Koshirou, on 06 April 2013 - 09:06 AM, said:
I see you didn't get the point of my response even though I highlighted the facepalm-inducing part about the Clans "proving" something. So I guess I'm gonna spell it out again:
The Clans are a poorly thought out piece of fiction! They are not a real society, nor a plausible model of one. Their accomplishments in the fiction only prove one thing: That people on FASA's writing staff had an unhealthy fancrush for them.
Now, thinking up fictional societies isn't always a bad thing. A lot of good science fiction works that way. It's a nice mental exercise if done well. But the Clans aren't a rigorous thought experiment on a possible future society, they are a juvenile power fantasy.
Actually I find their culture and premise interesting and amazing. The premise, "What if Native Americans and Indians had been technologically superior, and invaded Eurasia instead of the other way around?" is, in itself, something a person could write an entire series about.
Furthermore, there is the previous Battletech mythos, already developed. The lost armies of the SLDF. The fact that while the Inner Sphere lost so much technology, the Clans not only retained it but improved it.
This, in part, is one aspect I like a lot- the
asymmetry of it. If the Clans were perfectly balanced with Inner Sphere forces in some way, say the Great Houses had superior ballistic and missile weapons and the Clans had superior energy weapons, the Clans had faster Mechs vs IS better armor, then I would agree it was immature fantasy, since that is how less mature people think- in terms of everything being absolutely equal, and balanced and fair no matter what. Such is the reasoning of an immature brat. But the Clans were better in every way- technologically AND meritocratic, they had better Mechs as well as better Mechwarriors, and that made them far more interesting because the projection of a universe that rejected
just universe theory presents a very mature point of view and allows us to suspend our disbelief more easily. Things in the real world are not always fair, most of us will admit this publicly but rationalize the unfairness we see in everyday life as "balanced out" in some way because it is easier then facing such injustice head on. Fairness is an idea, something we must work towards
because the universe is unfair. If everything was already fair, then we could just settle on what we see. It is because things are not that we must work harder to ensure that truth, justice and freedom are extended and secured as paramount values. The Clans are a brutal reminder of this in the Battletech fiction, and while all fiction generally has an
element of an escape from reality, the Clans serve as a chronic moralistic reminder that things are not always fair in the real world or in fiction- things are sometimes overall better and overall worse, and perhaps it is
that which makes some readers and gamers uncomfortable because it intrudes on their idealizations.
The Clan politics are also very intricate and amazingly presented- at first they appear simplistic and mysterious and such a veneer has never gone away. But what initially appears as a simplistic warrior culture is eventually presented as complex and intricate and in many ways far more evolved then that of the Successor States. You really have to read the
Wars of Reaving to realize just how complex the Clan's political system is, with the Merchant Castes engaged in an endless series of trades and debts in a complex economic balancing act, with the Councils and Loremasters and Oatkeepers 9 out of 19 times superseding and overruling and bypassing the Khans, and the various Clans at times nearly opposites culturally and militarily. You are also able to see that there is a deeper meaning to their Trials and actions then "survival of the fittest" or "the best fighter wins". Various Civilians Castes have their own Trials which do not include combat but tests of labor, intelligence, dexterity and natural talent with respect to their relevant fields. One finds that their technological edge is attained because they have ritualized war, and have strong moralistic/honor-based undertones in their culture. The same sense of honor that most Spheroid citizens see as a weakness are actually the reason why the Clans have progressed technologically while the Great Houses declined- they limited warfare to ritual, and were able to make sure conflict was limited to such by moralistic honor codes.
Add to that the Scientist Caste, which has far more power then any realize- as they ultimately control the genes and in general are the
evaluators of genetic material. Their role is thus often times subtle but profound.
There is the fact that while it is not said and acknowledged directly- that the lower castes enjoy more luxuries then the higher castes. This shows why the Clans are not overly prone to rebellion- fighting to get to the top confers honor and power, but being demoted means you from a diet primarily consisting of rations to steak dinners. Clanners still strive to get ahead as Warriors because the idea of honor as the highest value is ingrained in them from birth, but the fact is in many ways Warriors living a poorer quality of life then the "Lower" Castes and this plays a critical role in curbing rebellious tendencies.
The strangest things about the Clans is despite the fact that they suggest genetic determinism and seem to accept it as an ideology, they are direct proof of the massive role environment plays in both upbringing and behavior. In fact, the very reasons they are the way they are is
because they were put in an environment where resources were so scarce and military rule was the norm. They attain victory mostly because they have superior technology, and while superior genes- in the sense that such are more specialized for their respective roles- compounds this, having weapons and engines at twice the weight and requiring less space while packing a greater punch at longer range plays an undeniable role in their conquests. Then there is the sibko, their sense of lore, the fact that they so often deny what we would consider human nature in such a communistic manner, etc. Culture and environment plays a huge role in the Clans.
