20 replies to this topic

[El Bandito]

Quote

AMS

- Damage per bullet 3.5 (up from 2.0)

What is the missile HP anyway?

[Trauglodyte]

If I remember, missile HPs were between 5 and 7?

[El Bandito]

Trauglodyte, on 21 May 2013 - 11:52 AM, said:

If I remember, missile HPs were between 5 and 7?

That means AMS can now destroy up to twice the amount of incoming missiles?

[MechWarrior849305]

El Bandito, on 21 May 2013 - 11:58 AM, said:

That means AMS can now destroy up to twice the amount of incoming missiles?

With new LURMs buff of AMS was needed thing. It was long enough when I was installing AMS on any of my mechs. But today I added it even on D-DC chassis. I'd say "LURMs strike back", but the "feeling" of AMS also is good. Can't say the only one on the team is effective, but I did see missiles got hit

[Tahribator]

You have to take it into account that LRM's move faster now, so AMS has less time to shoot. It's probably not a buff, but simply a damage adjustment to maintain previous effectiveness.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

If everyone would mount AMS, even if you were only around 4 of your teammates it would lower LRM damage a lot.

But everyone got lazy with the ECM cloud.

[AntiCitizenJuan]

I downgraded some weaponry to refit an AMS, I'm not regretting it. It doesnt feel better than it has been, but its helping with the LRMs flying about

[Gevurah]

All missiles have 1 HP, per the devs.

This is a buff I've been asking for for a while; it's pretty much put AMS on the 'useful' list again. A BAP/AMS light mech such as a spider 5k can effectively have some protection against the Raven 3L. In fact, pretty much any light mech can now be viable if played well.

It's also a good way to fight boating because it reduces available tonnage/slots for those weapons and/or their heatsinks/ammo.

[TruePoindexter]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 21 May 2013 - 12:10 PM, said:

If everyone would mount AMS, even if you were only around 4 of your teammates it would lower LRM damage a lot.

But everyone got lazy with the ECM cloud.

I would argue it's more that LRM damage became negligible. If a 3 PPC CTF-3D can just tank out 2x LRM 20 and not break into orange armor it's not what I would call devastating.

[Soy]

I've been running AMS basically entire time, so, any buff is welcome for me. I'm a fan of survival and endurance.

[Roughneck45]

Tahribator, on 21 May 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

You have to take it into account that LRM's move faster now, so AMS has less time to shoot. It's probably not a buff, but simply a damage adjustment to maintain previous effectiveness.

True, but SSRMs have been left alone, so im curious how much of a buff it will be against them.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

TruePoindexter, on 21 May 2013 - 12:14 PM, said:

I would argue it's more that LRM damage became negligible. If a 3 PPC CTF-3D can just tank out 2x LRM 20 and not break into orange armor it's not what I would call devastating.

Nah, I've been using LRM's pretty much the entire time i've played, My main mech for the last 5 months was a Cent with ALRM 15 x 2, and 2 MLas. AMS was definitely absent after ECM took hold. The LRM damage change just exasberated it.

It was nice when ECM didn't show up for some reason.

[Th0rsten]

Tahribator, on 21 May 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

You have to take it into account that LRM's move faster now, so AMS has less time to shoot. It's probably not a buff, but simply a damage adjustment to maintain previous effectiveness.

To negate 20% less time to shoot at the missiles you just need 20% more damage.

[n3ctaris]

Thontor, on 21 May 2013 - 12:41 PM, said:

As far as i know, these are the Variables:
Old AMS DPS: 2.0
New AMS DPS: 3.5
AMS range: 200
Missile health: 1
SSRM speed: 200 meters per second

Using those values, the following can be calculated:

Before. AMS could destroy
2 SSRMs that were fired from 200+ meters away,
1 SSRM fired from between 100-200m away, and
0 SSRMs fired from under 100m away.

Now, AMS should be able to destroy
3 SSRMs fired from 172+,
2 SSRMs fired from between 115-172m away,
1 SSRM fired from between 58-115m, and
0 SSRMs fired from under 58m away.

*these ranges assume both the mech firing the SSRMs, and the mech targeted by them, are stationary. If fired while moving, at a moving target, the actual distance traveled by the missiles, and thus the travel time, will vary.

