117 replies to this topic

[juxstapo]

*waves unsteadily at waitress*

"Hey sugar, can I get a modderatur over here?"

[Kjudoon]

Sug, on 23 July 2014 - 03:05 PM, said:

I'm in kinda a jerky mood so I'll say it. If you think MWO is a twitch game you have bad reflexes. Nothing to be ashamed of. Just stick to LRMs.







Wow. Talk about perpetuating stereotypes.

First part yes. I do. now make them competitive at the esport level like they should be instead of being artificially nerfed. Also, yes, this is a twitch game. Not as high degree of twitch as other ones out there, but when I'm matching pixel on pixel and firing at proper timing based on how fast I can react... it's called twitch reflexes. Not all my impediments to twitch are physically based, but equipment based as well. Shortchanging lower level computers does not help the size of the community and really, exemplifies the reason to get away from Pavlovian twitch and more to strategic thinking to expand ease and accessibility.

Second; don't like fleas, don't sleep with dogs. Not that I assume you do, but many do and are offended they have fleas like the dogs.

Edited by Kjudoon, 23 July 2014 - 05:53 PM.

[Ace Selin]

OP LOL what?

You have to hit the target with weapon's to be good at this game - of course you do, that's the point to destroy other robots/mechs. Or use Streak or LRMs which a 4 year old can do and still get damage / kills.

[Tarl Cabot]

Just a few things to add.

Unlike the standard FPS, MWO uses multiple weapons at one time instead of the pulling out and using one weapon at a time, such the sniper rifle/pistol/RPG/BFG/MG/etc. That is what many may have difficult getting used into it as they are juggling several weapons.

Quote

Finally, if you haven't yet, you can always try lowering your mouse sensitivity in game (or changing your mouse's DPI settings, if you have a mouse that supports it) to improve your precision.

This^^. I use a mouse with an adjustable DPI. Real fast out of windows but once in game, I lower it by a couple of notches to slow it down. Sorta like when one needs to change from alpha to single fire on a tic.

As for the Gauss Rifle, like many others it was a hassle, as the sound is not loud enough nor were the indicators next to the cross hairs adjustable so one can enlarge them, so I starting using AC5/10 more often until recently. I usually do not use all of the weapon groups/tics. At most 1-4. What I have done is put the gauss on 5/6 so that I now have 3 indicators lighting up instead of one and it makes it more noticeable. The only time it still becomes hairy is in severe brawling range.

And no macros for it. I have not learned to jump on my toes, chew bubble gum and while tapping my nose to a tune to make them work .

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 23 July 2014 - 07:14 PM.

[Mazzyplz]

Fyrerock, on 23 July 2014 - 10:43 AM, said:

I watched my nephew become very good at playing COD, but 6 months later I asked him if he wanted to play a game and he refused, it turned out that he was out of practise and his marksmen skills sucked now. To become a good marksmen you need to practise and practise all the time, which is something most of us here lack the time to do. I would be fine with that, if they would not keep nerfing the few weapons that have a smaller learning curve.

Being able to hit a moving object with a single fast projectile is something that most people can learn to do ok, without needing endless amounts of practise. But hitting and holding target on a moving object with a stream of energy or projectiles is another story in itself, it is not something that the majority of part time players will ever become good at.

The gauss used to be a great newbie weapon for a part time player, it did not take many playing hours for a person to get the marksmen skills to hit the target most of the time and do it at both long and short ranges. But with the changes to the gauss you almost never see it being used by the average player, just in the hands of the Elite the people with the natural skills and those that play all the time. The same is almost as true for the er ppc which is a great weapon with a smaller learning curve, but the heat issues makes it a type of weapon that does not benefit the average marksmen that has a hard time placing the shot in the same spot shot after shot. For the average marksmen they will overheat before taking down a charging mech the vast majority of the time.

