15 replies to this topic

[Spleenslitta]

I know the most important concerns many had the moment they saw the thread title.
Because the list of concerns is long but i have put big letter titles above each possible concern with the solutions just below that for easy navigation.

BTW. This is a suggestion for PGI to have an official mech design contest.
Not something we would do just for kicks.

Wouldn't we just model overpowered mechs?
There are 3 reasons why it will be impossible to cheat numbered below.

1
Alex Iglesias aka Flyingdebris will be the one who creates mechs as usual inspired by a picture.
We make drawings, 3D models, plastic models or tattooing it on our buttocks are all accepted.
These mechs we draw will be what Alex uses to make the mechs.
We do not create the end product. Alex does and we just provide him with inspiration in the form of a drawing, 3D model, etc.

Any contestant trying to make overly large shield arms, stick thin legs, tiny cockpits or something else that would be concidered a cheat receives either an instant disqualification or warning.

2
PGI decides on certain characteristics we will have to base our drawings on. For example.
PGI wants this contest to be about a 40 tonn IS mech with the following configuration.

Max armor amount : 306. Maximum 5 JJ's. Maximum engine size: 250
Weapon hardpoints: 3 energy, 2 Ballistic, 1 missile. 1 AMS hardpoint.
1 Energy mounted up high in the right torso.
2 Ballistics in the left arm. 1 Energy and 1 missile hardpoint in the right arm.
1 Energy in the lower left torso. 1 AMS in left torso.
Torso twist /pitch angles- 115/25 degrees. Arm yaw /pitch - 30 /30

PGI also decides on how the mech will be equipped in it's stock configuration.
I will stop there since you understand now that we will be restricted in what we can make.

Furthermore PGI can state that we must make mechs that have lowslung arm like the Hellbringer, Vindicator, etc.
The cockpit will be below shoulder height.
The mech will be a croucher type mech built low to the ground like the Adder, but with a wide and deep chest.

3
Mechs with overpowered quirks cannot be made since PGI decides on the quirks themselves.
Contestants have no influence on that unless PGI allows it.

But PGI has decided on how the mech will look allready.
I got no artistic freedom and i want to make at least 1 decision on the mechs capabilities.

PGI could put out several things we can make a decision on.
Maybe we are allowed to only decide on a single capability or two.

These capabilities could be just about anything. A few examples.

- Mount 1 more missile hardpoint in the right arm but if we do the torso twist and pitch angle goes down to 100/20 degrees instead of 115/25 degrees.
- Mount an additional ballistic hardpoint in the upper left torso but in return the engine maximum size is reduced to 225.
- We can decide to have high slung arms like on the Jager but if we do that the mech has half it's JJ's removed.


I do not want a mech that didn't appear in the TT game. Why should we have one?
There are allready several mech variants in MWO that where never in the board game.
Ilya Muromets is one such variant and there are others.
But what is the threat of a completly new mech? Will it really hurt MWO to have a mech that wasn't designed for the TT game?
I do not see any problems with it as long as it's impossible to cheat PGI into approving an overpowered mech.

Copyrighted materials. Contestants that use copyrighted mechs.
PGI could just make us liable for such a thing by making us accept a contract that we are responsible for our own creations.
If we breach a copyright we pay the price and PGI will by no means be responsible.
Also they can keep the contest winner drawing/ 3D model out in public for a while to make certain that if it is a copyrighted mech the copyright holder will hear of it.
It's not everyday a game developer lets players provide inpiration for game content so the media will catch that.

My favorite mech will be delayed because of this contest.
Let's say a community member is an incredibly talented 3D modeler and he participates in this contest.
PGI might hire him whether he wins the contest or not because of his sheer talent.
Imagine if they find another genius like Alex Iglesias?
That would speed up the creation of new mechs a bit so you might get your favorite mech earlier rather than later.

I saw a guy get a job designing mechs once for a mech MMO called Force of Arms.
He created 5 mechs and 1 of them was accepted as an official mech.

How likely is it for someone to get hired? It's quite likely since PGI has had this sign out for a while.



