19 replies to this topic

[Walk]

Since knock down has been removed, I've been having a lot more fun(light mech player here). However, it also becomes apparent that it is sorely needed, right now it's just to easy to break fire by running through a larger mechs legs.

However, one big improvement I would love to see is the removal of allies being able to knock each other down. About 9/10 of my knockdowns were from allies who are terrible pilots(or griefers, although I doubt that is actually the case). It's fine if I get knocked down because I was piloting poor and ran to close to an enemy Atlas, or if he pilots well and knocks me down, but when I'm circling behind one of those assault mechs the last thing I want is for some ****** ally to come in from the side and run me over, resulting in both our deaths(which has happened numerous times to me). What are other peoples thoughts on this?

[Renthrak]

Honestly, while it's infuriating to fall down when hitting a friendly 'Mech, it is conceptually the same as friendly fire. Either you need to be concerned about harming your team mates, or you don't. The difference between shooting an ally and running them over doesn't seem to me like it would warrant a different treatment.

I hate being run over, but I also hate being shot. But it would feel wrong if the allegiance of the other 'Mech changed how this works.

[Tekerton]

Bring it back, definitely. KD 4tW

[Soulscour]

I hate it when my friends knock me down. Still I'm glad its part of the game. If it really bothers you, you can call them noobs and tell them to stay away from you.

[Psikez]

Soulscour, on 01 November 2012 - 08:18 PM, said:

I hate it when my friends knock me down. Still I'm glad its part of the game. If it really bothers you, you can call them noobs and tell them to stay away from you.

I must impress my antisocial tendencies onto my pugmates. *hiss* AWAY WITH YOU NUBLET!

[Dagger906]

We don't need knockdown. If you want to swat scouts in heavy, fit ssrms.

[Walk]

Soulscour, on 01 November 2012 - 08:18 PM, said:

I hate it when my friends knock me down. Still I'm glad its part of the game. If it really bothers you, you can call them noobs and tell them to stay away from you.

Yea that is the worst solution out there. One of the reasons I would like to see it removed, it breeds contempt for other team members, more so than anything else, I think.

[Splitpin]

When it was removed it was clearly stated that was only until it was fixed. How about an option in the poll for 'Happy to wait until fixed'
Yes I'd like to be able to kick Jenners in the head again too, but I'm happy to wait until they don't warp twice before you can shoot em and possibly not suffer the 1st -> 3rd -> 1st person switch when I get knocked over.

[Blackfire1]

Splitpin, on 01 November 2012 - 08:29 PM, said:

When it was removed it was clearly stated that was only until it was fixed. How about an option in the poll for 'Happy to wait until fixed'
Yes I'd like to be able to kick Jenners in the head again too, but I'm happy to wait until they don't warp twice before you can shoot em and possibly not suffer the 1st -> 3rd -> 1st person switch when I get knocked over.

This. /thread

[Dezereus]

I've abstained from the vote, but I do have an opinion. Knockdown has always been nice, its been an incredible factor in light mech piloting skills and pilot awareness. In the same breath, in beta it got to the point where it was badly abused and exploited by players. Since there was not nearly enough reason not to collide, players would intentionally try to tackle mechs that were faster and more agile so that their larger compatriots could annihilate the target while they were down. For me, I'd like for KD to come back, but they would need to change the system so it was harder to exploit.

Dez


Edit spelling

Edited by Dezereus, 01 November 2012 - 09:54 PM.

[Joker Two]

Right now you can kind of walk through other 'Mechs, which causes weird graphics and can cause havoc on damage allocation while you're "inside" the other 'Mech. I have occasionally dodged "through" enemy machines, causing shots aimed at me to hit them, and also had friendlies move through me, intercepting my shots as they leave the barrels. Collision mechanics should be changed in some way.

Collisions at high speed could deal some damage (like they did pre-patch) but they shouldn't be effective weapons. Likewise, knock-downs should be more difficult to achieve, as I have seen (and used) fast lights and mediums to repeatedly tackle enemy 'Mechs to prevent them from firing/hold them in place.

Perhaps the stand-up time wouldn't be a fixed duration, but require some player input to determine the length, similar to the unjam sequence for the UAC/5. Some combination of movement commands while rotating the 'Mech's torso/arms, I don't know exactly how that would be implemented. This would be really cool if you stayed first-person when knocked over, maybe even able to shoot with arm weapons, but this would delay you're getting up, and have very limited arc.

