128 replies to this topic

[Tsula]

Jherej, on 18 April 2014 - 10:07 AM, said:

How are you joining a guild when you always drop randomly into a team?

http://mwomercs.com/...ons-merc-corps/
Simple take time and look who is recruiting but please stay away from C4. Only thing you can by with MC that you can't buy with C-Bills are hero mechs. and they are not any different from the normal. Champs you can build with C-bills items you can buy with C-Bills. Cool Shoots and other consumables you can buy with c-bills. given time you can make them just as nice as MC one with GXP and pilot skill tree. Move along troll and have a nice day.

[maniacos]

DavidHurricane, on 18 April 2014 - 10:11 AM, said:

In before K-Town

You clearly haven't tried hard enough.

Sure, he didnt like it, he didnt try hard enough. How can it be that someone has a different opinion about enjoyment?

[990Dreams]

Jherej, on 18 April 2014 - 10:15 AM, said:

Sure, he didnt like it, he didnt try hard enough. How can it be that someone has a different opinion about enjoyment?

Jherej, on 18 April 2014 - 09:46 AM, said:

How am I supposed to stay together with a team. When drop I get selected random noobs and have like 10 times in a row when we lose because they spread out thinking they can lonewolf 3 Atlas in a trial jenner.

I cant go social with people because I see everyone once or twice in my team and next day I am fighting them. Can't join a clan and practice team tactics.

How am I supposed to select the mech according to the map? Going with a laser boat into a vulcan pit? Who with a sane mind would do that? Going missile boat into the city? Stratedicaly selecting your mech? Nope, not in this game.

Meanwhile it is pay to win through and through. People load up their accounts with buckets of MC and buy all the stuff you need to win.

All these are things that I've found solutions to by myself because I try hard to find a solution for them. You on the other hand have clearly not tried hard enough.

Edited by DavidHurricane, 18 April 2014 - 10:22 AM.

[AlmightyAeng]

Jherej, on 18 April 2014 - 10:14 AM, said:

You are totally not getting what I said. Pay to win means that you can buy power you otherwise had to earn by playing. Starting in noob league and working upwards.

You might want to Google the definition of Pay-to-Win, because you don't understand the term.

P2Win involves using cash money equivalents to unlock aspects of a game that provide the player with an ADVANTAGE over their in-game monetary counterparts.

In this game that doesn't exist. Thanks for playing.

[Votanin FleshRender]

I'm still very noobish myself, but even I very aware that PGI, for all the gripes and groans, has gotten this one thing absolutely right. It. Is. Not. A. Pay. To. Win. Game.

It is by far the least pay to win game I've seen (not that I play much in my old age, but still).

That doesn't mean it's easy, by any means. One thing I think they've gotten *completely* wrong, is dropping new players in the same games as vets. I wish there was a way to quantify the money PGI has driven away by doing that..

[Creovex]

Jherej, on 18 April 2014 - 10:12 AM, said:

That's probably the reason why I said it feels like a sorry beta.

Rationale thought? Please, don't change your tune! Continue with fictitious "Worst Game Ever" and "Pay 2 Win" scenarios you have been floating around in this post.... (Special request: Try to argue that the Dragon is a great mech)

Edited by Creovex, 18 April 2014 - 10:37 AM.

[Iqfish]

Creovex, on 18 April 2014 - 10:37 AM, said:

Rationale thought? Please, don't change your tune! Continue with fictitious "Worst Game Ever" and "Pay 2 Win" scenarios you have been floating around in this post.... (Special request: Try to argue that the Dragon is a great mech)

The Dragon IS a great mech, you just need to learn how to treat it!

It's like a very beautiful, clever but really complicated wife - Once you learned how to treat her, you are a very happy man

Edited by Iqfish, 18 April 2014 - 10:45 AM.

[Creovex]

Iqfish, on 18 April 2014 - 10:44 AM, said:

The Dragon IS a great mech, you just need to learn how to treat it!

I respect you but at the same time I want to give you the RED PILL and let you see the Dragon for what it really is....unimpressive!

[Alaskan Nobody]

Have a taco - probably tastes better than the bile you've been spewing Mistah J.