This is great, now do the same analysis of LRMS!

[Tahribator]

Th0rsten, on 21 May 2013 - 12:25 PM, said:

To negate 20% less time to shoot at the missiles you just need 20% more damage.

Not necessarily, with the changed missile pathing and formation it's not all that "linear".

[MechWarrior849305]

I just add 50 cents of my thoughts about LURMs before and nowdays.

In before, lurms couldn't hit target behind cover, now with new trajectory the actually DO.
SO, for a long time we had statistics about hit% of any weapon ingame. And it was about 33% per 1 lrm missile (in my stats).
Assuming, that lrms did hit mech, that couldn't find cover and/or still trackable in front of LURMs' approaching we had something like this:
Speed of LRM - 100m/s.
Range of LRM - 180...1000m (= 1000-180=820m)
Effective battle range (820*0.33=270m) - 180...180+270=450m
Target trackable time 180/100...450/100 = 1.8...4.5s.

So, I could use them before within 180...450m maximum range to be effective, and hope to have track on mech for 4.5sec of their flight time.

For now, with advanced tracking module, which gives 3.25sec tracking time more (correct me if I wrong), we can rely on LRMs for 6 up to 7.75sec, which increase effective range to 180...(6*120)=720 and up to (7.75*120)=930m. (Still I use them from 500-600m to be sure).
That's the buff I'd say we've been waiting for a long time.
I just don't understand why to buff also damage of missiles, as they are effective now as is.

[El Bandito]

DuoAngel, on 22 May 2013 - 08:02 AM, said:

I just add 50 cents of my thoughts about LURMs before and nowdays. In before, lurms couldn't hit target behind cover, now with new trajectory the actually DO. SO, for a long time we had statistics about hit% of any weapon ingame. And it was about 33% per 1 lrm missile (in my stats). Assuming, that lrms did hit mech, that couldn't find cover and/or still trackable in front of LURMs' approaching we had something like this: Speed of LRM - 100m/s. Range of LRM - 180...1000m (= 1000-180=820m) Effective battle range (820*0.33=270m) - 180...180+270=450m Target trackable time 180/100...450/100 = 1.8...4.5s. So, I could use them before within 180...450m maximum range to be effective, and hope to have track on mech for 4.5sec of their flight time. For now, with advanced tracking module, which gives 3.25sec tracking time more (correct me if I wrong), we can rely on LRMs for 6 up to 7.75sec, which increase effective range to 180...(6*120)=720 and up to (7.75*120)=930m. (Still I use them from 500-600m to be sure). That's the buff I'd say we've been waiting for a long time. I just don't understand why to buff also damage of missiles, as they are effective now as is.

0.7 damage was spitballs. I never used AMS, never even tried to evade incoming missiles pre-patch and just murdered everyone.

[Enigmos]

Firing thirty missiles (two LRM15) on the Canyon map versus what looked like four AMS equipped opponents at roughly 600m, target in the open, it looked like perhaps five missiles struck my target. Of roughly 1000 missiles fired I garnered approximately 250 damage inflicted.

[Roland]

We experimented a bit with AMS, and it seems to be quite effective, even against the masses of LRM boats.

The mechs with dual AMS are actually reasonably useful now. The Stalker 5S, for instance, can mow down a ridiculous number of missiles if you load up dual AMS systems onto it. It sounds hillarious too, like it's got a buzzsaw mounted on the mech.

[MechWarrior849305]

OriginalTibs, on 22 May 2013 - 08:11 AM, said:

Firing thirty missiles (two LRM15) on the Canyon map versus what looked like four AMS equipped opponents at roughly 600m, target in the open, it looked like perhaps five missiles struck my target. Of roughly 1000 missiles fired I garnered approximately 250 damage inflicted.

Thontor, on 21 May 2013 - 01:29 PM, said:

Now, AMS destroys 5 LRMs.
Double AMS destroys 11 LRMs

So, Quad AMS destroy 22-23 LRMs, pretty much what you've seen. Have you met quad LRM20 stalker anyway? And use teammates' help to focus LRM spam on one mech, don't be so self confident