3696 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

All I gotta say, is remember how well Operation Scorpion went for Myndo Waterly. You betray your "followers" in such a blatant move, and it will end up stinging YOU in the azz.

[BDU BANSH33]

I really cant even begin to fathom why you would even consider this. It appears to me that the developer is in this for a fast buck rather than a long running fan backed game. In a nutshell 3rd person will kill this game faster than your ignoring the current issues in the game. Makes me wonder if all the money we spent to become Founders has been wasted. I hope not because I have been waiting for this for around what? 10 Years.

[Zeus X]

Zhyr, on 14 November 2012 - 06:35 PM, said:

Will people who don't want 3PV be given refunds of all the money they've spent?

Perhaps a small model of their mech could be shown in the cockpit so the new people can see where their legs are?

I like this idea, put a bobble head mech in there and have torso and leg orientation on it.

Once again to 3rd person, Not only NO, but HELL NO!

Edited by DCM Zeus, 14 November 2012 - 06:41 PM.

[Alois Hammer]

malibu43, on 14 November 2012 - 02:05 PM, said:

Didn't the devs already say they would implement it in a way that doesn't give an advantage?

They also said they wouldn't implement it at all, and we see how that turned out.

Quote

Why is everyone ignoring this?

See above.

[Bagheera]

miSs, on 14 November 2012 - 10:43 AM, said:

Please give constructive feedback by being clear and concise on what your opinions/concerns are about this feature.

This is a very dissapointing decision. The ability to understanding your facing/heading angles is a key attribute of this game, and part of what has always made it unique. While I understand that the abscence of a Mechwarrior title for the last 10 years means that not many people have a tremendous amount of experience with the "feel" of torso-twist and movement. But the problem here is not that the game is too difficult, it is that the current state of the game does not properly welcome the new player in a host of ways, one of the most important of which is just giving them an orientation of how the game works that they can experience in game, not a You Tube video that only some players will actually watch.

All of the issues that new players are having with mech piloting can be resolved by developing a simple series of tutorials where new players can drive around in a mech with text/V.O. instructions on controls and tips for reading the mini-map orientation markers. These would not have to be made all at once. Later additions could include runs with simple targets so people could practice shooting while moving and paying attention to their facing/heading.

Furthermore, refinements to the orientation markers themselves could also resolve this particular issue. To be fair, it did take me a little bit to get used to the HUD triangles in the main box overlay that indicate your facing and heading. These could be clarified for the benefit of new players. Similarly, there was a closed beta iteration of the mini-map facing/heading indicator that felt easier to read at a glance. Improvements to these two hud elements would go a long way to alleviate new player piloting issues.

There is no reason to change the fundamental game dynamic to resolve what is, essentially, an issue caused by lack of tutorial or informational material available in the game client itself. I sincerely hope that you will reconsider this decision. We, the community, are overwhelmingly against having a 3rd person view and there are dozens of ways to solve the core issue without implimenting it. There will always be that small group that wants a 3rd person game anyway, but their complaint is one of taste, not one of game difficulty. Fortunately those voices are in the smallest of minorities among the Mechwarrior Faithful, and you can summarily ignore them. But you can only do that if you address other core game components to resolve the legitimate complaints of players who are genuinely having difficultly with the piloting setup.

Thank you for your time, and I do hope you will re-consider and keep MW:O the First Person Mecha Piloting Simulator we all know and love.

[brapbrap]

No no and no!
It will ruin the game.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

If the determination is that 3rd person is necessary for pilot orientation, then a proper single-player tutorial needs to be introduced. Not should, not could, but must.

3rd person would do terrible injury to the game as a whole. Implementing it would be a blow to the trust that PGI has been given by the community. It would likely not be irreparable, but it would perhaps make the next such instance, or the one after that, the proverbial last straw.

I actually like the idea of 3rd person being part of the tutorial, but only for the very early movement section. Let the player drive around, having him aim at targets in one or another direction while moving and steering around obstacles. Then, move into 1st person and let him do it some more. Have a voice-over explain that the player gets 3rd person for that tiny bit only, and why (it helps with learning leg/torso independence).

What I'd really like to do is leverage this whole controversy into a massive push for a real in-game tutorial. Get the folks from NGNG to narrate it. Have an obstacle course that you run through three times. First, give the player 3rd person. Then, have him go through again in 1st. Finally, have targets pop up while he runs through it. You could even make a bit of a mini-game for it, like posting times and accuracy stats to a set of leaderboards. Perhaps even provide a cbill reward after the first time you play the tutorial (the first time only, to prevent farming). That might give you a chance to break down the post-game rewards screen so new players can learn what kinds of things they need to do to succeed.

What that would do is give you everything that you want to get out of 3rd person without damaging the community, while simultaneously providing a great, high-end new user experience.

[Blue Max]

NO 3rd person.....while I enjoyed MW4 and hill humping with a 7 ERL Nova, MWO does not need 3rd person.

If it's implemented, that's $120 down the drain......and I'll move onto the next game. Wing Commander reboot is looking good.

[Bagheera]

Voted no and posted in the Official Thread:

http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__1424301




If we cannot get them to change their mind, then the Next Crusade is to have a matchmaking option where we can choose "No 3rd Person" matches.

Edited by Bagheera, 14 November 2012 - 06:48 PM.

[Ghost_19Hz]

Itkovian, on 14 November 2012 - 06:26 PM, said:

I stand against any kind of third person camera that allows the player to control the mech effectively.

