18 replies to this topic

[HarmAssassin]

Of the 6 friends I've invited to try the game, 4 have since left due to all the bugs and imbalance.

[Ingvay]

I've re-posted my reply from an older thread:

I'd like to relay my recent attempt to get a friend to try MWO.

I got him started a few days ago, went into the training grounds (which he laughed at and asked "where is the actual tutorial? Like in older MW games??"). I told him there wasn't one. He laughed again. He got the hang of it and I showed him a few of the basics.

As of tonight he has done 12 matches. Here are a few of his comments to me when I asked if he liked it:

He said it was...OK.

Graphics were pretty decent, but he could only get 20-25 fps and his rig is as good or better than mine. He told me that he died in every match, and he played a Cent. Trial in 6 and a Raven in the others. He asked how as a new player he was supposed to manage his heat and rate of fire, while getting hammered by enemy mechs that were buzzing around him firing like crazy. Good question... since we know the trial mechs are kind of lame.

His early matches with the Cent. I guess he faced a swarm of lights that just lit him and his teams up badly. So he tried the trail Raven and found life only slightly better.

Overall, he felt that there was a steep learning curve and that there is not much fun in the game for a noob. When he asked me how long until he could start winning a decent amount of his matches....I laughed, then sighed and told him that I've been playing off and on since December and I still die/and or lose way more than I win.

He last comment was that there was not much to do other than drops for death matches and that both game formats are pretty similar as they stand. I asked him how many different maps he got to try?.... four.]

I can't say that I disagree with him, his initial impressions were similar to my own. MWO doesn't have much to offer new players in the way of fun. 12 deaths in a row really gets you excited about a new game doesn't it?

Update: He hasn't given up on the game completely, but said he's been on once since then and may wait until release to try it again. Generally, he was not as impressed as he thought he would be.

Edited by Ingvay, 26 April 2013 - 07:27 PM.

[Aklor]

I am waiting to have any of my friends try out this game until the bugs have been fixed and more content is released, which will probably be after launch. I want them to stick around, so I am going to wait. The only reason I am still here is because I loved the TT games as a kid and I believe they will make a great game.

I have invested in this company and they are not getting any more of my money until they wipe out the major bugs and drop some more content.

[jozkhan]

This goes back to around Christmas time... I have a big gaming buddy who I go way back with... way way back to old skool RPG and tabletop. In fact he ran a Euro Battletech charity tournament (a long time back) so I figured he was ripe for MWO.

As a bit of background he spends ALOT of money on pc gaming even among hardcore gamers.

His first impressions were that he was truly appaled with the trial mechs and the fact he knew something about Battletech plus he loves games where you can tinker with builds and in my mind is a true master of finding those really cool, funny cheese builds.

So he wasnt having any of that with the trial mechs, he just slapped about £60 ($120) down and bought what he liked and off he went.

It was around the time of ECM and lights everywhere and the few games he played before we managed to drop together were brutal and he complained alot about the lights. We dropped together and I said I would simply act as his escort and protect him while he got to grips with the game.

But it didnt work out because either one of us or both us either disconnected or suffered from a no HUD, no IFF type bug

after a few games of that, even though he dropped the cash down on it, he was gone and I cant get him to come back even though he was more into and more knowledgeable about Battletech / Mechwarrior than I am.

he also felt the tiny palette of maps made it very tedious

sadface

other friends I have tried to recruit, like my League of Legends buddies wont even touch it, one because they have heard bad things from others and the all the others because they think its P2W oh and 1 other because there is no PvE

Edited by jozkhan, 27 April 2013 - 07:55 AM.

[KKillian]

I have many friends I have gotten to try this game, almost every single one of them was turned off by the minimap and IFF bugs. Some of these people are literally pro sponsored gamers, some are completely casual, all of them said the same thing. Turned off by all the bugs, but the game looks great and to let them know once "it's out of beta". This is about the time I explain to them that it seems to be going the route of all the tower defense F2P games that claim beta pretty much for the extent of their lifetime, but I will let them know when those little bugs are fixed.

Much later, All of these bugs still exist and actually I started crashing to desktop about a week ago. Nothing in my system had changed at all so I ensured my ATI drivers were up to date and updated the rest of the main hardware components that had updates available. No luck, still crash every 10-15 games about once, and have IFF or broken minimap or both at least 1 in 5 games.

They need to stop revamping forums, stop adding content, and stop tweeking weapons until they FIX THE STABILITY. With so many great games available online these days noone except a fanboy is going to stick around and play through the pain.

