73 replies to this topic

[Bromineberry]

Why does everybody only talk about the CT? Most deaths in my Dragon since the hitbox changes are due to ST destruction, often leaving the CT armor orange or even yellow...

[Zordicron]

Deathlike, on 01 October 2014 - 06:05 PM, said:

There is a correlation between good+bad mechs and how often they are played.

It's not perfect, but what is considered meta vs what is considered terribad provides insight to the regularity of the distribution.

Although, sometimes you can figure out the overall picture of a player from their mech usage...

I find that method of evaluation rather shallow. I mean, there is always going to be "the least played mech" so what then, continuous quirk passes every 6 months to refresh the list?

I havent played my hero dragons in so long because I bought all the mech packs, and I master like everything. hell from January this year till almost april all I did was light mechs because I hadnt messed with them yet outside of one Spider.
Owning 120 mechs means some of them dont get played that much

But I guess we will see what Russ cooks up. I just want my hero Dragon module slots that feel arbitrarily withheld.

[M0rpHeu5]

Speed +15% quirck
The dragon's CT is big by desing so it can mount XL engines and not warry for side torso destraction. The dragon is a flanker, do go in brawls with it.

Edited by M0rpHeu5, 01 October 2014 - 08:36 PM.

[White Bear 84]

Torgun, on 30 September 2014 - 08:48 AM, said:

Frankly I don't think there will ever be anything done about the big CT of the Dragon, but one thing that always annoyed me is the lack of agility. The lighter mechs of all weightclasses should at least get an agility boost like bigger torso twist, faster speed up/down etc to make up for the lack of armor and ability to carry more weapons.

I would love to see it have a REALLY sharp turning circle, like a mech with jumpjets, but without. That would ramp its competitiveness right through the roof (without leaving the ground)

[aniviron]

Mellifluer, on 30 September 2014 - 08:42 AM, said:

Something needs to be done about the dragons CT and I dont think an armor buff like the awesomes is really gonna do it. It is simply way to freaking huge and anyone that has ever played dragons knows your CT is where your gonna take it the most.

Ive tried more armor on front and back/twisting def but nothing saves that big nose from getting hit and at best the dragon is a "peek-a-boo" mech because it cant even risk exposing itself lest it end up with 2 good arms and 2 good torsos but no CT armor whatsoever.

I think you should try it out before you knock it. I've been piloting Awesomes since CB, I was skeptical that the CT armor change would make a difference on the Awesome- but oh man it's like playing a different mech. I don't think I've lost the CT before the sides since that change. It's a world of difference, and I can't imagine it wouldn't work for the Dragon.

[pulupulu]

I don't play dragon as a flanker, even though I believe that actually is dragon's strength.

Why don't I play into dragon's strength? Because this is a team game. A heavy's main duty is front line battle; if you take a precious heavy away from front line, who are you replacing it with? Not medium, not light, and even assault will have trouble. Now your team is playing in disadvantage the moment you go around and try to do your little flank. Sure, your score will probably be decent, but your team will lose more often if the opponent is any competent.

Dragon's strength take precious resource away from front line. If one want to be a flanker, don't be a heavy; downsize to medium. Then all dragon has left is a glorified peek-a-boo medium mech. Hence I don't play my dragon anymore. My 55 ton mediums play the role of what my dragon used to do.

If you ever had a case that you as dragon and a friend also a dragon, and you guys went on an awesome flank, then turn around and find out your team got steam rolled then thought your team mates were bad and got rolled over; wake up, it wasn't because your team mate was bad, it was because you took 2 heavy away from the front line. You are the one who set your team up for failure.

If dragon actually has more firepower for peek-a-boo, i might play it more. If quirk buff still try to take a heavy away from front line, it will continue to gather dust.

Edited by pulupulu, 01 October 2014 - 10:59 PM.

[Alienized]

no one said that a flanker-dragon can't do frontline duties too... but really. 60 tons dont make it a good frontline mech and never will. orion and cataphract are more that thing.
but never a dragon.
and tbh, it doesnt really matter if a 55 ton mech or a 60 ton mech is there when they get rolled. what was missing was a good scout. nothing else.
because early scouting makes flanking more effective. and remaining mechs can build up a firing line.
leaving a awesome mech into the dust makes me sad tho.

[Lily from animove]

I think all low tier low tonnage mechs in their categories should get some acceleration and break quirks. Becaus emost of them are hit and run mechs by the fact of not being as much cooled and armed as their bigger mech pals in their categories.

