120 replies to this topic

[STEF_]

Being a team player I really love this new reward system!
Just made a bunch of matches and I made a lot of c-bills.

A few tips for those complaining:

1) work as a team

2) stay with your team/lance

3) focus fire

4) dont play at distance

5) HELP your teammates/lancemates

6) don't stay back making "surgical gauss"

7) don't run as suicide nut, ahead all alone


All BASIC team play tips.
So learn them.
Forget being selfish.
Stop complaing.

If an average pilot like me can make a lot of money, think about this: you are playing in the wrong way.

[Moriquendi86]

We need more of this. IMHO this system not only rewards those who play good, it also hints how to play good.

[Brody319]

This system needs a lot of tweaking. Its going in the right direction each action should reward more. However its currently rewarding 1v1 kills. It needs to reward assists a ton more than it does now. It is a team game after all, and when you are paying more for people to solo kill the enemies rather than assist each other with kills, there is a huge problem.

[Xarian]

The complaints are not in our heads - they are real.

A guy stays with his team the entire game, gets 800 damage, 4 kills, and 7 assists. He gets 127k C-Bills. I guess he wasn't playing very well, according to you.

Meanwhile, a LRM boat hides in the back, gets no kills, has 11 assists, and 127 damage. However, he was hiding behind a rock the whole time, so every volley of missiles counted as a "Flank" attack and gets 300k C-Bills. I guess he's a great player, then?

The reward system is utterly broken, as many, many people have been complaining about all night. Think about it for a second: what is more likely - that every player here is terrible, or that you're simply wrong?

[STEF_]

last 2 matches:

2 k/ 8 assists/548dmg : +238.000 c-bills
1 k/8assists/483dmg: +198.000 c.bills

I love team play. Today more than yesterday because I'm earning more

[STEF_]

Xarian, on 22 October 2014 - 01:08 AM, said:

The complaints are not in our heads - they are real.

A guy stays with his team the entire game, gets 800 damage, 4 kills, and 7 assists. He gets 127k C-Bills. I guess he wasn't playing very well, according to you.

Meanwhile, a LRM boat hides in the back, gets no kills, has 11 assists, and 127 damage. However, he was hiding behind a rock the whole time, so every volley of missiles counted as a "Flank" attack and gets 300k C-Bills. I guess he's a great player, then?

The reward system is utterly broken, as many, many people have been complaining about all night. Think about it for a second: what is more likely - that every player here is terrible, or that you're simply wrong?

Show screenshots or it never happened.
I'll show you mine.

edit: I won't say that that guy is not skilled, but I'm quite sure he didn't play as a team

Edited by Stefka Kerensky, 22 October 2014 - 01:24 AM.

[Xarian]

Please show the subtotal so we can tell whether or not your rewards include Premium or Hero bonus.

I'm not re-posting pictures yet again, and other players have a lot more to say on the issue than I do. Please go check any of the many threads.

Examples:
Thread
Another thread
Here's a thread where a guy got less than 150k for over 900 damage

[Featherwood]

I have played today few public games in solo queue with Stefka and can say that she is not a great pilot (neither I claim to be such myself), so few above average results do not show full picture neither of her nor of the new rewards system. Which, to be fair, has good approach and direction, but it still deepens the negative impact from current MatchMaker in PUGs. I mean that most of the PUGs are one sided stomps, so if you got lucky to spawn in winning team - even your below average performance will be rewarded (about 70% of income before the patch), but if you are unlucky (yeah, PUGs are mathematically balanced 50/50) - no matter what you do, until you hit 500 dmg you will receive less than 40-50k and you won't be able to cover your consumables expenses (oh, every one loves UAVs, quiaff?). That just s...s and needs to be revamped.

[White Bear 84]

Brody319, on 22 October 2014 - 12:49 AM, said:

It needs to reward assists a ton more than it does now. It is a team game after all, and when you are paying more for people to solo kill the enemies rather than assist each other with kills, there is a huge problem.