In fact their honor-driven communistic nature shows how precisely environment undercuts genetics and human nature in many respects. Human nature would imply we act in a hedonistic fashion, but the Clans eschew a higher quality of life again and again because they were
raised to take such pride in honor. Many Warriors go against their rational self-interest all the time,
including their survival instinct because they wish to attain honor. They don't even have kids directly but contribute their genes to an abstract breeding program.
I am not saying that nurture always trumps nature, but if you look between the lines you see just how big, and often times eclipsing role environment plays over genetics.
Last, despite the fact that they are ostensibly a collectivist culture we find strong individualist tendencies. As was said about Aidan Pryde, the Clan system of repression of the individual was not made to prevent powerful, willful people like such from arising but to create them. This reflects the strong individualist, "cult of personality" tendencies we see in collectivist movements so often. The Communists often argue that the Individual means nothing compared to the group or collective- but then basically worship Marx, Lenin, Trotsky, Engels and Stalin as Prophets and Gods. North Korea argues the nation should always be put first, the individual is just a part- but then they bow down to "Dear Leader" and attribute to him almost super-human strength, as did China with Mao. Despite their protestations to the contrary, the collectivists always acknowledge the importance of the individual in some way, and such happens all the time with the Clans. The Clans, by trying to act collectivist, actually end up dominated almost wholly by their individualist rule-breakers and
ristars. This is perfectly logical, as you can imagine the more uniform the herd is, the more a member not exactly like the others tends to influence the rest of the herd because they stick out and are consequently more noticed by such.
In this same spirit, it is
because the Clans are so great in almost every way, and mary-sue, and demi-god with their super-mechs that they stick out and reinforce the premise of the Battletech universe which is gritty, brutal and unjust. After so much Successor State conflict, where everything seemed set in stone, and it seemed like nothing new was under the sun, and everything seemed so predictable, their sudden appearance showed even this premise, that everything is unjust, cannot be taken for granted. The arrival of the Clans, and their Crusade, stripped away many illusions of those who had settled into a false sense of security, and in such a way it has kept players on their toes, and sharpened the wits of those who play as the Successor States.
Just think of it- the Clans were presented as an
already developed system where Mechs could be designed, in terms of raw numbers, more powerful then that of the Inner Sphere but still balanced against each other and to an extent the greater numbers of the Successor States and Comstar (not completely, as Clan force multiplier thus far had demolished IS numbers, especially their Naval Superiority, but it was not like a Clan Star could destroy an entire Inner Sphere battalion, so it was still believable.) This does not sound like an immature creation to me but the extension of a highly mature meta-fiction. Believe whatever the heck you want, but I actually find the Clans to be the best thing to ever happen to Battletech, and will admit that without them I might never have gotten into the series at all.
I went from MW2 and the 3050 Genesis game, playing Clan, to preferring Inner Sphere as I got more into lore, to Republic of Sphere, to back to Clan (Wolf) to more of a preference for DCMS and Clan Wolf but leaning more heavily to playing Wolf atm. The fact is the Clans are a good opening for new players. And then you learn about them and dismiss them as fascists/socialists/totalitarians, but the more you learn about them again, the more you learn how different they are then your second impressions. The Clans really shine at third impression, and that is, in itself (not counting all other extensive aspects, which I barely touched by this post) a sign of a very mature, intelligent, well-thought-out aspect of Battletech.
Going by first impressions primarily is immature, by second impressions- more mature, by third, more mature still. The Clans really shine at the third impression- after you played them in games, after you rejected them upon learning the lore, and after you learned about them again when learning more about the lore. That hardly sounds like a juvenile fantasy to me, but more an act of growing up and looking past appearances. It is akin to first starting as extremely idealistic, then when facing the hardships of the real world, getting more selfish and materialistic, and then, when you are more securing financially, more able to see another's perspective and recognize there is more out there then 'you' at a deeper level, getting more idealistic again because you wish to leave a lasting influence before you die. Yes "If you are conservative when young you have no heart and liberal while old you have no brain" but it is also true that as you get older, you prefer kindness more then smarts. Once you are very old, you realize that all those smart selfish people running around are a dime a dozen, and may at times be more clever in how entertaining they are, but at the end of the day you just want a kind heart around to fall back on. And I imagine this is how civilians see their governments- yes the Successor State governments are a lot more clever, but at the end of the day, it is the Clans that keep them well fed and safe. The bizarre Clan honor code which avoids collateral may seem alien, and foolish when one first learns of the ravages of war, and the deception and ruthlessness which can lead to victory- but as a civilian you appreciate it.
Quote
“When I was young, I admired clever people. Now that I am old, I admire kind people.”
Abraham J. Heschel quotes (Jewish theologian and philosopher, 1907-
1972)
All those acts you dismiss as short-sighted idealism, as "bleeding heart crap"-
that is what has kept you alive in the end. The love shown to you as a member of society was not always rational, and could just as easily have been shown to someone in third world with more potential, but it was
because the people around had bonded with you, and such bonds are beyond reason. People will die for it, and such "honorable death" cannot always be explained at a rational level, but it is recognized as important to those of us who survive and prosper because of it.
Edited by PaintedWolf, 06 April 2013 - 12:43 PM.
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