I left the game when they nerfed the gauss and I came back for the clan mechs, and like many people I have tried out many different weapon types on the clan mechs, and ended up using what works best for me, which is lasers and LRM. It is not that I like lasers and LRM, but I lack the time and skills to get good enough to do well with the other types of weapons. Sure in a good match I get 500 points, but most of my damage is spread out all over the place since I will never play enough to do will with lasers. The UAC does a lot of damage, but only if all the shells land in the same spot, and against a moving target I land the first shell, but miss with some of the rest most times.

It seems that the vast majority of people playing clan mechs at my level are using lasers and LRM, and I feel that they use those weapons for the same reason I do, because our skills are lacking to use the other types of weapons and still bring some value to the group.

If they are happy to design a game around the Elites then that if fine with me, but I have a feeling the player base will get smaller and smaller over time if that happens. If they want to bring in new people or even keep the average joe engaged in this game, then they need to have weapon types that does not take hundreds of hours of play time to master. Most of us lack the time investment to ever keep our marksmen skills to the point we can keep target and sustain target on a moving object, which is something you need to do with almost every single weapon type in the game, and something you need to brawl as well.

actually i learned to keep my lasers on a component much quicker than how to land my erppc shots at 1000 meters

for me it was way easier to keep my lasers on target and still is; but the mech i drive has good torso speed

[Xeno Phalcon]

I...wha......why......don't even?!

I have no words to give, so heres a picture.

[Nik Reaper]

While I disagree with what the OP desires, I understand the sentiment.

Basicaly when I play this game I have to try hard, otherwise it doesn't end well and I feel that I didn't contribute to the team, and the damage , score and kills reflect this.
Due to this I only play the game for less then 10 hours a week even though I have more free time I would theoretically like to spend in MWO, I can't enjoy it due to the effort I need to put in to play well. I'm not from the PvP crowd and competition was never my thing , but this is the only Mech action around so here we are trying to make enemy players sad and frustrated x) .

But I digress , what the OP wants basically is PVE , even esport level games like LOL have games against bots, and ones with different skill levels against wich you gain reduced rewards, but still some reward. It's the ultimate indulgence, you put little effort , no one is frustrated and you are basically playing the game with a prefered level of difficulty.

So to conclude, we'r sorry getting old , not having time or energy to become good at a game is being rough on you , and that the match maker is just not good enough to keep you in games with only players at you'r skill level and the lack of a relaxing PVE mode , we all suffer from the mentioned but NO! do not ever lower the roof of what devotion and practice at you'r hobby can allow you to do..... just keep the serious players separate from the casual folk with some thing like a ranked games wich give a bt more reward and are competitive with rankings.... and PVE when they get around to it .

[Sug]

Seriously can we have a jump drive malfunction in this pos thread already?

[Vermaxx]

Every game that envisions itself some kind of esports submission, is designed for the elite of the elite players. It is not designed for people with no time and terrible gaming coordination (and I do not believe this is just a function of hand/eye, it is a completely separate thing). There are games out there that are entirely skill based, and games that are entirely noob based.

MWO wants to be an esports contender. I don't think it ever WILL, but it wants to be. As such, being a 'good gamer' is helpful, possibly somewhat necessary. On the other hand, it does a pisspoor job of matching people into fair fights, and no real way to restrict top players to fighting among themselves. These are common problems with games that do no have large player bases.

Community Warfare might make some things better, but then again it might magnify the problem. Power gamers might be able to go off and fight for extremely important "plot battles" or some other MAJOR IN GAME CONSEQUENCE kind of thing. Or maybe they will have Solaris matches to fight each other and bet CB/MC for fun and prizes.

Or they'll just continue to group into 4-12 man groups and run a train on whatever planet they're steamrolling that night. Hard to say, because we have zero info on how CW will work.

I will say that MWO gives 'bad' players a lot more options to contribute - LRMs being one of the most obvious. Or the p2w option of buying a Clan mech.

[Fyrerock]

Kanin Zeta, on 23 July 2014 - 03:10 PM, said:

"I want to be able to create an account and be Elite without working at it."


DO YOU? Really?

