36 replies to this topic

[Bad Andy]

wow this is nuts

[Jaded Jasper]

How does compass heading possibly even enter into this?!

Fixing this bug would make Hunchbacks considerably more useable!

[Kszyh]

I think I was a bit unclear in my last sentence. This problem looks a bit more complicated than simple crosshair drift. Shots are drifting too, in the same direction as the crosshair (at least when mech is facing east or west), but as the distance to target decreases, the deviation increases. In other words - real aiming point is affected both by the mech's heading and the distance to target, while the crosshair position is influenced only by the first factor.

Here's some screenshots which should explain the situation.
http://imgur.com/a/g77te

[Budor]

/bump

[Felicitatem Parco]

Kszyh, on 27 April 2013 - 01:47 AM, said:

I think I was a bit unclear in my last sentence. This problem looks a bit more complicated than simple crosshair drift. Shots are drifting too, in the same direction as the crosshair (at least when mech is facing east or west), but as the distance to target decreases, the deviation increases. In other words - real aiming point is affected both by the mech's heading and the distance to target, while the crosshair position is influenced only by the first factor.

Here's some screenshots which should explain the situation.
http://imgur.com/a/g77te

Yeah... I'm sure it's not a super-simple bug... but the fact that it's being narrowed-down to the functional linkage between the HUD's various elements is the first time anyone has gotten beyond the observation that "Hunchbacks can't shoot worth **** at range."

I reported this MONTHS ago when I was playing with AC/2s and thought it was a simple thing... but it seems to have persisted until now. I'm glad at least we're getting to understand what's "causing" this problem, because before I thought hunchbacks had varying accuracy depending on what map you were in... but, really, it was becauce I kept performing my tests while facing in random cardinal directions

[Felix Reynolds]

Great to finally have some confirmation on what is causing this- was definitely something that had me scratching my head a time or two.



And best of luck with the ticket- I am a bit disillusioned now with the whole process as attempting to perform the same testing on the ssrm-ct-damage bug and then submit it got me stonewalled, so if you do end up getting a resolution of any kind wrapped up I will happily take lessons.

EDIT- Just answered my own question by actually reading through the thread on my phone. Derp. Looking forward to hearing if any tentative dates for fixing get kicked back!

Edited by Felix Reynolds, 27 April 2013 - 08:01 AM.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Well, right now it's the weekend, so come Monday they'll see a bunch of tickets and replies... hopefully they have already found either a solution or workaround, or they can get it worked over as part of their ongoing HUD optimizations.

[arghmace]

I and my brother tested this and the shots actually go to to middle but both the aiming crosshairs lean towards north. You can see this most easily by looking east/west and then zooming in. In max zoom the crosshairs aren't even nearly in the middle of those six weapon group boxes.

[Hauser]

Jaded Jasper, on 27 April 2013 - 12:50 AM, said:

How does compass heading possibly even enter into this?!

The position and rotation of your mech are stored as a matrix.
The rotation of your CT is stored as a matrix.
The convergence of your weapons in the CT is stored as a matrix.

To know where your shot is going these three are multiplied.

Because of rounding errors and such there can be bias to a specific direction. I suspect that the bias for the cross hairs and torso weapons are going in different directions.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Hauser, on 01 May 2013 - 04:20 AM, said:

The position and rotation of your mech are stored as a matrix.
The rotation of your CT is stored as a matrix.
The convergence of your weapons in the CT is stored as a matrix.

To know where your shot is going these three are multiplied.

Because of rounding errors and such there can be bias to a specific direction. I suspect that the bias for the cross hairs and torso weapons are going in different directions.

Well, the torso and arm reticules are both affected to the same degree, in the same direction, with this particular bug instance. If you aim West, both reticules will drift to the right (Northward) but your shots will go pretty much straight through the center of the screen... giving the appearance that both your arm and torso weapons are shooting to the South.

Something tells me they just gave all of the Hunchbacks a slightly-misplaced centerpoint relative to the Compass, and the interdependence of the compass/reticules/rangefinder to calculate Convergence or tell the server where your shots are going might play a role in this observation..

Edited by Prosperity Park, 01 May 2013 - 08:57 AM.

[aniviron]

Look! I got you some images!






The first screencap is just showing the off-centre crosshair when you face east. The second show something else interesting: if you zoom in, it actually gets further off-center! I know, right? It's like a giant 'screw you' to hunchback pilots. "Oh, you want to aim precisely? Here, let me make that even harder."

If I had a way to capture video on this computer, I would also show a recording of the crosshair going left and right over and over as you spin in a circle. It's actually pretty amusing to watch.

edit: better image host

Edited by aniviron, 01 May 2013 - 11:42 PM.

[Sephlock]

aniviron, on 01 May 2013 - 11:22 PM, said:

Look! I got you some images!

.....


.....


The first screencap is just showing the off-centre crosshair when you face east. The second show something else interesting: if you zoom in, it actually gets further off-center! I know, right? It's like a giant 'screw you' to hunchback pilots. "Oh, you want to aim precisely? Here, let me make that even harder."

If I had a way to capture video on this computer, I would also show a recording of the crosshair going left and right over and over as you spin in a circle. It's actually pretty amusing to watch.

http://www.fraps.com/download.php

Edited by Prosperity Park, 02 May 2013 - 08:20 AM.
fixed formatting

[Felicitatem Parco]

Yeah, if you zero the throttle and just stand there while holding "A" or "D" to make your Mech spin in a circle, you can watch the Arm and Torso reticules sway back and forth like pendulums. They will go back and forth between the left and the right, always drifting toward the north side.

All Hunchback Variants... all of them.. this makes me sad. I have been running Heavy Mechs for a long time because of this.. I WANT MY HUNCHIE SNIPERS BACK

*weeps*

Edited by Prosperity Park, 02 May 2013 - 08:23 AM.

[Omid Kiarostami]

We found the issue causing it and have a fix on the way. For the curious, it's due to the way we shift the camera forward a bit in the hunchbacks cockpit. The effect is localized entirely to the crosshair - ie, your weapons fire straight even if the cross hair is off.

It should be resolved in the May 21st patch. Thanks for finding this!

[Felicitatem Parco]

[DragonsFire]

Omid Kiarostami, on 02 May 2013 - 05:20 PM, said:

We found the issue causing it and have a fix on the way. For the curious, it's due to the way we shift the camera forward a bit in the hunchbacks cockpit. The effect is localized entirely to the crosshair - ie, your weapons fire straight even if the cross hair is off.

It should be resolved in the May 21st patch. Thanks for finding this!

Glad to see a fix in the works for this, may have to drive my founders hunchy once again!

[aniviron]

Omid Kiarostami, on 02 May 2013 - 05:20 PM, said:

We found the issue causing it and have a fix on the way. For the curious, it's due to the way we shift the camera forward a bit in the hunchbacks cockpit. The effect is localized entirely to the crosshair - ie, your weapons fire straight even if the cross hair is off.

It should be resolved in the May 21st patch. Thanks for finding this!

Thank you so much. <3