78 replies to this topic

[Dexadrinne]

Look in ALL seriousness. LRM's the way thay are now, is JUST killing the game. I'm stopping playing because NOT one game goes by where it is JUST a long range standoff. They REALLY need to do something about it.
Like 1-2 mechs ALLOWED on each side with LRM's or SOMETHING!!!
Or you need to BE profecient in using them, Like a skill or something.
Any Dweeb can max his mech out with missiles sit back wait for a lock and shoot.

So to the title of this post YES! it is indeed LRMONLINE....Sad

[Umbra8]

Some things to note:

- LRM's do two damage to keep in line with armour being roughly doubled vs its listed value. May need to be scaled back, but putting them to one damage would not be true to TT, as armour values are also scaled up from TT.

- Part of the problem is that Artemis is only supposed to work if the firing mech has line of sight to the target. Doesn't seem that way now, probably a bug or an oversight. Get that fixed and re-evaluate.

- The 90 degree angle drop on missile tracking is a big part of the problem as it eliminates the effectiveness of cover. May also be an oversight, or if not, should be reverted.

[ebea51]

WOW!!
LOTS of crying babies in here...
Guess its too much to ask to get organised and think a little so your not rained down on.
Because teamwork and communication is ALWAYS waaaaayyyyyy to much to ask for in a team-based online game.

Some basics:
1) DONT get caught out in the open.
2) Target mechs TAGging and NARCing to PREVENT missile locks
3) EQUIP AMS... YES, with ammo.
4) Stay near OTHER mechs with AMS and enjoy shooting LRMS down together!!!
5) Use terrain to shield yourself.
6) Use HEAVIER ARMOURED MECHS to shield yourself. Yes, they are there for that (tanking) too.
7) DONT get caught out in the open.
8) Realise that LRM boats require AMMO. AMMO which can run out. So juke and wait till their out of ammo instead of standing there WAITING for them to run out of ammo on YOU.
9) RUSH LRM boats, LRMs are USELESS within 150m, finally a generic tip FTW,
10) THINK - USE YOUR BRAIN.

There you go - no reason to cry now.

[Mathmatics]

qq

[CompproB237]

This is really an example of how the C3 System that the Draconis Combine makes in 3050 was supposed to help with targetting information. A spotter (usually a fast/light mech) would run and spot an enemy, gain targetting information and then another C3-Equipped 'Mech would begin raining death. Where the storyline stands the only information that should be parlayed to others should be over the radio (C3, Command, Control, Conquer... not the C3 Unit System) and all missles are supposed to use Line of Sight for targetting information. TAG and NARC was to help assist with lock on time as well as accuracy by giving the friendly 'Mech's targetting computer a better idea of where the missles were supposed to go.


I've already gone over this in the Suggestions section. To keep it simple every 'Mech in the game currently has a weightless, critless C3i (Made in 3062... 13 years "in the future") System installed. In my opinion, this is what is making missles so "Overpowered".

[MuffinTop]

LRMs are only OP when you have two or more LRM boats with OP scouts. Then you should run and hide, and don't stand still for more than a few seconds. One last thing......A moving target is a hard target.

[Max Dragon]

I voted yes and no because you cant set up a poll properly

[MuffinTop]

Then again I'm seeing these threads about Artemis and I'll consider these recent complaints about LRMS being OP as of now. The thing is I want to see it for myself.

[WeekendWarrior]

Umbra8, on 06 November 2012 - 11:34 PM, said:

- LRM's do two damage to keep in line with armour being roughly doubled vs its listed value. May need to be scaled back, but putting them to one damage would not be true to TT, as armour values are also scaled up from TT.

Uhm, you did notice that LRMs are the only weapons with doubled damage, did you?
While its true that armor was doubled, nearly all weapons have the correct TT damage values. The notable exceptions are the Large Lasers, with all three doing 1 point more, and the SRMs, which received a 25% damage boost.
And then there's the LRMs, with a 100% more damage than they should have.

This also directly factors into the "glass internals" Mech thing. Armor doubled, damage doubled, once the armor is gone the LRMs shred the structure at twice the rate they should.

And the real reason all this is such a big problem right now is that LRMs aren't actually implemented correctly, while all other weapons are. In the TT, LRMs are still mostly a direct fire weapon. Range 21 hexes, 630 meters, 1 hex and thus 30 meters less than the Gauss, 2 hex and 60 meters less than the ER-PPC. And while you can fire them indirectly, thats accompanied by some pretty hefty targeting modifiers, meaning hitting gets more difficult.
While in MWO, the way spotting works the LRMs are primarily indirect artillery, especially with that missile arc and range.
Oh, and Artemis shouldn't work with indirect fire (thats what TAG and NARC is for, though you need special LRM ammo to benefit), and ECM blocks it in a pretty large radius.

[Bastiat]

LRMs need a hotpatch nerf asap. Not allowing 8-man premades vs PUGs helped with the "LRM Premade" problem, but the missiles are still entirely too powerful for the way the game plays right now, especially with the new Artemis causing so many focused hits on head/torso. Even fast mechs running through/around terrain obstacles get annihilated by people that do nothing but get a lock and click their left mouse button.

The current state of LRMs is really quite ruinous for competitive PvP, though I'm confident that there are some nerfs coming (hopefully very soon). It's still a beta game so we shouldn't get overly bent out of shape, but things were far more enjoyable when you had mech-brawls with some indirect artillery and long range ballistics/energy weapons here and there; now it's nothing but scouts and LRMs half the time (and with full premades, it was/will be a lot more than half the time, until LRM nerfs).