No I will never be an Elite it will just never happen, since I will never play this game enough to even get close. I would just like a mixture of weapon types, and I do think that the weapons that do the most damage should be the type that requires a lot of skill and practise to become good at them. But what is wrong with a fast and easy to use weapon type that does less damage and is easier to learn. Like a PPC that does half damage is fast and has a lot less heat to it.

[Modo44]

Fyrerock, on 23 July 2014 - 09:27 PM, said:

But what is wrong with a fast and easy to use weapon type that does less damage and is easier to learn.

We call these "lasers". You are welcome.

[Sug]

Fyrerock, on 23 July 2014 - 09:27 PM, said:

But what is wrong with a fast and easy to use weapon type that does less damage and is easier to learn. Like a PPC that does half damage is fast and has a lot less heat to it.

You've just described a medium laser. Combine those with some LRMs and enjoy.

[Fyrerock]

Sug, on 23 July 2014 - 09:31 PM, said:

You've just described a medium laser. Combine those with some LRMs and enjoy.

Lasers need to hold target so no it does not describe that at all. Look I played about 5 hours today in mech ranging from medium, heavies to assaults, with platforms with almost every weapon type other than gauss, but I did play with a gauss yesterday and my scores ranged from very bad to over 800 for a game.

But I still think weapons other than LRM which can be learn quickly by new people and casuals would help bring in more people and keep others as well.

[Sug]

Fyrerock, on 23 July 2014 - 10:05 PM, said:

But I still think weapons other than LRM which can be learn quickly by new people and casuals would help bring in more people and keep others as well.

Cool.


/thread

[Modo44]

You want the PPC, but without any of the difficulties associated with building a PPC mech. Sorry, this is already the best weapon in MWO. Go whine somewhere else.

[Naduk]

Fyrerock, on 23 July 2014 - 02:42 PM, said:

The Facts are the Facts, reread what I wrote about how much harder it is to maintain target lock vs hitting a target for casual players. No game will survive over the long run if it makes it tough for casual players, and I do not want this game to die because of it. What is wrong with having different type of weapon aiming systems, instead of what we have now.

And second what makes you think I have not tried to use the gauss the way it is now, for snipping over long range with a target not moving is NP, but I find the new method to frustrating to use. And I am 51 so a bit older than you moomtazz. I am here to have fun not become frustrated with game mechanisms.

so what do you propose to do when your easy to use guns are put in the hands of the ELITE players
because i can tell you whats going to happen and thats new and casual players are going to get ground into dust in about 3.6 seconds after the start of every match, as it stands they usually get to the middle of the battlezone at a minimum.
those who were around for the open beta saw exactly what happens when weapons are to easy to use
(9ML hunchi, 6xERppc stalker, 4ERLL/LPL Atlas, splat cats, ac40 cats, gauss cats....)

the weapon systems are is are pretty spot on perfect
every weapon and system has a "easy to use but hard to master" style system going for it
LRM weapons are pinnacle of that design, very very easy to use, get lock, fire
but the many intricacies involved is very high levels of LRM use take a long time to understand and master

people rag on LRM for them being a noob weapon but there is alot more to them than people give it credit
targeting enemy, enemy cover, enemy speed, tag or not, narc or not, minimum range, hard maximum range, artemis or not, ecm, ecm counter, lock speed mods, radar range mods, ammo count vs launcher count, AMS, AMS breaking/avoiding, LOS lock, data lock, re-lock, dumbfire/nolock, missile bay doors,
all things that must be understood before you can truly use LRMs to maximum effect
otherwise your just a monkey who can press a key when ever a circle turns red

this is good, we want this kind of depth, this is what keeps players in the game
the game is not for elites
everybody was a noobie at some point and we are all traveling the same path, some are just further down the road than others

this game is hard, its not going to be everyones cup of tea, never was, never will be
but giant robots smashing each other is cool and its attracts enough people on that merit alone
the players that see the difficulty and enjoy it, allways finding something new to learn when they tire of their current toys
there is more than enough of those people to support the game

dark souls is about to get its 3rd sequel and is one of the hardest games ever
both games have plenty of player

so get used to the way gauss works because your not getting your easy mode back
it is this depth that keeps players saying , ah i didnt know that and becoming a better pilot 3 years later

instead of wanting easier to use weapons
all we need is better training/ tutorials for new players

[Satan n stuff]

IraqiWalker, on 23 July 2014 - 11:26 AM, said:

Now, I can use them while running full speed. In fact, I can use them while poptarting. Something I never thought I'd ever try until recently.

