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Please Stop Doing Town Halls

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#21 Felbombling

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 05:46 AM

View PostNightshade24, on 30 April 2016 - 07:33 PM, said:

really? I feel like every time a repeat question is asked it goes...

"haven't we already answered this question already last town hall?" "stop asking the same questions please guys (at players)" etc...

They have memory. However the playerbase doesn't seem to...


Nightshade, I get the feeling that you didn't watch the stream chat while the Town Hall was going on. There were plenty of questions the NgNg guys could have gone with that were not repeat questions. Instead, they chose to repeat questions from previous Town Halls. Now, either they have been told specifically not to ask certain questions, or they lack memory skills from previous Town Halls. I'm not even talking about loaded questions, either. Straight up important information was being sought that had not been touched on before.

That is why I was frustrated. Might be my last Town Hall. I can find out the new Mech the next morning and not really miss anything of importance.

#22 Anunknownlurker

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 05:49 AM

No one forces us to watch them. If Russ wants to do them and NGNGTV are happy to host, let them be.

Personally I don't bother with them, after the first couple (which I thought were both interesting and informative) they have degenerated into repeated questions with no clear answers and a mech announcement.

But, as I say, we are not forced to watch and Russ is not forced to do them.

#23 SpeCtaCular

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 07:08 AM

View PostSkyHammyr, on 30 April 2016 - 06:57 PM, said:

The Dev VLOGs were nice, too.

I liked them too. I wish they would have kept making them.

I used to grab some snacks, cold drinks and enjoy the dev VLOG's.

One of those moments when you just lay back and chill.

#24 Paigan

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 07:15 AM

View PostAdamski, on 30 April 2016 - 06:52 PM, said:

Please stop doing Town Halls.

They are an incredible waste of time.

Please DO go back to doing ASK THE DEVS, with community sourced questions.

All the Town halls seem to do is waste 3 hours with Russ, and inflate NGNG viewer numbers.

All of the information that is provided could be better communicated through some Press Releases, or Announcements. And the questions could be better asked and answered in more detail with more authority / sincerity when they are known in advance and can be properly researched then given a detailed answer.

Seriously, Russ, please stop wasting everyones time as well as your own doing these overly long Town Hall sessions that have next to no structure and almost never address community concerns.

This

Properly prepared textual information is ALWAYS better than spontaneous defuse babbling.
That is, if one is capable of processing textual information, which is an increasingly rare skill today, as it seems.

Edited by Paigan, 01 May 2016 - 07:16 AM.


#25 Coolant

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 07:17 AM

Bring back Viona....

#26 Davegt27

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 07:18 AM

Not doing town halls might be a little much

Getting NGNG to ask better questions might help


#27 Davers

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 07:46 AM

The problems with the THs is that they aren't talking about any upcoming changes, other than maybe mentioning that there will be changes at some unspecified date. The whole mech rescale is a huge project, but they haven't really said much. Power draw will (potentially) by a game changing feature, but we still know nothing about it. Sitting through an hour long show just to hear a mech announcement is pretty pointless. I was really bummed to hear that there wasn't a TH Highlights post because nothing was said of interest.

#28 Afuldan McKronik

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 07:55 AM

View PostDavers, on 01 May 2016 - 07:46 AM, said:

The problems with the THs is that they aren't talking about any upcoming changes, other than maybe mentioning that there will be changes at some unspecified date. The whole mech rescale is a huge project, but they haven't really said much. Power draw will (potentially) by a game changing feature, but we still know nothing about it. Sitting through an hour long show just to hear a mech announcement is pretty pointless. I was really bummed to hear that there wasn't a TH Highlights post because nothing was said of interest.


"Heres new shiny PokeMech. No more suggestions please, we know exactly how to balance the game."

Theres your TH highlight post.

#29 Foxtrot four eight

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 08:06 AM

For what its worth, I agree, stop doing town halls.

#30 Alistair Winter

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 08:19 AM

Honestly, I think Town Halls started out great. When they first started doing them, I became a lot more sympathetic with Russ and his point of view, especially explaining some of the choices they were forced to make because of IGP. They changed my views on a number of things. It was a lot better to hear him explain things with his own words than to read a Command Chair post.

But over time, a bunch of things have happened. For one thing, PGI has basically stopped interacting with their fans everywhere except [sporadically] on Twitter.. Secondly, from having a sincere and positive tone, Russ is sounding increasingly fed-up and bitter in his last Town Hall meetings. It now has the opposite effect of when he started. Instead of inspiring sympathy, he's now creating a sense of animosity, like "Oh, here we go with these pointless questions!" and "Oh, listen to these idiots who think they know how to make a game!"

It's really uncomfortable to listen to the awkward, tense dialogue. I don't think Town Halls are a bad idea, but they should definitely stop doing them, at this point. They seem painful for everyone involved.

Edited by Alistair Winter, 01 May 2016 - 08:20 AM.


#31 Zordicron

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 08:29 AM

I think the town halls are fine.