Perhaps a multiplier in there for damage and number of assists, similar to the comps.... ...so if you get 8 assist but do 10 damage, you get barely a cent, but if you do 800 damage, and get 8 assists you get more (of course you may also get the most damage reward as well)

[Xarian]

White Bear 84, on 22 October 2014 - 01:52 AM, said:

Perhaps a multiplier in there for damage and number of assists, similar to the comps.... ...so if you get 8 assist but do 10 damage, you get barely a cent, but if you do 800 damage, and get 8 assists you get more (of course you may also get the most damage reward as well)

I can confirm that it already works like this. 10 assists @ 220 damage = 9 xp. However, the reward that it gives you is already small - so you're taking a small number and making it even smaller if you didn't do much damage.

[Xarian]

Stefka I also want to say that it's very good that you are enjoying your time in the queue, and the reward system is teaching you new roles.

People just don't like it when you tell them to "stop complaining and learn to play better" - we have legitimate complaints, and insulting us by saying that we are terrible pilots who don't know how the game works is ignorant, arrogant, and doesn't even address the issue at hand.

[STEF_]

Xarian, on 22 October 2014 - 01:33 AM, said:

Please show the subtotal so we can tell whether or not your rewards include Premium or Hero bonus.

I'm not re-posting pictures yet again, and other players have a lot more to say on the issue than I do. Please go check any of the many threads.

Examples:
Thread
Another thread
Here's a thread where a guy got less than 150k for over 900 damage

I saw them!
And for this reason I went with my thread saying, in 2 words, "TEAM PLAY".

I got few kills and few dmg, but I make a lot of c-bills with bonus such as protectmedium/protect light/protect proximity flanking/hit and run/brawling/lance formation.

I'm making more c-bills now

Again like a mantra: TEAM PLAY

[The Boz]

Stefka Kerensky, on 22 October 2014 - 02:00 AM, said:

I saw them!
And for this reason I went with my thread saying, in 2 words, "TEAM PLAY".

I got few kills and few dmg, but I make a lot of c-bills with bonus such as protectmedium/protect light/protect proximity flanking/hit and run/brawling/lance formation.

I'm making more c-bills now

Again like a mantra: TEAM PLAY

But the game isn't teaching you to play, it's teaching you to game the system. Here, I'll take the bonuses you mentioned and extrapolate on their problems:
Protect/Protected Light/Medium - Favors Light and Assault mechs, because those get up to twice (with self-diminishing) as many chances of getting the bonus (because a Light can be protected by both a Heavy and an Assault, but a Medium can only be protected by an Assault, while a Heavy can only protect a Light).
Flanking/Hit-n-run - Favors over-the-horizon LRMs and 500m+ PPC pokers greatly.
Brawling - I expected a lot from this (Atlas brawling is my favored playstyle), and am quite disappointed at how little it's worth on its own, without actual kills that are not exclusive to it.
Lance Formation - Favores heavier mechs, as they're less likely to run out of position. Also favors entire LRM lances.

What can be gathered from these: Drop in an Assault lance, either for brawling or LRM-spam. Get more $$ because Assaults pack more firepower than lights. Scouting rewards are mediocre at best.

And ALL of this is teaching you to NOT try and break stand-offs in order to secure a win, because getting killed while doing so (which is more than likely) is not rewarding at all.

[STEF_]

Featherwood, on 22 October 2014 - 01:45 AM, said:

no matter what you do, until you hit 500 dmg you will receive less than 40-50k and you won't be able to cover your consumables expenses (oh, every one loves UAVs, quiaff?). That just s...s and needs to be revamped.

It's esactly what I'm saying: dmg and kills are important for the win, of course, but with the new reward system if you want to make c-bills other stuffs are important now.

[Xarian]

Stefka Kerensky, on 22 October 2014 - 02:16 AM, said:

It's esactly what I'm saying: dmg and kills are important for the win, of course, but with the new reward system if you want to make c-bills other stuffs are important now.

These other stuffs are hurting your chances of winning the game. It's teaching you how to do certain roles, like TAG and NARC spotting, but it's also teaching you some bad behavior that hurt your piloting behavior.

If a scout breaks off from his lance but doesn't find any enemy mechs in a specific place, he loses C-Bills for doing his job - he should be scouting, but instead he's hugging an Atlas for extra C-Bills.

If the lance gets set up poorly, you get rewarded for staying near mechs that you shouldn't be near. For example, Kit Fox should be hanging out with Timber Wolf and Dire Wolf, not hanging out with Firestarter and Jenner.