[Daggett]

Jherej, on 18 April 2014 - 10:14 AM, said:

You are totally not getting what I said. Pay to win means that you can buy power you otherwise had to earn by playing. Starting in noob league and working upwards.

It seems that your definition of P2W differs from those of most other players AND developers.

The usual definition (and also mine) is that P2W occurs when you can buy power with real money which is unavailable or unattractive to free players. For example a superior gun which can't be grinded through normal playing. That would be P2W by this definition.

Your definition however does have a point, but only because many games (including this) have bad matchmaking which is not taking the player's acquired equipment and skills into account. But how severe this is depends on how hard the grind is.

For example in World of Tanks the TierVI KV-1S is a great tank when fully researched. But the grind to get this far can be very frustrating because the stock gun is way too weak against the competition and XP for such tanks is mostly generated through damage which this gun can't do much. So here we can indeed speak of a significant P2W factor because the game tries hard to motivate you to spend money for speeding up the grind.

But MWO is different. You don't need to research vital equipment with XP. You can just save a bit more cbills before buying a mech and immediately outfit it with everything you need to be competitive. No grind in a badly outfitted mech is necessary when you are smart. And the basic mech efficiencies are grinded in a matter of hours. So the time a (smart) free player is on a disadvantage against others is very minimal. Only the mastery of a mech takes a bit longer but is totally not necessary to have lots of success and fun.

So i ask you to take things a bit more into perspective. MWO has some small P2W elements but no F2P game is totally free of those. Even League of Legends, the most fair big F2P game in the world has such small P2W elements following your definition. But those are so small that it makes no real difference. And the same is true for MWO. Some small P2W elements do not make the entire game P2W.

Edited by Daggett, 18 April 2014 - 02:08 PM.

[Not A Real RAbbi]

Jherej, on 18 April 2014 - 10:14 AM, said:

You are totally not getting what I said. Pay to win means that you can buy power you otherwise had to earn by playing. Starting in noob league and working upwards.

And YOU are totally not getting what EVERYONE ELSE HERE has said.

Pay-to-Win, in the opinion of MOST gamers, means only being able to obtain/achieve by use of real-world funds, or there being unrealistically high grind associated with obtaining/achieving without using real-world funds.

NOT THE CASE IN MWO.

You wanna see P2W? Go check out Ghost Recon Online. Witness the UbiSoft profit-over-everything-else machine in its full glory. It's disgusting.

With the exception of hero and champion mechs (the former are, more often than not, inferior to at least one of their C-Bill variants, and the latter are only different for the 10% C-Bill boost), and some improved expendable modules, you can buy anything with C-Bills that you can with cash or MC. If we play a match in JR7-Fs, you on one side in a standard variant, and me on the other in a Champion variant, and your wide wins, and my side loses, then even with the Champion bonus, and even with Premium time stacked on top of that, I'll still likely take home less C-Bills than you do. Since there is nothing about the JR7-F(C) that is different from a JR7-F standard that can be built exclusively with C-Bills, the PAy-to-Win argument falls down here. You and your team, versus me and my team. Whatever skills we have, we have.

If 'starting in noob league and moving upwards' applies here, it's only in that you're going to be matched against less-skilled opponents (on average) as a noob, until you work upward. Even then, the matchmaking/Elo thing isn't working all that well right now. It's a gamble. But you're not being held back from earning C-Bills and XP by virtue of being new. In fact, your first couple dozen matches earn you a BONUS, simply for being a noob. I know, that's so OP and P2W, to help the new guys build up their cash more quickly, so they can get a jump on buying their first mech.

Not able to find a team? Try TEAM SPEAK. Google it. It's out there, it's free, there are free-to-you (NOT P2W) TS3 servers all over the internet for MWO. Find your closest ComStar TS3 server. And learn to start/join a group, whether 4-man or 12, with the folks you talk to on TS3.

Y'know, when you're not too busy trolling.

No, it's not any of the other MW games. You're right about that. It is its own game. Don't like it? Sorry.

Call it out for what's really wrong with the game. You'll get a bazillion likes and be this forum's favorite new poster.

Call it out for what it isn't? No, that's trolling.

Shame this forum isn't pay-to-troll...

[Alaskan Nobody]

TheRAbbi, on 18 April 2014 - 11:11 AM, said:

some improved expendable modules

Get some GXP put into them and the Cbill modules have the same stats.