[Deathlike]

Eldagore, on 01 October 2014 - 08:14 PM, said:

I find that method of evaluation rather shallow. I mean, there is always going to be "the least played mech" so what then, continuous quirk passes every 6 months to refresh the list?

While it may be shallow, you would have to consider that if the majority of people do not use a certain mech, is it possible there is something wrong with it? At best, it might not be used because it's not distinct, or serve a role that something else does better. At worst, it's not used because it's has a very limited niche application and requires significant effort to overcome said deficiencies.

Many players tend to do things of the path of least resistance. Outside of new mech introductions that inflate the queue in certain ways (like the Medium queue getting flooded with the Nova's release), these trends often show usages and discrepancies based on the current set of balance rules.

It's fine to have favorite mechs that are considered underperforming by the community. It is also fine that a mech figures into your particular playstyle. However, you simply cannot ignore deficiencies that others point out as the reason for it being the underperformer. There are usually other mechs that excel at the same thing, if not better (and likely having fewer deficiencies) and despite those mechs being suggested may not work for you... you simply can't underplay that better mech's superiority.

Edited by Deathlike, 02 October 2014 - 11:40 AM.

[Khobai]

Quote

I don't play dragon as a flanker, even though I believe that actually is dragon's strength.

Its not. The truth is the c-bill dragons have no strengths. Theyre bad mechs. period.

Even with some hella good quirks the c-bill dragons are still going to be barely passable at best. Lets not fool ourselves into thinking Dragons will ever be good. But hopefully they wont be as suck as they are now.

Edited by Khobai, 02 October 2014 - 12:03 PM.

[BOWMANGR]

Khobai, on 02 October 2014 - 11:55 AM, said:

Its not. The truth is the c-bill dragons have no strengths. Theyre bad mechs. period.

Even with some hella good quirks the c-bill dragons are still going to be barely passable at best. Lets not fool ourselves into thinking Dragons will ever be good. But hopefully they wont be as suck as they are now.

Why the long face?
If PGI finally decides that a 5% bonus to X ability is really minor and changes almost nothing, we may see some heavy bonuses incoming. That's what I'm hoping they would do. Then, a Dragon may be really good {because
I still don't think that it sucks so much as people say anyway}.

Crude example: If the 10% ballistic cooldown bonus becomes a generous 30% cooldown bonus to AC5 or AC10 and/or the side torsos get a buff, you may have a good mech right then and there.

Edited by BOWMANGR, 02 October 2014 - 12:49 PM.

[DarkonFullPower]

Bromineberry, on 01 October 2014 - 06:16 PM, said:

Why does everybody only talk about the CT? Most deaths in my Dragon since the hitbox changes are due to ST destruction, often leaving the CT armor orange or even yellow...

Because they either are piloting the Dragon like every other mech, or in low ELO where no one can hit the ST. I'm maybe 60/40 CT/ST deaths.

Personaly I'd love for all Autocannons on the Dragon's arm to have double Internal HP because, if I recall correctly, that's how it worked in Battletech. It was known for some sort of casing around the cannon that let it survive the first crit that hit it. A non-game breaking, lore accurate quirk.

Edited by DarkonFullPower, 02 October 2014 - 05:12 PM.

[BOWMANGR]

Bromineberry, on 01 October 2014 - 06:16 PM, said:

Why does everybody only talk about the CT? Most deaths in my Dragon since the hitbox changes are due to ST destruction, often leaving the CT armor orange or even yellow...

I mentioned this in page 2. Some people just go with word of mouth which is seriously outdated. The infamous Dragon CT was talked so much a few years back that some people just assume that it still is a bullet magnet as it was back then without actually piloting the mech to see that the STs take more damage now and you die because of the XL engine.

CT kills happen now only if you somehow manage to get in a staring contest with another heavy hitter. Even in this case it's not the big CT that failed.... Dragons just don't do fair staring contests. Only the triple AC2 has a chance to do that but even that is not effective enough. A Dragon should not stand still and exchange fire. Period. A Dragon cheats and wins.

I have written this too many times, I'll just say it once more: You know you are facing a good Dragon pilot, when you didn't even see him killing you.

Edited by BOWMANGR, 03 October 2014 - 12:57 AM.

[Looke Groundrunner]

I don't know if someone has mentioned this somewhere already, but what do you guys think if the DRG 5N got a buff to UAC5 jam frequency? That is the stock weapon in lore, and it does do very well when it doesn't jam. That would help tremendously because its main weapon would be more viable and, since it weighs much less than the combination of AC 2's, you would have much more balanced builds.