These issues have turned off EVERY SINGLE PERSON I have suggested play the game, at least 10 people and another buddy was going to get his clan playing until he got pissed at the bugs and left himself. Again these people are not just random kids they are grown men I have played games with for many years, they learn quickly and are very skilled players at any game they put their hands on. The turnoff is the lack of stability, not the attitude of a player with an ego, those people usually make better targets.

Plz fix basic bugs, or hire a guy that can, or release the code to the public and let us fix it for you. The community battletech mod for crysis was more stable than this, great quality, just lacking player base due to its release years after crysis was forgotten.

[TLBFestus]

At least they have marginally improved the new player experience since the early days. I'm hoping that they are not satisfied with it yet for the very reasons/descriptions in the posts above.

If I could make a change in it I would make sure that the new player had a proper training ground experience that was MANDITORY, with simple AI opponents, and logically ordered set pieces that rant hem through movement, firing, heat management and the mechlab.

With the mechlab module I would allow them to customize any mech they want for 3-6 times in the training grounds at no cost, just so they get a taste of how the mechlab works.

After that, they would enter the PVP portion of the game. I would allow them to pick ONE free mech that is totally customizable and give them increased c-bill and XP for the first 10-20 matches.

Why? TO GET THEM HOOKED.

- They get a mech of their own, one they have "investment" in. It 's called a "loss leader" in retail, and lot's of businesses use this approach, losing a bit to get the customer in the doors, and making up for it with additional sales once they are in the store.

- They get experience using the mechlab almost immediately. It's a big chunk of the game that's not new player accessible enough, and the devs have under utilized it's appeal.

-

[Edson Drake]

I tried bringing in friends that love the FPS genre.

All of above is true, the trial mechs are horrible. I'm a big fan of the franchise, so I knew that by buying my own mech would make the game more enjoyable, and boy, it does. However they weren't pacient enough to keep going until cadet bonus kicked in to buy their first mech.

Also, bugs. The HUD, map, and all annoying current bugs really scare players away. Sure, we're in beta and even they admitted that "sure once final arrives maybe I'll touch it again", but really it is a bad first impression and a serious one.

However it was the same from every Mechwarrior game as well. This game should be hard.

I loved MW2: Mercs, my first MW game. It was a nightmare to learn, but I thought it was so cool, I kept playing even though it took me about 3 tries to finish every mission. It was rewarding, I became a better player(in MW that is) and more and more attracted to the franchise.
This isn't the game for everybody, this is a niche genre and especially niche franchise, not everyone has the patience to keep playing until you start to get good, they want to kick *** right away(most FPS these days do that *cough* Crysis *cough*).

There are problems in the player base sure, the bugs are mostly the culprit, but also its the MW franchise is a hard one to make the typical FPS player stay.

[FrostCollar]

I tried bringing in a friend who plays a lot of World of Tanks. He ground out a nice new Cataphract with his cadet bonus and soon after gave up on the game. Basically, he found himself not knowing most of the game mechanics and dying repeatedly. I tried to help him, but no amount of advice can make bad games fun in retrospect, so he left.

I'm still here because I like MechWarrior games. The CB experience I had was excruciating and the new player experience is still rather bad, partially because so many pitfalls lie in the game design. Normal engines on light mechs, XL engines on medium mechs, LB-X 10s, small pulse lasers, single heat sinks, etc. All these might look viable on paper but really they're traps for new players to fall into and do poorly. That's a major problem.

[FeiHu0]

Suggestion: While the new player is still earning the cadet C-Bill bonus, they only play with other cadets. Set new accounts ELO to -100 or something, which doesn't change, so they only get matched with other new players and once their cadet bonus finishes, their ELO is set to normal and they play with the rest of the vets.

[Lightfoot]

My friends don't play games. Except for one. He likes MWO and so does his brother-in-law. They both played MW4 also, and we all use a joystick as the controller. I can't understand how players can play MWO with a Mouse. Got to be frustrating even if you get used to it, so probably frustrating for new players. You get total immersion with a Joystick. That's all I know about what might be holding new players back.

[Davers]

Neverfar, on 26 April 2013 - 06:20 PM, said:

I am very certain that at least a few of us on the forum have invited a friend to try this game at some point (share your stories, they are welcome here!). My grave concern is the outcome of these experiences, not just then, but now. If the people I've brought into Mechwarrior Online are any indication, this game is in trouble.

Please, spare the posturing and puffing up of the chest if you're about to do it about your "skill" and how all the people who leave are "terribad scrubs" or whatever. Online games need new people to stick around, to get better, to keep interested, or it'll be a WASPy stuffy exclusive club of snobby "pro gamers" that will wonder why someone shut the lights off and locked the doors when the revenue dries up.

All MMOs it seems, especially ones with PvP mechanics, have an issue of hostility toward new players. That's not new, and the recruits I found had pretty thick skins for that. What bothered them was the game itself and how hostile it was to their attempts to play it.