They should do them more infrequently. IMO, it felt like there was only 3 weeks in between the last ones. Maybe there was, I don;t pay attention that much. I didn;t bother with this one because I figured, as it was so soon following the last, there would either just be one BIG announcement, or just some little garbage and NGNG wanted some camera time.

If these were say, once every 3 months- they would be a lot more useful because for one, something might have actually changed development wise to report progress on, and second, the questions might not seem so stale because you didn;t just hear an answer 3 weeks ago on the same thing.

The best town halls are the ones where they have screen caps and other news to share about projects they are on. Projects take a while. Therefore, if they halls are too frequent, there won;t be any news to share.

Part of the problem also is that Russ's answers are always very, very general and often dismissive. I simple: I will put that on my list and get back to you next time" followed by opening the next town hall with "old news" as such and responding to those points. Use the town hall to gather feedback and report progress. Don;t respond to feedback until you know an actual answer. make it a point to get an actual answer for the next town hall.

Really, it all comes down to the halls being too disorganized and Russ not preparing for them outside of whatever announcment he has in mind for 5 minutes.

Here is a format:

1. Old news. This is where Russ takes time to speak on points taken from the previous hall. Actual clear answers of yay or nay or not for a while but we like it are given. If it is something for "maybe later" some type of time is needed so customers know how long to expect before it is worth bringing it back up again.
2. Progress updates. This is where Russ would talk about progress on features that are in the works. There is usually only a fistful, and if there is nothing of real value to share, a simple confirmation of work in progress and updated time of completion is all that is needed.
3. Announcment(s). Whatever Russ has in mind for this. New mechs, features. No answering questions until all announcments are done.
4. Questions specifically about announcements. In the order they were announced. Hosts, or even Russ, need to simply state "taking questions about topic A" and then go from there. When it is clear it is getting down to nitpicks and other vague pointless comments, it is time to move on to topic B.
5. General feedback Q and A. Community feedback time, on topics NOT about new announcments. If there is a clear answer to be given, response is given. If not, it is added to a list of topics to cover in the enxt town halls "old news". When the list gets big enough, you end the town hall.

The best part about a format like this is it keeps the hall from meandering on for 3 hours, UNLESS it is actually warranted. It also makes it very easy for Russ to have clear answers, because for one, he is only answering questions he has clear answers for, and two, if he doesn;t, he will research it and have one for next time, and also allow himself a reasonable limit for researchable questions. AND, because he has a researched answer now, when it comes up again next time he WILL ALREADY HAVE a clear answer. This would remove all the dead horse questions he is forced to drone on about because he hasn;t addressed them yet and made a decision through research.


All of that though, is based on the idea Russ and crew actually want to give customers a product they want, and not just make a product and hope enough people buy it. IMO, Russ is on that second one right now. It really feels like he is moving back to Marine Sharpshooter days and just making us a clumsy FPS with no intent of actual longevity or large scope of design. I feel as though, in his mind, the game is "done" because the only part that interests him is the actual shooting part(see: his older games) and he has been working to simply use that part as an engine to make money= Espurts/tourny.


The best thing that could happen to MWO, is Russ takes over as just managing the espurts tourny part, and some one else gets put as head of dev for the rest. Be it PVE, more FW, etc. Everything besides new mechs and "how does it shoot" gets such a half hearted attempt at design I just don;t see how the game will move forward past mediocre FPS/Marine Sharpshooter.

#32 Beaching Betty

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 08:43 AM

+1

#33 Adamski

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 08:49 AM

View PostDavegt27, on 01 May 2016 - 07:18 AM, said:

Not doing town halls might be a little much

Getting NGNG to ask better questions might help


It is the same reason many reporters don't ask politicians tough questions, if they do, then the politicians stop doing interviews with them and claim media bias.

NGNG wont ask tough questions, because it would jeopardize their status and access and ability to do these Town Halls. Thus the Town Halls become a meandering over long press release.

NGNG aren't accountable to the playerbase at all, and have no reason to advocate anything that they aren't already interested in.

#34 SkyHammyr

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 09:09 AM

Here's a thought...

How about instead of having us sit and watch a mostly blank twitch screen, these three actually group up and play the game?
Make em play CW/FP, too- there'll be plenty of time to answer the softball questions and announce mech packs while in queue.

Edited by SkyHammyr, 01 May 2016 - 10:49 AM.


#35 Aethon

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 12:29 PM

View PostAdamski, on 30 April 2016 - 06:52 PM, said:

Please stop doing Town Halls.

They are an incredible waste of time.

Please DO go back to doing ASK THE DEVS, with community sourced questions.

All the Town halls seem to do is waste 3 hours with Russ, and inflate NGNG viewer numbers.

All of the information that is provided could be better communicated through some Press Releases, or Announcements. And the questions could be better asked and answered in more detail with more authority / sincerity when they are known in advance and can be properly researched then given a detailed answer.

Seriously, Russ, please stop wasting everyones time as well as your own doing these overly long Town Hall sessions that have next to no structure and almost never address community concerns.


