160 replies to this topic

[StalaggtIKE]

The question is in the title. Just as we have people that hate how ECM is within MWO, we have those that love it. Here's your chance to share why.

[General Taskeen]

I like abusing ECM, because it is unbalanced.

[StalaggtIKE]

I'm hoping to get people's view of those whom enjoy facing off against it as well.

[Accused]

ECM is almost where it needs to be.

Remember, ECM only effects missiles, target locks, and enemy IFF. PGI will probably remove the enemy IFF and increase the range of target locks.

ECM isn't effective against ballistics or lasers. Meaning only those mechs which are hardpoint dependent on missiles are really affected.

tldr; - Use your eyeballs.

[Tennex]

my 5:1 raven k/d says hi

[RocketmanZero]

When ECM first came out I think it was perceived as OP because not many people new how to deal with it(IMHO). Scouts would just ignore my D-DC and hope somebody else would notice and deal with it, even heavier mechs would back off for fear of fighting an invisible opponent by themselves(for good reason).

However, even with the added PPC effects on ECM (which is a good thing) I think the biggest change is that the hive-mind/community has adapted and gotten used to dealing with ECM. I see LRM boats with tag, scouts using counter to bring attention to a hidden threat, and people in general being more cognizant of the ECM presence on the battlefield.

I think it would be neat to see more active countermeasures to ECM than just another ECM module in counter-mode and I'm sure there are plenty of other things that can be balanced as well. I don't think ECM is the game changer is was at first and its nice to pilot my other Altas builds instead of having my team depend too much on ECM. Again I think this is mostly due the fact that people are used to fighting ECM mechs on the battlefield now......with PPCs

TL;DR: What I like about ECM is how it's changed the dynamic in combat and how the community has adapted their tactics to it after much butt-hurt and whining on the forums(which I still love to read).

Edited by RocketmanZero, 05 April 2013 - 12:33 PM.

[Side Step]

I used to hate ecm, but now I have no issues with it. I simply stopped using SSRM/LRM, so I don't have to rely on luck anymore.

Edited by Side Step, 04 April 2013 - 07:50 PM.

[Nutlink]

Indeed, I've ditched 1/3 of the weapons in the game because they're practically useless thanks to ECM. Ballistics and lasers only for me now.

[Vahnn]

I have no problem with ECM.

If I remember correctly, they are considering increasing the fitting requirements to force players to make a trade-off when equipping ECM, which I approve of, and they're possibly going to remove the effect which disables friendly player icons, which I approve of. ECM is not a big deal in this game unless you rely on Streaks or LRMs for you kills/damage.

I have never used ECM, and I have no problems fighting against it, especially when I'm on a team with a scout and people are communicating enemy locations.

[Side Step]

Vahnn, on 04 April 2013 - 07:53 PM, said:

(...)
If I remember correctly, they are considering increasing the fitting requirements to force players to make a trade-off when equipping ECM,
(...)

Unless I read the command chair post wrong, they're actually just adding a specific ecm-hardpoint to the mechs so ecm is in the same spot on the mech every time (for enemies to shoot). They wouldn't have been able to use that ecm-hardpoint for anything else, so they don't have to sacrifice a weapon hardpoint.

[aniviron]

Tennex, on 04 April 2013 - 07:14 PM, said:

my 5:1 raven k/d says hi

Only 5:1? Anything less than 8:1 is just poor.

[yashmack]

I like using it in my Spider
helps keep me hidden and I can suppress enemy LRM boats with it

In heavier mechs I dont pay it much mind, I dont use missiles much but when I did I would just be sure to equip tag
most of the time I dont even need it though as either we have someone to counter it or it causes me minimal inconvenience enemy mechs still have IFF info when you have line of sight with them so I can still target them, get outside the 180m bubble and streaks work as well
I really dont see it as OP in any way

[Nutlink]

Vahnn, on 04 April 2013 - 07:53 PM, said:

I have no problem with ECM.

If I remember correctly, they are considering increasing the fitting requirements to force players to make a trade-off when equipping ECM, which I approve of, and they're possibly going to remove the effect which disables friendly player icons, which I approve of. ECM is not a big deal in this game unless you rely on Streaks or LRMs for you kills/damage.

I have never used ECM, and I have no problems fighting against it, especially when I'm on a team with a scout and people are communicating enemy locations.

The only downside to ECM right now is weight, which is pretty light. The addition of forcing it to consistently be in the same part of the torso helps, but it's not an answer. I use(d to use) streaks on a few of my builds to help counter light mechs. Now I have to rely on lasers only to do the job, while at the same time my streaks are ultimately useless against even non-ECM mechs whenever one of the buggers is around me. I wouldn't mind it if it was only on one or two mechs on each team, but right now it's closer to about half the mechs I run into seem to be using it.

Hopefully the ballistic state rewind helps fix this a little more as well.

yashmack, on 04 April 2013 - 08:05 PM, said:

get outside the 180m bubble and streaks work as well

Easier said than done when the enemy mech is going over 140kph.

[Adrienne Vorton]

because its an ecm... it works as i imagine an ecm works... plus its by far the smallest concern i have with MWO right now...