Many of these issues have been discussed before: the trial mechs bring death traps, a lack of a meaningful tutorial, an unintuitive way to get to the training grounds (simply dismissing questions in-game with jerk responses like "go to training grounds/google it..." is not a way to win friends), and the current "metagame" taking out unwary Mechs so quickly they don't even get to figure out what got them except that tiny group of jumping pixels in the distance that just center-torso-cored them without hitting much of anything else, all these things have lead to all my recruits taking off for other games.

At the heart of this, I feel, is the current issue of some game mechanics needing adjustment, but the stalwart holy defenders of these mechanics (invariably people who benefit from them) name-calling, boasting about their "skill" like we're all in a big online locker room and they're having a comparison contest, and putting down anyone and everyone who had a hard time. This isn't the first game where "noob" was the first insult, but it's just as poisonous here as it is elsewhere.

Like it or not, "elites", you're going to need new players, inexperienced players, "scrubs" or whatever you want to call them to stick around too. Call anything to make their arrival and stay more comfortable "dumbing down" if you wish. The hyperbole only serves to show inflexibility. The best PVP games are "easy to get into, difficult to master" and that's exactly where Mechwarrior Online should be.

I'm not doing a "TL;DR". If you can't bear to read complete thoughts, that's your issue. I find it weird that people feel the need to share their inability to read long posts.

You sure do a lot of pontificating. As you said in another thread, you enjoy using your 3L and abusing the broken missile mechanics. That plus ECM (something the entire community said was terrible for new players), and until the recent HSR and hit box fix the fact that Ravens were very difficult to hit means that you have made a mech that is perfect for ruining a new players experience.

Lightfoot, on 29 April 2013 - 02:24 PM, said:

My friends don't play games. Except for one. He likes MWO and so does his brother-in-law. They both played MW4 also, and we all use a joystick as the controller. I can't understand how players can play MWO with a Mouse. Got to be frustrating even if you get used to it, so probably frustrating for new players. You get total immersion with a Joystick. That's all I know about what might be holding new players back.

I might argue that more people are familiar with a mouse than a joystick. How many people use joysticks on their work computers?

[Junkman7mgte]

Another "new" player here. Played MW1-4 on PC, but never any online versions. Have played HALO, and I am a WOW vet, amomg other games that I have toyed with. That said, I'm not new to gaming by any means, and, personaly, I'm hooked on MWO.

Enough of an intro, on to adding to the topic.

First and foremost, I have to agree that the trial mechs blow chunks. That alone, caused me to think twice "more like several times" whether I would even stick it out through the cadet bonus matches. The allure of a customisable mech, kept me at it. On a simialr note, that whole time, I was wishing for a PVE option, to get back "into the groove". The training grounds are total BS .... whoopie, learn basic movements, shoot non-moving targets.

Second, and in addition to above ....
1. Make trial mechs better, using known in game loadouts.
2. As mentioned above by another poster, 1st mech should be free, so you have at least minimal investment.

^^^ those are eother or ^^^
3. Extend the cadet bonus to 50 matches ......

Why # 3 you may ask ?

Most newer players are going to come from other games, and probably never had the chance to play the earlier games ... it has been 10 years. They more than likely will not have a clue, as to what mech should be their first purchase "assuming no free first mech, or limited choices if enacted". 50 matches gives you enough c-bills at cadet bonus rate, to pick up 2 different mechs, quickly, by comparison. That considered, if a new player hates his first purchase, they will more often than not, at least try a second. That give the community, a much better chance at retaining that new player.

As for talking to gamer friends about MWO ..... My teenage son, wants to play, his PC isn't up to par, and my normal gaming rig is being "rebuilt", so he can't have this one He will be here, and will stay as long as I do. He's also the arrogant little *****, that will hand you your ***, in every game he touches, lmao. I have many other gamer friends, I haven't even talked to yet about the game, mostly because of the beginner experience, and the crap trial mechs. They range from casual lets get together and play "something" to hardcore, lets have a LAN party weekend, and live on pizza and energy drinks for 48 hours. Lastly, my 72 yo father, is a semi harcore gamer.... ie. - He loves to play many games, but, the learning curve here, with a pvp drop into the wolf's den, makes it so I've told him to just stay away, until things change ... if they do.

I know, my thoughts are a bit random. I've been reading the forums, playing when I have the time, and just in general trying to get a feel for it all. Being the FNG here has been mind numbing to say the least. And, that's after being in WOW and on their forums for the last 4 years. You folks here, are f'ing brutal to say the least ... not all, but enough, that alone keeps me from mentioning the game to more than close family and friends.

