34 replies to this topic

[stjobe]

Please have a look at this thread by Amaris the Usurper; the findings are valid and confirmed by several people (including myself). Vapor Trail provided a couple of videos of Commandos being one-shotted by a SRM-6 both from behind and from the front.

In a test I did I fired a single SSRM-2 launcher at a COM-1B in the Training Grounds. I was 48m directly in front of the 1B and aimed for the CT:

1st shot takes it down to 84% which means those two SSRMs did 36 damage.
2nd shot takes it down to 69% and strips both side torsos of armour. Damage done: 33.
3rd shot takes it down to 53% and strips the CT and LA. Again, 36 damage.
4th shot kills the 1B.

That's six SRMs, supposed to do 15 damage, doing 105 damage - or seven times as much as they should.

Edit: Now the bug has been confirmed on Live as well: Video by Wardenwolf.

Edited by stjobe, 13 March 2013 - 07:17 PM.

[Monky]

Easiest reproduction step; Take a stock commando 1B in training grounds, count its armor totals and internal structures.

Fire an SRM2 directly at the center torso. Note what is destroyed each volley, and how many volleys it takes for total destruction of CT (you might remove ammo from the mech first to prevent ammo detonation).

If this adds up to what you expect (total damage done to CT = number of missiles fired x 2.5) then no bug. If different, bug. I suggest 30 meter distance in a raven 3L, with a targeting laser as your firing platform. a single SRM2 is sufficient.

[Volume]

Devs, if you see this thread: Please confirm or deny if artillery strikes / air strikes will be using the same splash mechanics.

[Monky]

An additional test - SRM4 + SRM6 vs the rear armor of an awesome. Should deal 25 damage to the rear CT from 30 meters. The Stock awesome comes with 38 rear armor on the CT. A single volley completely removes all rear armor (from CT and both side torsos) and applies internal damage. A second volley completely destroys the mech. As there is no ammo on the AWS-8Q, it is not possibly caused by a premature ammo explosion.

Edited by Monky, 13 March 2013 - 05:17 PM.

[deforce]

the mechs in test grounds are DEF not at full armor, and very far from it.

[Monky]

deforce, on 13 March 2013 - 05:34 PM, said:

the mechs in test grounds are DEF not at full armor, and very far from it.

They have known armor values however, and that is testable.

[LackofCertainty]

At the very least, this is a major testing grounds bug.


If it extends to the normal games, then it is a massive balance bug as well.

[shabowie]

It does not extend outside testing grounds.

The issue is testing grounds is screwed up beyond belief with totally different mechanics for many different things.

[Monky]

It is my suspicion that someone should post video proof before saying something against a bug with video proof. That would be nice.

[shabowie]

Monky, on 13 March 2013 - 05:55 PM, said:

It is my suspicion that someone should post video proof before saying something against a bug with video proof. That would be nice.

Video proof you are referencing is from the training grounds.

Edited by shabowie, 13 March 2013 - 05:58 PM.

[Monky]

Ok, but test it in the server too before saying it is training grounds only. That is how this process works.

Test case scenario. SRM2 + 1 ton of ammo on your mech. An ally with a light mech with 10 armor on all rear faces. Fire until he is cored.

Note when armor comes off and when mech is cored.

Edited by Monky, 13 March 2013 - 06:07 PM.

[Krzysztof z Bagien]

It's probably because training grounds are run client side and server doesn't check if everything is OK.

[shabowie]

Monky, on 13 March 2013 - 06:04 PM, said:

Ok, but test it in the server too before saying it is training grounds only. That is how this process works.

25k SRM hits since Mar 5 patch with average damage of ~2.32 per missile hit.

If SRMs were doing up to 7 times more damage in actual play I would have noticed.

Monky, on 13 March 2013 - 06:04 PM, said:

Test case scenario. SRM2 + 1 ton of ammo on your mech. An ally with a light mech with 10 armor on all rear faces. Fire until he is cored.

Note when armor comes off and when mech is cored.