But all the mechs we send in will be so ugly there is no way Alex can make anything cool out of it.
Please visit the art section in these forums. There are a lot of talented people in our community.
A few links leading to awesome looking stuff.
http://mwomercs.com/...-mech-3d-model/
http://mwomercs.com/...awings-of-mine/
http://mwomercs.com/...ld-mech-models/

Besides look at the drawings the mechs in MWO came from.
This is a Vindicator from the TT game. It's not a pretty drawing but MWO's Vindicator looks fine.



PGI's would use too many resources to pick a winner of the contest.
You might be concerned too many of PGI's people would be occupied with selecting contest winners.
Easy solution. We put our contributions inside an official thread made by PGI.
Then the 10 mechs that gets the most likes by the players will go to the final where PGI makes their final decision.
We are not allowed to vote for our own creations. If any of these 10 mechs have things that aren't allowed such as stick thin legs another mech is selected to be among the finalists.

Dummy accounts cheating.
This is the only concern i'm worried about and i do not know if the solution i suggests is possible.

You might think that would just make a few players create extra accounts to vote on themselves.
That could be solved by only allowing accounts that have made at least 100 posts on these forums to vote.
PGI should be able to modify the like button inside the contest thread to only accept those who have at least 100 posts.


What kind of benefit does PGI gain from this?
Media will pick up on the developers that allows the community to contribute content to their game.
CCP did a ship design contest for EVE Online some time back and it was successfull.
I don't see why PGI cannot do the same.
Besides i really want them to discover a rival for Flyingdebris among us and hire her/him.
That would speed up the creation of new mechs by a lot.



Now that so many concerns have been adressed let's talk. Would you participate in such a contest?
Do you see any way to cheat that i didn't adress?

Edited by Spleenslitta, 04 September 2016 - 05:59 AM.

[Spleenslitta]

Let me be the first to embarras myself. Here is a mech i created hoping it would be taken up by a proffesional mech designer back when the FoA forums was still alive.
I can't do textures so i only put in different colors to make parts stand out more.




Yes it's ugly. It took me several months to learn about Blender till i was able to create it. I'm still not satisfied...but it will do as an example.

[Juodas Varnas]

Spleenslitta, on 04 September 2016 - 02:51 AM, said:

Let me be the first to embarras myself. Here is a mech i created hoping it would be taken up by a proffesional mech designer back when the FoA forums was still alive.
I can't do textures so i only put in different colors to make parts stand out more.




Yes it's ugly. It took me several months to learn about Blender till i was able to create it. I'm still not satisfied...but it will do as an example.

Woooo Quadrupeds!

That is all.

[El Bandito]

Concept contest for chassis that are already in BT universe is fine with me. Creating new variants for them is also fine. Creating a never before seen chassis--that's where I draw the line.

[Spleenslitta]

El Bandito, on 04 September 2016 - 03:58 AM, said:

Concept contest for chassis that are already in BT universe is fine with me. Creating new variants for them is also fine. Creating a never before seen chassis--that's where I draw the line.

We all have our lines and limits. But when i look at the ship design contest CCP made for EVE Online i can't help but think that it was great publisity for CCP.
PGI could use a boost in popularity.

[Gamuray]

Spleenslitta, on 04 September 2016 - 04:06 AM, said:

We all have our lines and limits. But when i look at the ship design contest CCP made for EVE Online i can't help but think that it was great publisity for CCP.
PGI could use a boost in popularity.

Does EVE have a long time line with a list of all the vehicles and units that existed during said timeline? MWO has that. Every vehicle is catalogued and preexisting in the BT universe. If you want to design a new one, it goes at the most recent point in the timeline, not the middle.

That said. If you want to do a mech design contest just for kicks, sure. That's cool. But don't be implementing completely made up chassis into a game with plenty more to add.

[Spleenslitta]

Gamuray, on 04 September 2016 - 05:12 AM, said:

Does EVE have a long time line with a list of all the vehicles and units that existed during said timeline? MWO has that. Every vehicle is catalogued and preexisting in the BT universe. If you want to design a new one, it goes at the most recent point in the timeline, not the middle.

That said. If you want to do a mech design contest just for kicks, sure. That's cool. But don't be implementing completely made up chassis into a game with plenty more to add.

