3696 replies to this topic

[Like a Sir]

Posted this in the official thread, going to throw it in here as well, for all the people who say that there is absolutely no harm in adding 3rd person view, as long as there is something in the matchmaking, that lets us do the first person only drops. After this I'm done.

Here is the way I see it (personal opinion, not saying it's right).

MWO has a niche, not an incredibly big one but the one with good quality, I myself am not a hardcore fan, I never played table top, but I did play the games since MW2, including the mech commanders. Lets face it, some of these hardcore fans are crazy and will spend loads of money on anything mechwarrior related, hence all the virtual cockpits, extra monitors, legendary founders and expensive *** table top stuff.

Now as long as you keep making this a quality product, and keep the promises that you made in the past, these people are here for a long time, seeing how they don't get a new mech game every 6 months. If you actually put out the content worth buying, paint jobs, hero mechs, cockpit stuff, and keep the game playable/balanced. They will pour money in to it and stick around.
If you go back on your word, straight up ignore the things they say and ask for and make this game just another 3rd person shooter, you are running a big risk of loosing them. 3rd person falls in to the category of dumbing it down going back on your word, and shooting for quantity over quality, in case I am not making myself clear.

Now what are you looking/trying to gain?:

You seem to be shooting for the FPS/3pv shooter crowd and trying to grab the rest of the market who hasn't played MW/BT games. Problem with that, as I pointed out before, is you are coming out of your niche and are now trying to compete with all those other games. They also make a new title every 6 months/year. Now assuming you manage to entice them over the latest FPS/3PV title or Hawken, you still end up with one problem - they can play the free preview of your game, before they spend any money!! Sure you made it tempting to spend the cash right away with just giving people trials (feels like a cheap way to grab some cash right out of the gate btw). But a lot of people don't mind grinding a few matches just to see what it's all about.

Now lately there have been a couple of titles, that were a complete financial success, but were terrible games. ME3, Diablo 3, Star Wars MMO (wouldn't call it a success), MW3. The thing that separates you from those titles, is that they were established IP's with very solid player bases, AND they didn't have a preview!!! They made most of their money in sales and pre orders, than it was too late! You do not have that luxury, right now the game is busted, there are issues on top of issues, and there is very little content, you will not steal any WOT fans unless they are also BT fans, any of those people you bring in with the gimmicks you are shooting for, will try it for a week or 2 and then likely bail out, because your quality sucks and you don't listen often. At that point you will be left without your fan base, and without them. Personally I love the damn game, but it does take patience, and yes it is a beta, but tell it to the guys who can just shrug and skip away to work on their prestige level 10, in the brand spanking new shooter.

Now the question is: Are you willing to slap the bejesus out of your fans, and alienate them, to gamble and see if you can hold on to those new players that MIGHT swarm your servers, or will you stick to the things you said you would do, and start working on quality, so we can spend some more money on this?

[Omigir]

If you do it, this is the ONLY place it should ever be:

A set of TRAINING missions for new pilots to go into to learn how to pilot a mech. Have it be a set of simple single player missions that have Sgt Unther or WHO EVER talk a pilot through the basics of controller a battlemech. For the Torso twist part of the training, have it go 3rd person.

Every that has ever existed has a part where you by yourself run through a 'mission' to learn how to play the game. Its not uncommon and it makes sens. If you want to use 3rd person for instructional on torso twisting, then that is exactly how it should be.

[Knistermann]

Nooooo for 3rd person view!! Sounds like a really bad idea. Make training grounds/missions and make a option like rookie matches but no 3rd person view.

[Antasius]

Boswelli, on 15 November 2012 - 10:33 AM, said:

That won't happen because it's not a all or nothing scenario. You use 3rd person view for moving/viewing around, and then zoom with mouse wheel into 1st person to shoot and aim. That works great in WoT, so why not use this control system here?

Really don't understand all these hates against 3rd pv. For all of you who like to use only 1st pv nothing would change, if PGI implements a good sight system.

To clearify, it's about immersion. The purists don't want anything "unrealistic" to MW logic happening in game. WoT lets you play with Axis and Allied tanks on the same side... among other "unrealistic" options.