[Not A Real RAbbi]

Seriously, either this is some crafty trolling, or someone has some VERY unrealistic expectations.

That said, I've thought it over a bit. It's VERY pay-not-to-grind if you want it to be. Say a new player, outside of cadet bonus and in a standard mech, averages 75k C-Bills per match. That's well over 30 matches to buy a reasonable light mech, another 20 to pay for DHS, and so on. The C-Bill nerf back in the Fall made the grind pretty long, compared to a year before. But one can buy that same mech with MC. Let's say one wants to fly all the Jenners. One buys a D, F(C), K, and OXIDE. Then, one pulls the engines out of 2 of them and sells those for C-Bills. That's a pile of cash. One sells all but 9 medium lasers, all but 10 jump jets, etc. Pile of C-Bills. One can then use that cash to buy the swoopy-cool upgrades, as needed. So yeah, VERY pay-not-to-grind.

But grinding up better equipment and mech tree skills is a very small part of winning. Some of it is teamwork, some of it is the luck of the matchmaker draw, some of it is which map and which spawn and which game mode. And so on.

No amount of cash or MC can buy winning in this game, and that's that.

[CoffiNail]

This is pay for convenience. Please understand. I, like a lot of the long term players who play 6+ hours a week min, and have been playing for a while tend to grind the Cbills like yourself to earn our Mechs. The people who buy their Mechs are those who tend to have less time to play a week, or someone with disposable income.

This is no way means this player can perform in his or her Mech. Some have premium time, this allows them to unlock a little faster as the get a bonus Cbills each match and XP.

So, pay for convenience.

If I pug/play the game alone I will lose matches a lot more often then when I am dropping with teammates. This is a team game, and as great as playing by yourself can be, finding a group, not hard if you try, will greatly increase your enjoyment of the game.

[maniacos]

It was a nice try to turn this discussion onto the pay to win aspect only. Any yes there is one, but this was not the whole facts of things I hate in this game. My last pure free to play game without pay to win was PoE, all you can buy there are pets like a little cat or a scorpion that follows you, you can buy banners or flames for your swords and shields and so on - nothing that affects your dps or skills in any form (and that was the reason why I actually bought stuff because it supports a that was made by enthusiasts not by business economics). Everything else is pay to win.

Furthermore the other aspects of my posting have been totally ignored so far. I still can not select my mechs stratetically, I get dropped onto a random map where my selected Mech might be totally irrelevant.

And what about user created games?
- Lets say a FFA deathmach with friends?
- I want only light mech with small lasers?
- Or maybe stock mechs only, that you can not modify (the trial ones) for a fun run?
- What about modes where you respawn and spend hours of fun with your friends? Nope
- Hell, we even made race games in older mechwarrior titles, where you stripped off all amour, weapons and other tonnage to make your mech the fastest to reach the other corner of the map...

No, you need a lobby for this, you need some socialition. In any poker game I can create my own tables why not here? Oh I heard, yes they are developing it. Nice. At the moment I only see them developing expensive packets of clanner mechs you can buy for real world money again to achive advantage over people that play for free.

In this shit you always have the same game with random noobs against teams that play together in a guild and so on. Where is the balance? Where can I chose who to play with, who to team up and who to have a war against? Where are the clan competitions? And when I ask how to find teams to practice with you direct me to the forum or 3rd party websites? Are you kidding me? If this was an alpha version or closed beta or something, I would say OK. But this is a public released online game and it doesn't even have a decent social feature.

Not to mention the bugs that I already noticed in my short time playing. When my display freezes completely for good for instance and I can not move not even escape the game. Or when I drop out of spectator mode after being down and want to join a new game, my Mech is "currently deployed" and I have to select a stock one to continue playing.

And looking around on youtube I find many comments of people that say the same, especially on the later videos that came out after this game going public.

[Arnold J Rimmer]

Nothing you can buy in MWO affects your DPS or skill. There are no golden weapons or ammunition here... It's all payment to reduce grind. That's it.

Setting up private matches is a coming feature (and there are plenty of developer posts about the subject, if you care to look). You will have the option to set up custom games for you and your friends.