Mech design contest for kick? Nope. I wanted PGI to make an official contest.
As for the mechs that are yet to be added - How much of a delay would such a mech contest do? How delayed would those mechs be?
Exactly the same time it takes for Alex to make a mech from a picture which is exactly what he does nowadays.

I understand sticking to the lore but why be so inflexible about it? We got new variant of existing mechs so why not a new chassis?
I just fail to see why you feel so threatend by this.
It's not going to be the end of the world if a new chassis that nobody has ever seen before appears in MWO.

[YourSaviorLegion]

Atlas II with Clan Tech

[zagibu]

It's almost impossible to come up with a mech design that doesn't already exist in BT lore.

[RestosIII]

zagibu, on 04 September 2016 - 11:08 AM, said:

It's almost impossible to come up with a mech design that doesn't already exist in BT lore.

MW:O 2017.

[Spleenslitta]

zagibu, on 04 September 2016 - 11:08 AM, said:

It's almost impossible to come up with a mech design that doesn't already exist in BT lore.

I did not create this but here you go. Mechs you have never seen in the BT lore.
It also shows how talented some of our community members are.

[RestosIII]

Spleenslitta, on 04 September 2016 - 11:22 AM, said:

I did not create this but here you go. Mechs you have never seen in the BT lore.
It also shows how talented some of our community members are.

So... Mad Max: Mech Edition? I'd rather not.

Edited by RestosIII, 04 September 2016 - 11:48 AM.

[Spleenslitta]

RestosIII, on 04 September 2016 - 11:48 AM, said:

So... Mad Max: Mech Edition? I'd rather not.

I'll just quote myself from the original post.

Spleenslitta, on 04 September 2016 - 02:35 AM, said:

We do not create the end product. Alex does and we just provide him with inspiration in the form of a drawing, 3D model, etc.

Those mechs i showed in the picture could inspire Alex to create an MWO version of such a mech.
Look at the pictures from the TT game.
From such a picture we got the looks of our the Vindicator in MWO.

[Chuck Jager]

I do not see any issue with a contest that allows folks to submit designs that are evaluated by both PGI and the community with various participation rewards BUT no promise of implementation or the the ability of the submitters to retain control of any visual/technical/story ideas submitted (possible shared asset legal issues later down road)

Having been educated and worked as a graphic designer, I remember teachers specifically warning about "community" events because even if individual submit work willingly they still feel more equal in the final decision and implementation while not having to bear the responsibility of being a team player that the staff does.

My work is always considered a "work for hire" and I am not allowed to comment on how it is used or I can be disciplined. I also am not considered the owner of the design and most places have very specific clauses on how I can represent the work in a portfolio. The contestants may sign agreements like this, but they usually do not understand what it really means nor are they as easily able to separate themselves as only a single part of the project that can be changed and modified without their input later on. I can hear the troll loading the boulders for all of the worst case bad business scenarios. Trust me if a business does just give harsh commands and treats good folks like crap they do not last long. It is just that their is a shared sink or swim agreement that all parties need to adhere too to just get stuff through the pipeline without shooting each other and themselves in the process.

I have seen some wonderful outcomes from public submissions, but usually it is just a headache that gets scrapped as far as the final product and can lead to a potential PR problem.

[Spleenslitta]

@ Chuck Jager
Thank you for your constructive comment. It was impartial like it should be.
As a graphic designer you will know best the pitfalls and advantages of my idea.
Whenever i look into the fan art part of the MWO forums i see a lot of talent.

Those guys really enjoy making art, but imagine how delighted an artist would be if one of his designs became an official mech.
The satisfied grin as he pilots a mech he had a hand in creating would probably not stop at his ears.
CCP managed to make their ship design contest a success with a lot of really good designs so why not give it a go?

Edited by Spleenslitta, 04 September 2016 - 12:53 PM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

El Bandito, on 04 September 2016 - 03:58 AM, said:

Concept contest for chassis that are already in BT universe is fine with me. Creating new variants for them is also fine. Creating a never before seen chassis--that's where I draw the line.

Or Mechassault chassis -.-