The trick is to please the purists by making 3rd person mode fit into the lore.

[Ransack]

Rokuzachi, on 15 November 2012 - 09:52 AM, said:

Yup. Everyone is an armchair developer that can't see past their own notions of how something could work.

I think the rabidness of this community is probably due to the length of time it's been since the last big MW title. People have been stewing in their obsession for... well, years. Now that the holy grail has arrived, everyone is on a razor's edge hoping it'll be exactly the game they imagined it to be.

No, I think that most people want the game that we were promised.

see

von Pilsner, on 15 November 2012 - 09:43 AM, said:

That's what I thought I was paying for.

[Droz]

Um, simply put, NO.

Ya know, I paid $120 into something that was sold to me as a 1st person view, mech SIMULATOR. This is why I purchased into this. So, now you are telling me that after everything that has been done, such as making DHS not DHS, now you want to divide the community even more by putting in 3rd person view and splitting that into an option for people to play if they want to against others who do or don't play it?

No. I am really starting to feel like I've just thrown away $120. The original vision for this game was amazing. Now it's starting to veer off because you are starting to listen to the very vocal, VERY MINORITY group of players who will likely never pay a single dime into the game, while the rest of us who have put lots of money into this game, and have every intention of likely doing so in the future, are left out to dry.

NOT HAPPY!!!!!

You wanted my honest assessment, there is my honest assessment. Don't like it, then too bad.

[ImplicitAssembler]

I don't post a lot. I'm not going to argue the why's and whynots. (75 pages worth of that already).

3rd person would make me do my outmost to get my $120 refunded.

Edited by ImplicitAssembler, 15 November 2012 - 11:13 AM.

[Itka]

If you seperate the servers so that 3rd Person can only play against other 3rd Person players and don't give them any Xp that they can use in simulation matches then I will coninue playing the game. However if 3rd person view gets added and adds *any* (what so ever)advantage to the players using it then I will not play this game and I will feel cheated.

[M4NTiC0R3X]

Piloting a 'mech is not a hard concept to grasp, for me atleast.. it's a tank with legs and arms how hard could it be?
Let's be honest here, even if you had never touched a 'mech or tank shooter in your life you should be able to figure it out within the first couple of matches, otherwise it's a miracle you can even function as a human being. So the whole reasoning behind ' helping the newbs ' can go straight out the window. Personally: I like 3rd person view better, which is why I would like to see it ingame.That doesn't change the fact that ' the kind of 3rd person view I would enjoy ' means you'd be able to see your 'mech / up hills / around corners... that's just not fair compared to 1rst person 'n we all agree on that. Not to mention that segregating matches based on camera views adds a layer of crap that is not needed to the MM system. All that said, I want 3rd person... regardless of its advantages I think 1rst person pilots should get over it.. put in 3rd person and don't segregate camera views in MM *except for special circumstances like the possibility of future e - tournaments, where both teams mutually agree*

• broad vision range makes it easier to see up hills 'n around corners
  
• easier (for those who are dumbdumbs, the mini-map works fine) to pilot their 'mech

There's more advantages but when you get down to it 3rd person makes things easier.. it makes the entire screen easier to comprehend, the broad screen if ya know what I mean... No, I'm not saying it's complicated as is but the point stands.


Good example for this ^ would be your standard car racing game. Sure the best of the best can roll like it's real but most people just want everything laid out plain as day. Oh, and yes: immersion of simulation would be crushed for some people... good news: they can stay in 1rst person ~`8D Personally: I just want to see my sexy 'mech

Edited by M4NTiC0R3X, 15 November 2012 - 11:22 AM.

[James DeGriz]

Honestly, I can't even believe this is being considered enough to generate a "Give us your feedback on this" thread. This is MechWarrior: a first person, simulation like, futuristic, large biped, combat game. This is what I signed up for, this is what I expect.