Knock yourself out. This should have been done before the chicken little threads.

Edited by shabowie, 13 March 2013 - 06:19 PM.

[Monky]

shabowie, on 13 March 2013 - 06:08 PM, said:

25k SRM hits since Mar 5 patch with average damage of ~2.32 per missile hit.

If SRMs were doing up to 7 times more damage in actual play I would have noticed.

That's cool. Show me some videos of actual testing. Your 'damage done' statistic might be bugged as well and not recording any extra.

Edited by Monky, 13 March 2013 - 06:12 PM.

[shabowie]

Thontor, on 13 March 2013 - 06:17 PM, said:

Preliminary tests From the original thread linked in the OP seem to show it happens on the live servers too.


Easiest way to test without spending money of messing with your mech is to drop with a friend, both taking the trial Commando. A single SRM6 to the center torso only should do 15 damage, which shouldn't even breach the armor...

Is anything but a commando being used? This might be a bug with only the commando. Assuming it is happening in actual play.

[HarmAssassin]

Not sure what the original poster is smoking, but SRMs are not doing anywhere near the damage he thinks they are. I use SRMs on just about every mech I have. If they were doing 7 times their listed price, then my Splatcat would be one-shotting every mech it ever fires at (which isn't true).

The original poster was likely killed by multiple SRMs (that when fired as a group only list once on the death screen), and somehow thought he was killed by just one (when he may have been hit with up to 6 of them fired together).

The training grounds is not a good measure, as you don't know what armor those stationary mechs have (and they're not moving - in case you haven't noticed in-game, stationary mechs seem to take more damage then even the slowest moving mech).

[Monky]

shabowie, on 13 March 2013 - 06:20 PM, said:

Is anything but a commando being used? This might be a bug with only the commando. Assuming it is happening in actual play.

The same can occur on the awesome 8Q if you blast its rear CT with a 10 SRM burst (srm 6 + SRM 4 at very close range), two volleys will core it. We seem to have trial mechs that are different variants than the mechs being put in testing grounds.

It seems very dependent on -where- you hit the mech exactly with the missiles. My guess is it spawns a sphere of a certain diameter when a missile impacts, and anything in that diameter has ' sub sections', more sub sections = more damage applied per missile. There does not appear to be any reduction in effectiveness, so long as it occurs inside the sphere it uses to detect what is hit.

Additionally, 'sub sections' are at this time nearly undocumented and poorly understood.

Edited by Monky, 13 March 2013 - 06:27 PM.

[Synra]

Actually, I think you guys are on to something here. Personally, I have been piloting Spiders lately, and while yes, they aren't the most heavily armored mechs out there, I do have mine all at about 200 armor. And with that said, I have been in a LOT of matches lately where I have suddenly and unexpectedly died. I most definitely HAD armor on every bit of my mech. Maybe not full armor, but yellow anyway. Suddenly I am dead, and my death screen shows either SRMs or Streaks as the last thing to hit me.

There was one time in particular. I had armor everywhere, an suddenly my entire left side was nearly gone. All of the armor on my left arm, plus both the front and rear of my left torso was completely gone, and both of those sections were deep red. It was insane. No single hit should have stripped me down like that.

And before anyone asks, I don't believe there was a splatcat anywhere near me in any of these cases. These were from mechs with far less missile hardpoints.

[shabowie]

Monky, on 13 March 2013 - 06:26 PM, said:

The same can occur on the awesome 8Q if you blast its rear CT with a 10 SRM burst (srm 6 + SRM 4 at very close range), two volleys will core it.

On the testing grounds you mean?

Lasers recharge differently on testing grounds vs live. Artemis SRM performance is much tighter on testing ground vs live.

If somebody can show me this happening in live play I will be shocked. With SRM anyways. Streaks I haven't been playing with lately, and with less missiles per volley something being off would be harder to notice.

Edited by shabowie, 13 March 2013 - 06:38 PM.

[shabowie]

Thorntor that is all in testing ground.