[Peiper]

Accused, on 04 April 2013 - 07:10 PM, said:

Remember, ECM only effects missiles, target locks, and enemy IFF. PGI will probably remove the enemy IFF and increase the range of target locks.

ECM isn't effective against ballistics or lasers. Meaning only those mechs which are hardpoint dependent on missiles are really affected.

What?? If I can't FIND the enemy, then my weapons are rendered ineffective. ECM cloaks enemies so I can't shoot at them. It also prevents me from telling WHERE and IF they are hit or damaged. Can't find the weak parts of an enemy mech if I can't SEE where they are damaged.

(I would argue that the amount of information we get on enemy mechs like what they are armed with and what electronics they have is bullcrap, as radar and sensors couldn't tell you any of that. But I would say that should go both ways ECM or no.)

And to the OP:

And yeah, I have fun with my ECM Raven and Spider from time to time, because I feel like I'm playing in God mode. But it's too easy, gets boring, and feels like cheating when I'm fighting non-ecm mechs. So I feel guilty and I go back to my Jenner. (I'm not kidding, I really feel bad for others when I play in God-mode.)

[DocBach]

I'm seeing a trend. People who like ECM dislike the pillar of role warfare where all play styles are suppose to be effective, and are completely fine with the fact that ECM cleaves certain roles from the game.

"It doesn't affect my build, or the weapons I use, so I don't care that it limits what the rest of the player base can bring to a game and be effective."

Edited by DocBach, 05 April 2013 - 12:13 AM.

[Otto Cannon]

ECM is wonderful! Why wouldn't I love a piece of non-canon equipment that almost entirely negates the use of a whole class of weapons?

[mania3c]

I used to dislike ECM..but more I play, more I agree with devs, it's actually good for the game overall..

Yet, I still believe, people using ECM should be forced to be more dedicated to using this tool.. I mean, they should invest more to have fully functional ECM like it is today.

For example... ECM in default form would just delay missile locks..but after spending GPX and module slot, ECM would be improved to current version..

Also make counters better via module upgrades..for example module which would ..for example decrease PPC damage to 8, but increase EMP effect to 20 seconds. or something like that..

Basic idea is that is good there are game changing tools which is forcing team to react on situation..but I believe..players should be more dedicated with their mech loadouts to actually make these specialized builds.

[Sifright]

mania3c, on 05 April 2013 - 01:53 AM, said:

I used to dislike ECM..but more I play, more I agree with devs, it's actually good for the game overall..

Yet, I still believe, people using ECM should be forced to be more dedicated to using this tool.. I mean, they should invest more to have fully functional ECM like it is today.

For example... ECM in default form would just delay missile locks..but after spending GPX and module slot, ECM would be improved to current version..

Also make counters better via module upgrades..for example module which would ..for example decrease PPC damage to 8, but increase EMP effect to 20 seconds. or something like that..

Basic idea is that is good there are game changing tools which is forcing team to react on situation..but I believe..players should be more dedicated with their mech loadouts to actually make these specialized builds.

Awful ideas sorry I completely disagree,

making it a straight XP cost to get the most powerful version of the item is terrible because it is not a limiting factor it just forces a bit of progression into the system before you have the full power item and then you have no other downsides, where as joe blow newbie fights against the ECM with his own which doesn't counter it because he doesn't have the upgraded version.... It's just bad all around.

Trade offs need to occur on the battlefield for it to be meaningful.

The reason XL engines and FF costing lots in R+R game was terrible is because it had no effect on the battlefield directly. Players that could afford it ran them with impunity makes incredible amounts of money and on certain mechs being vastly more effective. Where as those that couldn't were permanently gimped.

Again Balance must occur where the game is. Money concerns are part of the meta play, not the actual combat.

As long as an item isn't balanced in the arena it doesn't matter what its down sides are outside of that.

[mania3c]

Sifright, on 05 April 2013 - 02:00 AM, said:

Awful ideas sorry I completely disagree,

making it a straight XP cost to get the most powerful version of the item is terrible because it is not a limiting factor it just forces a bit of progression into the system before you have the full power item and then you have no other downsides, where as joe blow newbie fights against the ECM with his own which doesn't counter it because he doesn't have the upgraded version.... It's just bad all around.

Trade offs need to occur on the battlefield for it to be meaningful.

The reason XL engines and FF costing lots in R+R game was terrible is because it had no effect on the battlefield directly. Players that could afford it ran them with impunity makes incredible amounts of money and on certain mechs being vastly more effective. Where as those that couldn't were permanently gimped.

Again Balance must occur where the game is. Money concerns are part of the meta play, not the actual combat.

As long as an item isn't balanced in the arena it doesn't matter what its down sides are outside of that.

You are too focused to to XP cost.. but you are clearly denying fact, that module slot to improve ECM is indeed a downside...

You have to sacrifice something to have powerful tool.. which is thing I can agree with.. maybe even overpowered tool is okey if you have to sacrifice other options (and if it has solid counter)..

EDIT: I don't believe is ECM unbalanced functional wise.. only reason it seems to be a bit OP is that you really don't have to be dedicated to be able to these things on battlefield..which is wrong.

Edited by mania3c, 05 April 2013 - 02:06 AM.