[Red Klown X]

i will say lrm are killing the gameplay . But not because they are overpowered but because they are giving bad habit to " pug " , " new comer " .
They will think LRM is overpowered and dont learn how to avoid them and play without .

Against a good team lrm are so useless .

Since premade are not anymore 8 , maybe they will drop with 3 lrm boat and one scout ?
That s will be more hard and unplayable for "pug" and newcomer " .

Hope you understand my point .

[MorbidGamer]

If LRM's were not bad enough... Now we got Auto aim sniper version of them and blow your head off your atlas in 3 clouds.

If AMS wasn't worthless before it sure is now. ECM ain't going to do anything to protect you from head poping. It's just gonna delay your death by a second or 2.

If your not moving 70+ KPH then your heads gonna pop off. The slower you are the faster it happens.

[somerandom18]

51 people should join PGI in their retardfest embarrassment of a devteam

Edited by somerandom18, 07 November 2012 - 01:58 AM.

[Velico Orion]

Every game today has been someone spots you, LRM's blot out the sun and all land directly on top of your head killing you in a couple seconds.

Lame.

[Mordin Ashe]

We want ECM! Also, I think AMS should be slightly more effective than it is now, and it should be mounted on all trial mechs with weight some 50+ tons.

That being said, I agree with MuffinTop. LRMs are OP when you have a spotter, many LRM boats and the enemy doesn't feel like storming you (which they should). In such conditions LRMs are OP. But if your team lets the enemy dictate how will the battle look like, you are done for anyway.

[Minos Murdoc]

My thoughts.

LRM's aren't killing gameplay. I've gone into a lot of matches with 4-6 boats other side (not just trail boats) yes they take a few mechs down but if you work together you can out play them. I spend 33% of the time in my founders cat with 2x LRM15 & the rest in either a scout or brawler. so i know what its like and what tactics can be employed against them

Post Patch.
Yes for a few days people are going to be trying out the artimus system so we will see an increase of LRM boats for a few days. Its new content so we are going to try it (and its our job as BETA TESTERS), but to be honest the extra cost an weight restricts the amount of ammo the boats will be able to take (1ton & 1 slot per launcher for the artimus + additional ton per launcher and ammo) meaning you will have to lose armour, heatsinks, secondary weapons making the boats even easier pickings for lights, AC and guass.

So yes its going to be a bit harder for a little while but they are working on ECM which if people read should be in next patch 24-27th Nov. Once both items are out and tested they can then work on the balance. Until then we go on testing.

Personally i think the most OP think out there at the moment is the Jenner and cicada. the little buggers are just too fast and with the lack of collision and knockdown a couple of these can take down an atlas in 30secs. I know I've done it. got in one match and we have 5 lights, 1 boat, 1 hunch and 1 atlas against 3x atlas 2x cat boats, 2x hunch & 1 light. match lasted 4 minutes with only our boat dead.

[Kaijin]

wDraco, on 06 November 2012 - 08:43 PM, said:

can you tell me whats the diference ECM aint working LRMs are, i saw an Atlas getting every LRM rocket on his head and shoulders, not even one touched the ground.

The difference is those LRMs falling straight down on that Atlas head and shoulders in a tight group were Artemis LRMs paired with an Artemis Fire Control System. Non Artemis LRMs without this system have much more of an arc to their flight path, and some of them hit the ground instead of their target.

[Red Klown X]

Do you want really make pug Unhappy again and see more complain ?

Roll premade :
2 streak cat 6xstreak
2 atlas lrm 2x20

Finally we dont need more than two mech to play this game ...

[Onyx Rain]

ebea51, on 06 November 2012 - 11:36 PM, said:

WOW!!
LOTS of crying babies in here...
Guess its too much to ask to get organised and think a little so your not rained down on.
Because teamwork and communication is ALWAYS waaaaayyyyyy to much to ask for in a team-based online game.

Some basics:
1) DONT get caught out in the open.
2) Target mechs TAGging and NARCing to PREVENT missile locks
3) EQUIP AMS... YES, with ammo.
4) Stay near OTHER mechs with AMS and enjoy shooting LRMS down together!!!
5) Use terrain to shield yourself.
6) Use HEAVIER ARMOURED MECHS to shield yourself. Yes, they are there for that (tanking) too.
7) DONT get caught out in the open.
8) Realise that LRM boats require AMMO. AMMO which can run out. So juke and wait till their out of ammo instead of standing there WAITING for them to run out of ammo on YOU.
9) RUSH LRM boats, LRMs are USELESS within 150m, finally a generic tip FTW,
10) THINK - USE YOUR BRAIN.

There you go - no reason to cry now.

Just before the patch I would have agreed with you.

After the patch I 100% disagree that is enough to survive and win the majority of the time, or make this game fun to play for the majority of people.

Fact is, even if you are right, the majority disagree...the game only survives if the majority playing it enjoy it and will spend money on it. Poll says 76%+ think LRMs are killing the game now....that is not good for the commercial viability of the game regardless of your opinion...or mine.

The way to win now if the other team has more then 1 or 2 LRM boats, is have more and/or better LRM boats...Period.

Edited by Onyx Rain, 07 November 2012 - 01:50 AM.

[anonymous175]

What happens when they get too close though? The LRMs don't seem to do damage then.