A third person view with no HUD or crosshairs might still work, however.

Thank you.

You could still use it to hide/see around corners then switch back to first person.

[MechZ1lla]

This is a sim-and we were told that 3rd person would NOT be implemented. If I wanted to ride behind my mech in a lawn chair suspended by balloons holding an Xbox controller, I'd reload MW4 and play it.
PGI's decisions of late have been somewhat questionable, and this one has the majority saying, "No. Not only no, but hell F*** no."

If you're going to continually ignore us, just scrap the whole thing and make MechASSault 3. Because at this point, that's where I see it going.

[Vermaxx]

They've already said the 3rd person would be in community warfare and allow people to choose whether or not they fought opponents with it enabled. Chill. If you don't want it, don't use it. If you don't want to FIGHT people with it, don't.

CW is so far off the game might fold before then anyway. Jesus, we can't get any kind of consensus on anything valuable, so we have a 41 page thread on something they're going to do anyway.

[ArmandTulsen]

This move will be cancerous for MWO.

You heard it here.

[FactorlanP]

Bagheera, on 14 November 2012 - 06:46 PM, said:

Voted no and posted in the Official Thread:

http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__1424301




If we cannot get them to change their mind, then the Next Crusade is to have a matchmaking option where we can choose "No 3rd Person" matches.

There is no next crusade for me. If they follow through with this, I won't bother to give my opinion ever again. There would obviously be no point to it.

[Tekadept]

Firstly I have a few concerns with this, . My first concern is PGI is behaving like a politician.. Saying one thing
"No 3rd person view. We want the player to feel they are not just the mech, they are the pilot inside the mech"
and then just asking for "feedback" on them looking into implementing the complete opposite.

Rather then contemplating this, more serious issues should be looked into, Knock downs, Laggy Netcode, More Game modes, The METAGAME Itself. The fact that you are now considering this makes me very scared as to the time frame involved to get all that was promised which i know will take a long time, but toying with this idea seems very unnecessary and wasteful of resources. I mean the fact that you have put this up for discussion is a waste of valuable time as somebody "I would hope" has to read all these responses. This persons time could have been better spent reading through all the bugs reports.

This has been touted as a mech sim game where you feel like you are piloting a battlemech, not a run and gun "Gears of Mechwarrior" game. It just doesn't suit this style of game.This will affect future competitive prospects for the game. Large teams will quite possibly pull out, which will have a snowball effect.

I don't want to have this game changed so it can flooded with a generation of Console players who honestly will play this game for a bit, sink very little money into it then go away to the next you beaut game which offers 3rd person camera and no real skill involved in playing.

I think PGI needs to thing long and hard about whether they want to please the masses of console players for a short period of time to get a bit of money of them, and risk alienating a large part of your player who will provide you more income for a much longer period.I am "Generalizing" here but IMO the kind of people who want 3rd person are the very casual gamer who doesn't have the inclination to learn how to play the game properly, therefore will only play for a short period of time and not dedicate the time and more importantly money into your product, hence jeopardizing the future of the game which will be sad.

TLDR : You can add 3rd person for a quick but short lived buck, or leave it out and keep a dedicated fan base who will sink more money in over the long haul

Edited by Tekadept, 14 November 2012 - 06:54 PM.

[Kill3rAce]

I might have already said it once, but again please do not do this. I love the feel of simulating being inside of a mech. Do not take it away from me or from the battlefield. It would ruin 1st person if I know where everything is around me

[Squid von Torgar]

The founder scheme worked well, lets not see how many demand refunds. Lets drop this now, make an official statement to that effect and lets get on with enjoying what promises to be a great Mechwarrior game.

[Carnivoris]

If players can't grasp the pretty simple mechanic of being able to twist their torso... which, last time I checked, I could do that with my stock standard human body in real life... giving them 3rd person is just going to confuse them more. Seriously, the minimap even has a line for forward progression and a field of view indicator. It took me .5 seconds to figure out how that worked. Disjoining the player from the first person view is just going to put them that much more outside normal reality and likely be that much more confusing.

EDIT: Things like this is why I'm not spending money on the game yet. I'm not convinced that its quality will stand. Now I'm even less sure.

Edited by Carnivoris, 14 November 2012 - 06:59 PM.

[Khavi Vetali]

I think everyone posting should actually listen to the podcast, starting at around 23:00. I'm a bit more confident in PGI's ability to handle this, but still heard some things that made me very apprehensive.

Mentioned in the podcast was having the camera mounted on the mech itself, such as the shoulder or hip.

Listen to it, reflect on it, and then post feedback.

Edit: I would still rather have this be covered in a tutorial, rather than in actual match play.

Edited by Khavi Vetali, 14 November 2012 - 06:56 PM.

[Bubba Wilkins]

No 3rd person for active pilots.

3rd person should be reserved for Battle ROM's (which I hope are on the table), dead man cams, and a future spectator mode only.

EDIT: Now that I've sat through the NGNG podcast.

HELL NO.

Worried about new players? okay, give them one trial mission which force switches the camera from 1st to 3rd and back (multiple times) so you can illustrate how the mech moves and controls. Beyond that, TOUGH. New players do not need to be coddled to the point where they gain significant battlefield advantages for being unable to grasp a fundamental rule of Mech operation. Your feet can travel one direction and you can aim another.

Edited by Bubba Wilkins, 14 November 2012 - 07:48 PM.