14 replies to this topic

[LennStar]

I have the impression that BAP not only makes you targetable now in an 360m radius, which is a little crazy anyway, but also

for every other mech on the team

meaning that if an ECM mech at position A is targeted by an BAP, it is also targetable for the other mechs on the team at Position B 600m away.
I have often seen ecm mechs where no other ecm-teammember was near enough to counter and no TAG or NARC was used as far as I have seen,

I dont think that so many people set their ECM to counter and forget to switch it back - 90% dont even use counter.

[Ironwithin]

BAP does not just make ECM-carries targetable at a range of 360m.
One BAP flatout deactivates one ECM at a range of 360m.

So yes, everybody and their grandmother can target you if you get too close to someone with BAP, anyone has line-of-sight on you and presses R.

"Working as intended."

Edited by Ironwithin, 22 November 2014 - 11:12 AM.

[Ryokens leap]

and it lets me lock CSSRM onto you as well!

[LennStar]

So basically I can put out the ECM out of all my mechs now.

[reaverOfCheesecake]

LennStar, on 22 November 2014 - 12:33 PM, said:

So basically I can put out the ECM out of all my mechs now.

sure... why not... but consider this example before you do. I have noticed that my ecm gets countered more regularly now. But it also allows me to know that their are sneaky little bap lights about, hiding behind buildings and what not... I know they are about because my ecm does weird stuff, but they don't know about me cause my ecm does nothing to em... so normally i run round that back of the building, see a bap light who didn't realise that i was around (they never got line of sight on me, just countered my ecm) and empty my load into his/her back which makes them take notice :-). I normally have the advantage at this point cause i've alpha'd them in a weak spot so i normally win.

Edited by reaverOfCheesecake, 24 November 2014 - 05:24 AM.

[Bigbacon]

LennStar, on 22 November 2014 - 12:33 PM, said:

So basically I can put out the ECM out of all my mechs now.

yes. remove it, it is useless. BAP counters ECM better than ECM in counter mode. Replace ECM with BAP as it is more useful now.

I did...spend more time in reed X than being able to use ECM at all.

[ShinVector]

You know what I just realised ?
The novelty of the ECM Loki/Thor was made useless before it came out.

Probably PGI will see fit the error in their ways (nerf BAP) when its closer to the release date.

[Fauxwise]

Yes, please pull any ECM you carry out of your 'mechs.

[Nemesis Duck]

reaverOfCheesecake, on 24 November 2014 - 05:19 AM, said:

sure... why not... but consider this example before you do. I have noticed that my ecm gets countered more regularly now. But it also allows me to know that their are sneaky little bap lights about, hiding behind buildings and what not...

I disagree. The range at which BAP cancels ECM is so large that you can't be certain with any reliance where exactly the BAP mech is, or in which direction. It feels like a BAP mech can be entirely disengaged from your doings, engaging in totally separate actions that normally wouldn't affect you in your position, and yet completely rain out your ball game.

It's almost as if ... BAP is too powerful.

[Ironwithin]

Assmodeus, on 27 November 2014 - 03:40 PM, said:

...
It's almost as if ... BAP is too powerful.

Or maybe, JUST maybe, ECM was too powerful and you got used to the crutch?

[Nemesis Duck]

I don't think so. Being too powerful for over two years? Sir, your boat does not float. Somewhere someone else disagreed.

ECM makes the game more challenging, but in a controlled way, by forcing you use you eyes instead of your sensors, which is something real pilots are trained to do. The effect is controlled, in particular, because it effects one major game aspect like a definite on/off with no inbetween values. That makes it easy to adapt to situations of stress, creates tension and forces you to be on your toes. The removal of ECM entirely would be a move towards monotony. With less options for the pilot it would be a move away from being a 'thinking man's game'. ECM is now half as effective. The BAP range as it stands now is a step in that direction. We need variety to keep the game from getting stale. That's where the CW/PvE sentiment is coming from. PGI has been doing an OK job so far but the fact that there's demand means it's not right yet.

In the pug queue, MM should've been tweaked to prevent multiple ECMs, maybe even one, from being on one team while having none on the other, to make the playing field fair for newbies. Then, no rule such for CW.

I think the ECM nerf is related to newbie outcry, the fog map and Loki.

Sorry for my use of many north american coloquialisms. If something doesn't make sense, please tell me and I will reword it.

[Tarogato]

Yes, BAP is too strong against ECM. I'd prefer a halfway point between the old counter range and the newly buffed one.

I'm not saying this as a regular ECM pilot, I'm usually running LCT, JR7, and STK these days. I only hop in my Cicada when I'm in a certain mood, but when I do, its ECM is countered for all but the first minute of the match. And I never seem ECM working for enemies either - whenever I get LoS on one it's usually already countered by my team. Seems pretty worthless - gotta compromise that BAP range.

[B1ackBishop]

I think BAP would be fine as is, if PGI could make one BAP counter one ECM at a time. Not one BAP counter all ECMs in a 360m range.

It would give BAP a reason to be used and ECM too, without either being too OP.

Edited by B1ackBishop, 28 November 2014 - 02:01 AM.

[Ironwithin]

B1ackBishop, on 28 November 2014 - 01:57 AM, said:

I think BAP would be fine as is, if PGI could make one BAP counter one ECM at a time. Not one BAP counter all ECMs in a 360m range.

It would give BAP a reason to be used and ECM too, without either being too OP.

But...that's exactly what it does. One BAP deactivates one ECM in range.

[B1ackBishop]

Ironwithin, on 28 November 2014 - 02:46 AM, said:

But...that's exactly what it does. One BAP deactivates one ECM in range.

Really? Sorry if I'm incorrect then.
So if 2 ECM mechs run in range of 1 BAP mech, 1 of the ECMs will still work normally? After playing in groups, especially ECM heavy, I had the impression that all our ECMs were being countered. Could have been and equal number (or more) of BAPs, true...

If that's the case, then I have no complaints about BAP at all. Thx for clearing that up for me.

Edited by B1ackBishop, 28 November 2014 - 03:06 AM.