For the record, poptarting is much easier than sniping while running, as the terrain can easily throw your aim completely off target when you're running.

[Kiiyor]

I'm of the firm belief that this game is easier to come back to than something like COD, especially if you had a decent skill level before you left. The pace isn't nearly as frantic as COD, with it's twitch reflexes and crap. Aiming and shooting in MWO are fine.

It's positioning and movement that are important, and knowing the maps.

Even if you can't remember the maps, you can still play cautiously until you get your groove back.

The easiest thing to get back into in MWO, though, is the meta. I took a 2 month break, jumped into the forums while the game was patching and looked for the loadouts and weapons everyone was whining about. 5 minutes in the mechlab, my Jäger had dual gauss or dual AC20's, hilarity ensued until I felt dirty enough to get back into my Awesome as pennance.

[HighTest]

Fyrerock, on 23 July 2014 - 09:27 PM, said:

Kanin Zeta, on 23 July 2014 - 07:10 PM, said: "I want to be able to create an account and be Elite without working at it."
DO YOU? Really?
___

No I will never be an Elite it will just never happen, since I will never play this game enough to even get close. I would just like a mixture of weapon types, and I do think that the weapons that do the most damage should be the type that requires a lot of skill and practise to become good at them. But what is wrong with a fast and easy to use weapon type that does less damage and is easier to learn. Like a PPC that does half damage is fast and has a lot less heat to it.

OK. I'm having some real issues with the line of thinking of this whole thread.

I hate to break it to everyone -- but in real life, if you want to get good at pretty much ANYTHING, you need to PRACTICE. I don't know too many people that can walk up to a guitar for the first time and play 'Stairway to Heaven'. Or get behind the wheel of a car after 6 months and make a good go at winning the Daytona 500. I'm sorry -- Life takes practice.

People need to make a choice. You will either choose to practice like heck and be really great at something, or you will choose not to practice and likely be horrible at it. Or some variation in between.

I hate to break it to you, but even if you dumb down every weapon in the game, those that PRACTICE with them, and practice tactics, and piloting, and positioning will still eat your lunch every time.

The reality is this: People need to determine how much time they are willing/able to put into anything (ie. this game). If you're satisfied with the outcome, then great. If you're not, go do something else that satisfies your needs with the time that you have available. This isn't an MWO comment, it's a life comment.

Don't get me wrong -- I'm not even close to elite, but I do pretty OK. I'm happy with my performance based on the limited time I put into the game, and the game makes me happy and entertains me. I put the same amount of effort into trying to learn guitar, and well I still suck. So I play MWO.

[IraqiWalker]

Kiiyor, on 24 July 2014 - 06:21 AM, said:

I'm of the firm belief that this game is easier to come back to than something like COD, especially if you had a decent skill level before you left. The pace isn't nearly as frantic as COD, with it's twitch reflexes and crap. Aiming and shooting in MWO are fine.

It's positioning and movement that are important, and knowing the maps.

Even if you can't remember the maps, you can still play cautiously until you get your groove back.

The easiest thing to get back into in MWO, though, is the meta. I took a 2 month break, jumped into the forums while the game was patching and looked for the loadouts and weapons everyone was whining about. 5 minutes in the mechlab, my Jäger had dual gauss or dual AC20's, hilarity ensued until I felt dirty enough to get back into my Awesome as pennance.

The single most deciding factor in a proper organized drop.