I would even give Town Halls another try, if someone other than NGNG ran them. Brown-nosers and shills rarely ask the hard, important questions.

#36 Khobai

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 12:39 PM

The problem isnt townhalls. Its the format.

People talk that really shouldnt be talking.

And the questions that everyone wants to hear dont get asked.

#37 DAYLEET

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 12:56 PM

First, lets have Eckman instead of Russ for public relation. Eckman knows how to talk to a crowd. Russ can be fed a question and if no one stop him he will talk about it for hours and reiterate and justify and reiterate and talk around it and justify and.... Nothing against you Russ, i can't talk to a crowd either. Maybe both of yo ucould be sitting together, maybe add Paul too.

Townhall are better than nothing, they just are. Dev log were very nice too, i feel they have been replaced with live streaming like Lauren do when working. Which is nice but i rather have 15min to watch with concise question or just statement about the state of things than look at someone work for an hour. I do appreciate the effort put in the live streaming of pgi working or playing, i really do, but i dont have time to watch someone else than me play or work. I catch some after they are done, skip through them, if anything good was said i most likely miss it.


View PostAlistair Winter, on 01 May 2016 - 08:19 AM, said:

Honestly, I think Town Halls started out great. When they first started doing them, I became a lot more sympathetic with Russ and his point of view, especially explaining some of the choices they were forced to make because of IGP. They changed my views on a number of things. It was a lot better to hear him explain things with his own words than to read a Command Chair post.

But over time, a bunch of things have happened. For one thing, PGI has basically stopped interacting with their fans everywhere except [sporadically] on Twitter.. Secondly, from having a sincere and positive tone, Russ is sounding increasingly fed-up and bitter in his last Town Hall meetings. It now has the opposite effect of when he started. Instead of inspiring sympathy, he's now creating a sense of animosity, like "Oh, here we go with these pointless questions!" and "Oh, listen to these idiots who think they know how to make a game!"

It's really uncomfortable to listen to the awkward, tense dialogue. I don't think Town Halls are a bad idea, but they should definitely stop doing them, at this point. They seem painful for everyone involved.


I agree with everything except the last part. Someone had a bad day maybe, at job or at home, **** happens and then maybe you get what we had. Some things need to change for sure.

It really didnt look like they were prepared in any ways last town hall. They certainly didnt gain any votes. They hired new peoples months ago, anything to tell us about it? ANYTHING? get us interested, maybe skip community question altogether for one townhall and just talk to us about whats going on. hell at this point just talking about that time you put salt in someones coffee would have been better.

Edited by DAYLEET, 01 May 2016 - 01:21 PM.


#38 Malcolm Vordermark

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 01:22 PM

The town hall's strength has been when Russ has something he wants to talk about and has prepared for in advance. It falls apart when they go into live question.

Stop doing the live questions and start preparing for the questions segment in advance. Pick good questions and get good answers for them. Right now we're getting too many dumb and repeat questions and too many "i don't know", "it's on our list", "I'll have to ask" answers.

An unscripted questions segment would work fine on the podcast, but I have a different set of expectations from the town halls.

Edited by Rouken Vordermark, 01 May 2016 - 01:26 PM.


#39 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 01:34 PM

View PostAdamski, on 30 April 2016 - 07:36 PM, said:

Twitter is just as bad as Town Hall, I don't think anyone anywhere suggested utilizing a personal twitter account for announcements. It just encourages Russ to pay attention to the people who are already inclined to agree with everything he says to maintain their access to him.

But requiring Russ to find 3 free hours to shoot the breeze with NGNG, is much more time intensive then spending the 10 minutes to write up the press release, then another 5 minutes to proof read it for clarity.

Ask The Devs allowed players to forward questions, Russ could then pass them on to whatever department / person was in charge of that aspect, then relay that answer back to the players.

Another bonus to the Ask The Devs format, if a question keeps getting brought up, players can easily be redirected to where it was answered, instead of just a generic "I'm pretty sure we answered that before somewhere, feel free to comb through 12+ hours of Town Hall jibber jabber to find the answer". That is assuming it was actually addressed in a Town Hall and not some private / non public conversation.


Odd. I disagree and take Russ to task pretty regularly and yet have helped get him to make changes on multiple things.

Probably helps that I don't act like a dbag to him.

#40 Adamski

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 01:37 PM

View PostBishop Steiner, on 01 May 2016 - 01:34 PM, said:

Odd. I disagree and take Russ to task pretty regularly and yet have helped get him to make changes on multiple things.

Probably helps that I don't act like a dbag to him.


Odd, when people mentioned that Russ actually listened to you on Twitter, YOU said that the best way to get him to listen to them too was to Agree & Like & Retweet lots of his posts and keep tweeting complements at him until he follows them, then you can start actually bringing up issues (in 140 characters or less).

So, no, I don't like that playing the part of online sycophant until you gain access is an appropriate channel for game feedback.

Edited by Adamski, 01 May 2016 - 01:38 PM.






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