ERLL and Gauss snipers get rewarded for being up front, when they should be in the back.

[White Bear 84]

Xarian, on 22 October 2014 - 01:53 AM, said:

I can confirm that it already works like this. 10 assists @ 220 damage = 9 xp. However, the reward that it gives you is already small - so you're taking a small number and making it even smaller if you didn't do much damage.

Well, not to make it smaller - but increase it incrementally to a cap for more damage.. ..so you are justifying more sustained damage..

[Lily from animove]

Xarian, on 22 October 2014 - 01:57 AM, said:

Stefka I also want to say that it's very good that you are enjoying your time in the queue, and the reward system is teaching you new roles.

People just don't like it when you tell them to "stop complaining and learn to play better" - we have legitimate complaints, and insulting us by saying that we are terrible pilots who don't know how the game works is ignorant, arrogant, and doesn't even address the issue at hand.

all this is teaching is to how rack up laods of money wihtout being a real help for the entire mission. there are too many rewards atm being triggerd totally in absurd situations.

I had that one mission on HPG where I wa sin a kit fox and everoyne went under the sattelite dish, from that poitn everything went wrong, bu being the kit fox purelyy build on support, I couldn't do anythign than sticking with this worst choice the PUG dynamic decided to do. But hey many shiny cbills got triggered.

But these were so fr only a few matches, I am going to paly some more probably recording soem matches and see what is doind stuff that feels incorrect.

[STEF_]

The Boz, on 22 October 2014 - 02:09 AM, said:

But the game isn't teaching you to play, it's teaching you to game the system. Here, I'll take the bonuses you mentioned and extrapolate on their problems:
Protect/Protected Light/Medium - Favors Light and Assault mechs, because those get up to twice (with self-diminishing) as many chances of getting the bonus (because a Light can be protected by both a Heavy and an Assault, but a Medium can only be protected by an Assault, while a Heavy can only protect a Light).
Flanking/Hit-n-run - Favors over-the-horizon LRMs and 500m+ PPC pokers greatly.
Brawling - I expected a lot from this (Atlas brawling is my favored playstyle), and am quite disappointed at how little it's worth on its own, without actual kills that are not exclusive to it.
Lance Formation - Favores heavier mechs, as they're less likely to run out of position. Also favors entire LRM lances.

What can be gathered from these: Drop in an Assault lance, either for brawling or LRM-spam. Get more $$ because Assaults pack more firepower than lights. Scouting rewards are mediocre at best.

And ALL of this is teaching you to NOT try and break stand-offs in order to secure a win, because getting killed while doing so (which is more than likely) is not rewarding at all.

I play without having c-bills in mind, but I try to do my best to win; I'm just piloting stormcrow, bought them yesterday.
I like to pilot medium mech, so I can "do it all". Maybe that's why I'm getting more c-bills than yesterday.
I run towards the enemy, I spot it, try to flank.
I see a teammate engaging or engaged, I always help him.
When I see a teammate trying to escape from enemy I cover him.
I see a light stripping armor from my near assault, I leave my objective to help him.
When I see 2 mates focusing fire, I go for it.
I never run solo.
I don't like to suicide.
What can I say... playing as always I'm getting more c-bills now than before last patch.

[bluepiglet]

It's funny that some think the system is encouraging teamwork. Because it's not. The greatest rewards go to the ones get the kills. And players unable to secure kills get next to nothing. I got 93k afer a win for 630 damage last night because I wasn't focusing fire on the dying targets. Only played a few game and it already appears that players are now blocking each others / refusing to engage to outlive teammembers to get the most last hits. And it's only to get worse, much much worse.

[STEF_]

bluepiglet, on 22 October 2014 - 02:29 AM, said:

It's funny that some think the system is encouraging teamwork. Because it's not. The greatest rewards go to the ones get the kills. And players unable to secure kills get next to nothing. I got 93k afer a win for 630 damage last night because I wasn't focusing fire on the dying targets. Only played a few game and it already appears that players are now blocking each others / refusing to engage to outlive teammembers to get the most last hits. And it's only to get worse, much much worse.

You saw that "team play" rewards are cumulative, right?

edit: the nice thing is that your explications about why is getting worse are just making my point.

Edited by Stefka Kerensky, 22 October 2014 - 02:49 AM.