Rather than pandering to whining cretins saying that the first person view is too difficult, or they can't handle not winning all the time like they do in Call of Duty, grow a pair of balls and adopt the "So play something else then. Our game clearly isn't for you" approach. You will win far more respect from the people that want a REAL MechWarrior game and the kind of people who you SHOULD be listening to (and after all, the people that you're always telling us YOU are) than the idiotic minority who think that "challenge" is just something sucky that gets in the way of "uber pwnage".

[KalleS73]

No.

Vote Yes, for conquest gamemode.

[Magusfunk]

This ain't some humpty-dump console game. Like in Arma 2, 3rd person spoils the game and immersion. You can tell me why it would be good?

[Stradius]

Absolutely no on the Third Person view. It doesn't make any sense whatsoever. I don't see why PGI can't just make a proper, IN-GAME tutorial and teach new players how to become better mechwarriors. Instead of dumbing down the game and making it "easy". Hell, give them more UI **** if that is what is necessary.

Besides, I don't think that will really help the problem being targeted, as people who have issues with the concept of legs/torso will still continue to make the mistake in third person. And all that will be accomplished is ruined immersion and MWO turning from a mech sim into any other action shooter out there.

Edited by Stradius, 15 November 2012 - 11:16 AM.

[Oriius]

Antasius, on 15 November 2012 - 11:08 AM, said:

To clearify, it's about immersion. The purists don't want anything "unrealistic" to MW logic happening in game. WoT lets you play with Axis and Allied tanks on the same side... among other "unrealistic" options.

The trick is to please the purists by making 3rd person mode fit into the lore.

I think it less to do with purists and more to do with playstyle issues and the way inwhich a third person view will change the gameplay.

Also it appears to be trying to treat a symptom (new players finding controls hard) instead of treating the cause (lack of tutorials/instructions). The treatment for the symptom has side effects as have been outlined many times in this very topic. While the effect of treating the cause has none (at least as far as gameplay goes, it will have cost in terms of the dev's actualy having to create it)

Edited by Oriius, 15 November 2012 - 11:17 AM.

[Nightex]

I'm going to go ahead and use my first post ever on these forums to express how completely i am against the inclusion of 3rd person camera into this game.

DO NOT WANT

[Saint Rigid]

^ This guy. If there is anyone important reading this thread right now, focus on Like a Sir's entry above.

Also, please no third person view. You of course know better than anyone how limited resources are. Please do not spend precious resources working on coding the third person view before other things are established. Most notably, any kind of help for new players. New players aren't having trouble playing because they are in first person view... they are having trouble because you have not had the time to five them ANY instructions on how to play. They are forced to search the forums or figure it out on their own. I did this myself, and I was happy to as a BETA tester (narrowly made into Closed Beta, still counts!), but not everyone shares my enthusiasm.

Please spend time making REAL tutorials and REAL weapon descriptions and listing information. Please.

[FactorlanP]

Nightex, on 15 November 2012 - 11:18 AM, said:

I'm going to go ahead and use my first post ever on these forums to express how completely i am against the inclusion of 3rd person camera into this game.

DO NOT WANT

Don't forget to visit this thread: http://mwomercs.com/...son-its-coming/

Show your displeasure.

Vote

Edited by FactorlanP, 15 November 2012 - 11:21 AM.

[Monky]

http://mwomercs.com/...g-of-your-mech/

Created a thread discussing an alternative (3d rendering of mech wireframe in cockpit) reception has been extremely positive so far. I also sent in an email to support and was directed to link/redirect the information/idea here.

Edited by Monky, 15 November 2012 - 11:23 AM.

[GutterBoy5]

dont do it,it destroyed MW4 mercs it will destroy MWO. if 75 pages of negative feedback doesnt stop you,then im out. people came here inc me to play MW how MW is to be played. ive been playing MW for 10yrs. only ever played the 1st PV ,hated 3PV its crap & those that do use think there godlike cause of there advantage,infact there lame.

do it & you will lose many of your real fanbase which will be longterm.. pugs are short term no mater what.

new ppl need a tutorial i agree 100% thats what your problem is.. & your matchmaking needs to be team vs team. pug v pug.& maybe new player ( -50 games) vs new player.

[Dethfyre]

No 3rd Party View please.

Thanks.