[Walk]

Splitpin, on 01 November 2012 - 08:29 PM, said:

When it was removed it was clearly stated that was only until it was fixed. How about an option in the poll for 'Happy to wait until fixed'
Yes I'd like to be able to kick Jenners in the head again too, but I'm happy to wait until they don't warp twice before you can shoot em and possibly not suffer the 1st -> 3rd -> 1st person switch when I get knocked over.

My poll assumes it is being re-instated. Perhaps my actual post was not clear enough however, and I apologize.

Dezereus, on 01 November 2012 - 08:53 PM, said:

I've abstained from the vote, but I do have an opinion. Knockdown has always been nice, its been an incredible factor in light mech piloting skills and pilot awareness. In the same breath, in beta it got to the point where it was badly abused and exploited by players. Since there was not nearly enough reason not to collide, players would intentionally try to tackle mechs that were faster and more agile so that their larger compatriots could annihilate the target while they were down. For me, I'd like to KD come back, but they would need to change the system so it was harder to exploit.

Dez

I actually completely agree with you. Once again, I am for re-instating it, but I was not happy with the way it was. My primary concern was with allies however; I pretty much assume all the glitchy stuff that happens will be fixed(as it is really a netcode problem, not a knockdown mechanic issue).

Joker Two, on 01 November 2012 - 09:44 PM, said:

Right now you can kind of walk through other 'Mechs, which causes weird graphics and can cause havoc on damage allocation while you're "inside" the other 'Mech. I have occasionally dodged "through" enemy machines, causing shots aimed at me to hit them, and also had friendlies move through me, intercepting my shots as they leave the barrels. Collision mechanics should be changed in some way.

Collisions at high speed could deal some damage (like they did pre-patch) but they shouldn't be effective weapons. Likewise, knock-downs should be more difficult to achieve, as I have seen (and used) fast lights and mediums to repeatedly tackle enemy 'Mechs to prevent them from firing/hold them in place.

Perhaps the stand-up time wouldn't be a fixed duration, but require some player input to determine the length, similar to the unjam sequence for the UAC/5. Some combination of movement commands while rotating the 'Mech's torso/arms, I don't know exactly how that would be implemented. This would be really cool if you stayed first-person when knocked over, maybe even able to shoot with arm weapons, but this would delay you're getting up, and have very limited arc.

The current issues are more with netcode, I think, and the collision detection still needs a lot of work (Being able to walk/shoot through some of the buildings is rather bad). For all intensive purposes, however, I want to keep this thread away from collision detection/netcode issues and focus solely on the actual knockdown mechanic and its relation to enemies/allies.

[Steel Talon]

Definitely waiting for return of knockdowns.

Also it opens way to new modules related to it:
Gyrostabilizer - reduce chance of being knocked down
Tripwire - harpoon-like weapon creates cable between 2 points that lighter mech can stumble on
...

Edited by Steel Talon, 10 November 2012 - 11:49 AM.

[vettie]

I would love for knock down to be brought back.

IF not then at least stop me from running through any mech. Its too easy.

Driving a mech, getting banged up pretty bad as now 3 have joined in, I simply run right at one, throught and away while his teamies shoot him for a bit.

Silliness

[NonCedo]

The game does need knockdowns added back in. Why have damage from falling/landing with jump jets if collision is not included. Bring back the knock down, it will put more skill in piloting for us all.

[Tarrasque]

I am 100% behind knockdowns back in. Bigger blunder than ECM IMO.

[Adrian Steel]

Dagger906, on 01 November 2012 - 08:26 PM, said:

We don't need knockdown. If you want to swat scouts (packing ECM) in heavy, fit ssrms.

Fixed.

Nice troll.

[Vermaxx]

Knockdown needs to come back, and it needs to be universal.

Unless you can find a way for me to stop causing damage to coworkers' cars when I bump into them.

[Vahnn]

Both, don't try to screw this up.

[Walk]

NonCedo, on 05 March 2013 - 06:54 PM, said:

The game does need knockdowns added back in. Why have damage from falling/landing with jump jets if collision is not included. Bring back the knock down, it will put more skill in piloting for us all.

did you really feel the need necro this thread?

Edited by Walk, 05 March 2013 - 07:03 PM.