As for playing in public queues with/against the people you want, only one of those is currently available. You must add the pilots you wish to drop with to your friends list, then create a group and invite them to that. Then, you and up to three buddies can drop in the public queue and have some fun. Or, if you fancy a game against a team of 12, find 11 buddies and set up a full company group.

I don't understand why directing you to the forums for the game to find people to play with is a bad thing, but okay. 3rd party, I can understand why you'd be surprised. The clan competitions are all player-driven right now, but they do exist.

If you see bugs, submit a ticket to support@mwomercs.com. They're pretty rapid to respond.

[Ssamout]

Yes, you are also bitching about stuff that others have been bitching on quite a while now. And most people probably agree with you on lobby system that enables more tactics on choosing mechs and weaponry. System as it is know forces people to learn tactics on how to play when disadvantaged.

Those that have stayed through all this and waited for CW to come are hopefully awarded during this spring/summer.

The game is also very hard in the beginning when you don't know rat's ass from it's tail, so suck it up and do the grind until you know what you are doing. Reading informative post's and educating one self usually helps.

[maniacos]

I usually watch videos about builds and I pretty much know what I want...

But all what you write just complements to what I said from the very beginning: That this game feels like a beta. The other genre that I like to play online are mmorps and this here fells totally like what that company bigpoint made of the former great name of drakensang: A halfbaked mony-generating multiplayer acarde.

It also just pretty sucks, when you lose 10 times in a row being on a team that runs around like headless chicken blustered up by a shotgun shot and not being able to meet with the team after the game to discuss tactics and what exactly didnt went so well and so on. 10 times in a row you see the other team walking in organized lines picking your team out one after another while no one on your side even used the team chat once during the match.

And I totally do not care how to move a lrm-boat in a city because I would never chose that mech there if I had the choice, same goes for the laser Jenner in terra therma, just to run around to survive a minute and scoring maybe 50-100 hit points... that's neither fun nor the game.

[Ignatz22]

Jherej;

I know the frustration, and will only touch on the modules/Pay-to-Win issue; I played with a BIG Merc Corp who relied HEAVILY on Airstrikes and Artillery. They relied TOO MUCH on them, in my opinion, to the extent that they forgot those are Line-Of-Sight targeted weapons and only work well against bunched groups, but reliance on them allows the opposition to target YOU with a high-damage Alpha Strike.
I tried them, preferred to stick with the tried and true mounted weapons..
I rarely mount modules, and when I do, they're usually Seismic and Sensors. .

As to choosing weapons and maps, how realistic is THAT?? Why not go the distance and allow each side to see the opposition's force composition?? Do you REALLY expect to always know where you will engage and be able to configure the mech to the specific confrontation?? Sounds like you need to get back to the First Person/Deathmatch shooters.

Losing just means you weren't prepared, the Stars didn't Align for you, the team thought better of a quick death than a protracted display of their bad gamesmanship, the cat jumped on the keyboard and a billion other reasons. Good thing we're not all perfect, then NOONE would lose! Wouldn't THAT be Keen?? No, if you lose many times you should have done something and need to adjust and rebuild or rethink. If the world is simply against you, this game and all others aren't going to change that or your win/loss statistics. Play Tic-Tac-Toe; with any thought at all every game ends in a draw; isn't THAT fun??

One of the STRENGTHS of this game is the variety of chassis platforms with varied loadouts. This is a TEAM game, not a first person shooter, so integrating with the team will always lead to better results. It's a challenge. If you want to do better consistently, get in Voice communications and get with some other folks, even if only the Lone Wolves and not an organized Merc Corp.

If you refuse to play the game to its potential and design, the flaw in the results is probably you. If you were happy fragging friends solo in a death cage, perhaps this isn't the venue for your talents. You're venting. Ok, we saved the dog from getting kicked. Now do something about whatever you see as an impediment. As a suggestion, my win/loss and kill/death rates suck because I grind out all the mechs and try differing builds, many do not suit me.It's a GAME. WHO CARES what your statistics are?? I STILL haven't seen the Supermodels and Ferraris for "Best Tournament Mechpilot" in any challenge..

Now strap in, stop whining and get in the GAME!

[Appogee]

Cool story, bro.

Edited by Appogee, 21 April 2014 - 07:45 AM.