[Donnie Silveray]

Of all the folks I brought into MWO I'll illustrate here:

#1
Legendary Founder
Very easily distracted, already has founder mechs and so much MC to spare he can buy everything. He appears to just be bored and waiting out new features.

#2
MWO too much for his laptop. He may get a beefier computer after college and a job, but he's into League of Legends and World of Tanks... and EVE Online . He's no slouch, but right now he doesn't want to touch MWO due to performance.

#3
Had a lot of fun with this one and he has had fun too. However his preferred build, 2 LBX10 and 4MG is essentially ineffective given current game balance. Additionally he has no other build ideas in mind aside from this one and nothing to shoot for. The shoddy bugs and game balancing don't make it any easier. He's on break from this game.

#4
Computer not good enough to run this game. Saving $200 for a new GPU.

#5
He's a PPC Cata 3D, but hasn't had the time or interest in MWO for now.

So to recap, 2 have performance issues, 1 is bored, 1 lost interest, 1 waiting for bugs and balancing to be resolved.

#6
Me
I'm currently not playing MWO because of the current meta and crippling bugs. Lost interest in grinding my Cata 3D so I'm waiting out for new features, bug fixes, balance adjustments before I recommit. I'm a hardcore MechWarrior fan, so I'm not likely going to give this game up and not likely to stop paying for it, but I honestly don't want to play this game right now as it is.

Edited by Donnie Silveray, 29 April 2013 - 03:19 PM.

[Davers]

Neverfar, on 29 April 2013 - 05:07 PM, said:

I take it because you find people you disagree with to be such unsavory blowhards, that you are absolutely fine and all your tactics are sound and none of your Mechs need readjustment. Right.

Seems you are pretty quick to judge people yourself. Who are all these 'elitists' that you keep complaining about? What are they saying that has you all bent out of shape? Maybe if you clarified your stance? It seems that you have clumped everyone who plays in a group, is not a fan of LRMs, and uses effective builds as 'elite players who are ruining the game for new players'.

Maybe people who use 'mechs that need adjustments' are just like you, using them until they are tuned? Why does that make them bad, but you not? Saying "I use streaks even though I know they are working incorrectly is fine, but boating PPCs is just wrong" is hypocritical. According to your logic if they say that they know they are broken and will be nerfed then it is fine if they keep using them, right?

You are also the one doing all the name calling. Everyone who disagrees with you is a 'locker room bully'. Maybe if you stopped being condescending to people that have a different opinion than you people would actually have a conversation with you. You made several threads and posts complaining about the 'elitists' who are 'ruining' the forums, but you are the one being hostile.

[Davers]

Neverfar, on 29 April 2013 - 05:46 PM, said:

A simple "no u" combined with a "u mad" package would have said all you just posted in a complete package, improved the effectiveness and relevance of such, and in some metaphysical way would be more on-topic in this thread.

Move along please. If you don't agree with the topic, at least disagree with the topic instead of doing weird projectionist hypocritical grandstanding. You're not impressing anyone.

So you replied with memes, just as you mocked others for doing in your other thread? Cool story bro.

[Davers]

Neverfar, on 29 April 2013 - 05:57 PM, said:

And yet you're still here. Do you think a sufficient amount of smilies will make you more correct or relevant? If the people I "mocked" need you to white-knight for them, they will call you. I am sure of it.

You might be one of those people who gets very upset when an upstart uses big words and complete sentences in a forum or chatroom and needs to bring that uppity person down a notch. It's not unusual, but it is silly.

I merely asked you to clarify your position. You are the one being antagonistic. You have not responded to a single question put to you, but just keep being condescending and rude. It is a shame your use of complete sentences has not actually done anything to improve the quality of your conversations.

[Prezimonto]

I know several founders who gave up over six months ago, I've recruited about 8 people myself, about 4 still play when I do and 2 play at least a little on their own.

The tedious and unintuitive mech lab makes most people give up before even starting on the "customize your mech to your playstyle".

The trial/stock mechs are mostly awful making customization an absolute must to have a viable mech in the vast majority of cases.

I realize UI2.0 is coming but there's layers of problems in this game for new players.

[William Mountbank]

Do you guys like the MWO XP system? I actually really hate it and think it's a major limit on the performance of new players.

Surely the fact that I can fine tune in the mechlab, and correctly manage my heat, aim, speed and tactics in a match is what gives me my advantage over a new player? Why should he also have to suffer because his mech and weaponry have artificially degraded performance compared to mine?

I understand that it's a standard system for promoting game play time and squeezing players for F2P cash, but does it make IGP more money than if everyone just started with a level playing field? I'm more than happy with the C-Bills mechanic, but everything else should be an equal platform with player skill being the modifier.