is "tunnel vision" commanders who see a clump of enemies and will drop artillery on the area even with there being teammates; and MechWarrior is all about target recognition and ensuring you don't fratricide on teammates.

I could definitely see fratting a teammate resulting in a massive penalty to that game's XP and MXP earned. Its one thing if the time it takes the ordinance to deliver allows the game to indicate to teammates the bombardment area and warn them to get out of the area before the munitions arrive, but if it's more instant, and there's no warning ahead of time by the commander, I'd definitely vote to kick/ban the commander who drops rounds repeatedly on teammates.

Danger close is one thing, but communication can offset team losses.

[MaddMaxx]

Aegis Kleais™, on 21 February 2012 - 04:22 PM, said:

I think people are allowed to have opinions before, during and after the beta. Same goes for assumptions.

My concern is "tunnel vision" commanders who see a clump of enemies and will drop artillery on the area even with there being teammates; and MechWarrior is all about target recognition and ensuring you don't fratricide on teammates.

I could definitely see fratting a teammate resulting in a massive penalty to that game's XP and MXP earned. Its one thing if the time it takes the ordinance to deliver allows the game to indicate to teammates the bombardment area and warn them to get out of the area before the munitions arrive, but if it's more instant, and there's no warning ahead of time by the commander, I'd definitely vote to kick/ban the commander who drops rounds repeatedly on teammates.

Danger close is one thing, but communication can offset team losses.

I for one, when in a furball, find that the enemy had suddenly dispersed, my first thought is disperse as well.

[Omigir]

I wonder if your going to have to have 'eyes' on a spot in order to do arty. Like you needing to have a laser designator for some forms of air strikes int he real world.

Or at least to have the 'FOW' cleared up by having a mech get his LOS on the intended area?

[MaddMaxx]

Omigir, on 22 February 2012 - 07:42 AM, said:

I wonder if your going to have to have 'eyes' on a spot in order to do arty. Like you needing to have a laser designator for some forms of air strikes int he real world.

Or at least to have the 'FOW' cleared up by having a mech get his LOS on the intended area?

If on a Wednesday, we could get some "straight" answers to even a small set of questions, just like that, I would give up the Mech reveal... really I would.

Edited by MaddMaxx, 22 February 2012 - 09:48 AM.

[Riptor]

Quote

You can't even create a topic like this until beta.

I heavily doubt you are the one to decide about this.

Anyways.

Nice comparison with BF here but it lags a bit since every lance will have a commander with only one of them being the regiment commander.

So you have three pairs of eyes instead of one.. thats a big game changer.

Also it has not yet been stated if there will be a shared cooldown for a commanders ability. And if yes: That means you would be gimping yourselfe severly if you go the commander role but then are not able to use any of the support abilities cause someone else gets elected as a commander.

Obvious thats not a problem for merc units but a big one for quick games/house battles.

And the bonuses you get for being Assault/def are not as big as to say that anyone who isnt assault/def has a huge disadvantage in a fight.

A Gauss rifle is a Gauss rifle no matter if a scout, commander or assault/def gets it. And from what i read the Assaults/def will mainly boost their allies with their modules and not themselves.

The mech improvements are not bound to the pilot progression, A levleled Atlas has the same improvements no matter your role / modules you have unlocked so yeah... commanders are NOT helpless and can dish out punishment themselves.

The reason i asked if the commander is to powerfull is because hes the only role that unlocks offensive modules instead of buffs to himselfe and his team mates like the other roles.

Its the fire wizard syndrome.. everyone wants the overwhelming firepower and you can not tell me that a naval strike is something even an assault mech can take lightly.

[Vernius Ix]

Let me rephrase my previous statement. To create a topic that states ANYTHING in this game is OP before there has been even a VIDEO let alone a BETA is asinine.

[metro]

The commander role has been touched on by the DEVS, but not defined as of yet for MWO.

sooooooo??? why continue here, until they have given us some things to chew on.

[KaiserSoze]

Helmer, on 06 February 2012 - 11:35 AM, said:

As we haven't played the game , heard any concrete info on how it's implemented , or seen any video , I'd say it's a little early to even talk about it logically.

Something to revisit when we are all better informed.

Best guess ? No , it'll be balanced.

Anyway the role is only as good as the strategist...Only fools follow fools into battle...

[Polymorphyne]

I would say the command role has a very important effect- countering assault mechs. In MW4, Assault mechs low speeds have no real disadvantage. With air strikes.... well a light or medium or even a heavy will often just get out of the way.

[Aegis Kleais]

Vernius Ix, on 22 February 2012 - 01:24 PM, said:

Let me rephrase my previous statement. To create a topic that states ANYTHING in this game is OP before there has been even a VIDEO let alone a BETA is asinine.

CLOSE!

How about:
"To create a topic that states ANYTHING in this game is OP before there has been even a VIDEO let alone a BETA is AN OPINION AND SPECULATION, PERMISSIBLE TO ALL FORUM GOERS."



I'm just not sure calling other people's opinions asinine is going to do little more than start arguments. I mean, if someone called an opinion you had as "idiotic", wouldn't you take offense to that? In other words, SIMMER DOWN, peeps. Lets wait til the game comes out before we start demanding duels and satisfaction from one another.