53 replies to this topic

[Kyle Polulak]

This is a separate stuck thread for the purpose of identifying any decorative rock outcroppings which are overtly affecting 'Mech movement.

Please attempt to respond to the following questions in your responses:

• The map affected.
  
• The grid tile affected.
  
• The Mech used to achieve the collision issue.

[Shae Starfyre]

I think they just need to create a height pass for all maps, because there are too many to list.

Anything under a specific height (can also be dependent on leg height for more technical coding - I think this would be awesome because it would add more depth, but may not be realistic having a height pass based on leg height) would just be bumpy like before.

There are far too many objects to list; it is so prevalent that the only real option is to code a height pass (in my opinion).

I am not sure the technical graphic term for it, but I bet it is really just object oriented items. The hills themselves are not the issue, it is objects scattered around.

So, if the height pass is a good idea, great, if not, just have it ignore the objects (but be bumpy like before)... there are a few cases though that could not be objects like the edges of the rivers, such that a height pass is the best solution.

Edited by Aphoticus, 03 July 2013 - 07:06 AM.

[Black Templar]

yeah you need to take a look at canyon network guys. nearly all the small rocks on the ground have become impassable.

[Genewen]

What Aphoticus said. Way to many instances of significant slowdowns and full stops happening to even try listing them. In the light of the (in my opinion too harsh) limit of what a mech is able to climb we also need better indication of what is climbable and what not. Newer players need to be able to tell where they can go and what is impassable.

The maps need a major pass in the light of that change, not a few band-aid$ (because it gets censored if I write it correctly) here and there. And while you are on it, you might do something about those terrible hitboxes of environmental objects in Tourmaline and Canyon Network.

Edited by Genewen, 03 July 2013 - 08:17 AM.

[DragonsFire]

What we have to remember is just doing a general tuning pass may not get everything. What is important is snapping a quick screenshot for where you get stuck and coming back here and posting it or submitting it. This is crucial in helping find and resolve the stuck/impassable terrain issues. If you think there are too many for us, as the whole playing community to find and communicate, it would be a much larger task for a ~40 man team that currently works at PGI, most of whom have other jobs than working on the maps.

SmokingDave made a great post around the issues he was seeing with a picture of the hung location. Stuff like that is immensely valuable in finding and correcting map inconsistencies. So the next time you get stuck, hit F9 and snap a screen shot and post it here.

[Genewen]

DragonsFire, on 03 July 2013 - 08:06 AM, said:

What we have to remember is just doing a general tuning pass may not get everything. What is important is snapping a quick screenshot for where you get stuck and coming back here and posting it or submitting it. This is crucial in helping find and resolve the stuck/impassable terrain issues. If you think there are too many for us, as the whole playing community to find and communicate, it would be a much larger task for a ~40 man team that currently works at PGI, most of whom have other jobs than working on the maps.

SmokingDave made a great post around the issues he was seeing with a picture of the hung location. Stuff like that is immensely valuable in finding and correcting map inconsistencies. So the next time you get stuck, hit F9 and snap a screen shot and post it here.

You do know that dev-tools exist, right? You don't use customers to QA your maps after you release a half-baked new feature. You use search algorithms to check your map for small objects and bumps in the road which might make said feature a horrible experience before releasing it and making your playerbase angry.

Oh, of course it is impossible to always find every single problem. Nobody expects them to. But at the very least the obvious and rough edges should be taken care of by the developer.

[DragonsFire]

Genewen, on 03 July 2013 - 08:27 AM, said:

You do know that dev-tools exist, right? You don't use customers to QA your maps after you release a half-baked new feature. You use search algorithms to check your map for small objects and bumps in the road which might make said feature a horrible experience before releasing it and making your playerbase angry.

Oh, of course it is impossible to always find every single problem. Nobody expects them to. But at the very least the obvious and rough edges should be taken care of by the developer.

Yes, I'm very well aware that dev tools exist, I use them daily. It's also very likely that said search was already executed and the current issues did not show up in that search as they fell outside of the search pattern.

Of course, without exact insight both of us are just taking educated guesses at their processes. I prefer to err on the side of caution and suggest that we all lend feedback because that is a part of what we're here for currently as well, and I know that as a developer myself, outside feedback is invaluable in the process. In the end, that was the point of my post, advocating feedback from the community as a whole to help track down issues.

Edited by DragonsFire, 03 July 2013 - 08:35 AM.

[Azzras]

Genewen, on 03 July 2013 - 08:27 AM, said:

You do know that dev-tools exist, right? You don't use customers to QA your maps after you release a half-baked new feature. You use search algorithms to check your map for small objects and bumps in the road which might make said feature a horrible experience before releasing it and making your playerbase angry.

Oh, of course it is impossible to always find every single problem. Nobody expects them to. But at the very least the obvious and rough edges should be taken care of by the developer.

Do you know what BETA means?
We are beta TESTERS.

Edited by Azzras, 03 July 2013 - 08:45 AM.

[ErikModi]

I had one on Frozen City, where my Highlander was stopped by a small ridge on the crashed Dropship that probably didn't even come halfway up my 'Mech's foot.

[Genewen]

DragonsFire, on 03 July 2013 - 08:33 AM, said:

Yes, I'm very well aware that dev tools exist, I use them daily. It's also very likely that said search was already executed and the current issues did not show up in that search as they fell outside of the search pattern.

Of course, without exact insight both of us are just taking educated guesses at their processes. I prefer to err on the side of caution and suggest that we all lend feedback because that is a part of what we're here for currently as well, and I know that as a developer myself, outside feedback is invaluable in the process. In the end, that was the point of my post, advocating feedback from the community as a whole to help track down issues.

Oh certainly, community input is extremely valuable, even if you might end up blowing it out the chimney (*cough3pvcough*), I did not want to give the impression that it was any different.

What I want to say, is, they have to do the rough sketch and then ask the players to select the exact tones and draw the fine lines. They should not just splat pot of ink on a sheet and ask people to draw a picture out of it.
Perhaps they did run an algorithm on their map data, perhaps they did not. Early impression at least for me is, they did not and did not set foot onto their maps either, but that is just my impression. But if they did, either the algorithm was faulty or the parameters are not set right. In any way, they should run another (working) height check before asking the players to report missed spots.

[JeremyCrow]

Azzras, on 03 July 2013 - 08:44 AM, said:

Do you know what BETA means?
We are beta TESTERS.

I don't mind helping out, but this should be done before the launch, in test servers. The "this is Beta" thingy got old when lots of us paid money for the game.

[Azzras]

JeremyCrow, on 03 July 2013 - 09:02 AM, said:

I don't mind helping out, but this should be done before the launch, in test servers. The "this is Beta" thingy got old when lots of us paid money for the game.

When you paid it was closed beta.
Have you ever reported a bug, or because you gave a donation (which is truly all the founder's pack was) you feel entitled?

Anyway, off topic.

[SmokinDave73]

The most obvious maps that I tested in last night were these examples occur are, Frozen city, Alpine, Toumaline desert, Caustic valley and the big one canyon network. The mechs I used to were the Awesome 9m 75kph, and the Highlander 732 64kph.

Example 1:



Example 2:



Example 3:


Example 4:


[All the images are zoomed in 3x]
Example 1 is on canyons at the starting spawn sigma side, the rocks outcropping the lip of the small river a very small compared to an assault mech and because they are right at the lip of the river they slow you down to a near stop. I agree that in situations like this your mech should slow down but going from 85kph in an awesome and then being slowed down by some rocks that are not even bigger than the mechs ankles should not make your mech stop that harshly instantly. My suggestion is to reduce the harshness of the 20° angle and make it maybe 10 instead and make it so the speed reduction does not happen instantly and instead make it so the mech slows down at a gradual pace.

Example 2 is of a small rock that slopes on the side next to a smooth pathway on the middle of canyons by theta. This small sloped hump also greatly reduces your mechs speed, and all you have to do is slightly brush it. Again these sorts of terrain features should not be able to slow you down that quickly whilst in a 80-100 ton gigantic battlemech.

Example 3+4 are of small spiky terrain features that can be found on small mounds or slopes on caustic valley and frozen city. These vicious little buggers will make a mech completely stop to a standstill. These are the rare extreme cases that I was talking about earlier that need to be addressed ASAP because small little bumps like that causing you to go from full speed to a standstill will put you in a terrible situation in the middle of combat.

My descriptions are the same from my OP found here http://mwomercs.com/...sheat-in-depth/ It to late at night to edit them anymore the grid locations and my mech locations are displayed in the screenshots and circles are around the rocks/mounds in question.

[Thunder Lips Express]

Canyon Network. not sure which grid but it's in the spawn location in the river bed. you either need jump jets to get out of the small river or you need to back up and take a run at it, can't simply move forward with the rest of the team

[JeremyCrow]

Azzras, on 03 July 2013 - 09:04 AM, said:

When you paid it was closed beta.
Have you ever reported a bug, or because you gave a donation (which is truly all the founder's pack was) you feel entitled?

Anyway, off topic.

Actually, I was in CB before the founder packs What I mean, is that this is Beta in name only, and we should be able to test the features before they install them in Production environments... I know I keep repeating myself, but do it as Eve does and you can't go wrong.

[Azzras]

JeremyCrow, on 03 July 2013 - 09:09 AM, said:

Actually, I was in CB before the founder packs What I mean, is that this is Beta in name only, and we should be able to test the features before they install them in Production environments... I know I keep repeating myself, but do it as Eve does and you can't go wrong.

Darn you and your sensible post.
I retract my 'entitled' comment from earlier.

Didn't I read a post somewhere that a public test server will be up and running soon?

[Rippthrough]

Perhaps rather than a simple calc for what angle the mech is currently travelling on, it should take an average of say 5/6 points extending slightly in front of the mech.

That would solve the rock issue, as well as the trouble with getting over some obsticles that are lower than the leg height, and fix the issue where you almost crest and just get stuck right as the curve flattens out.

Edited by Rippthrough, 03 July 2013 - 10:21 AM.

[Butane9000]

I was playing river city night and in the park in areas B3 and C3 is loaded with rocks. I merely scratched these rocks walking by (not even trying to go up them) and my speed dropped to 0 constantly. I was in my Catapult C1.

Edited by Butane9000, 03 July 2013 - 11:29 AM.

[Tennex]

They should fix the issue with jump jet landings giving the mech no momentum at all.

It feels wrong when jumping up a cliff at 80kph forward, and somehow when you land there is no momentum carried over. and you get stuck on the incline right before the plateau.


It also feels odd to stall when landing even with a normal jump onto same level plane. especially if the angle of landing is like <30* or something. and the mech still has to stop and no momentum is carried over

Edited by Tennex, 03 July 2013 - 11:58 AM.

[Tie Ma]

you'd think giant robots would be able to walk over rocks 1/6 their height with no problem.

maybe something needs to be done at the code level to tackle this fundamental problem.

Edited by Tie Ma, 03 July 2013 - 12:00 PM.