22 replies to this topic

[Othello]

The bug report was tagged as Not a Bug, so I am posting it here in Suggestions.

~~~

I believe that our HUD should be able to target and lock on to overheated mechs. These are mechs that were forced to shutdown due to high heat and will automattically restart on their own. Mechs that are intentionally turned off will not be targetable without BAP installed.

We should also look at the data to see if there has been an uptick in friendly fire deaths after the Jan 23rd patch. Designers need to consider if the Jan 23rd patch has unintentionally changed HUD behavior.

Edited by Othello, 28 January 2013 - 11:24 AM.

[Mordynak]

Personally yes, i think you should be able to lock on and even get info on shutdown mechs. Not because of frienfly fire or anything like that but you shouldnt just lose all info on a shutdown mech because they have overheated. If anything you should be able to target them easier due to the increased heat. Else whats the downside to being shut down? (Apart from being stood still)

[Theobald Hauser]

I'd like a rational explanation for that...

[Nexus Omega]

I agree, but for friendly fire reasons,

I shot a overheated friendly HBK today, in the back with my AC20.
thankfully he survived, (and we won the game) but dam I felt bad.

why could my computer not tell me he was on my side?

[Theobald Hauser]

Because he was offline, that's the point.


You can get an equipment that allows you to still target it by the way, the Beagle Active Probe.

Edited by Amarius, 28 January 2013 - 01:15 AM.

[Othello]

Amarius, on 27 January 2013 - 03:05 PM, said:

I'd like a rational explanation for that...

Amarius, on 27 January 2013 - 11:55 PM, said:

Because he was offline, that's the point.


You can get an equipment that allows you to still target it by the way, the Beagle Active Probe.

Here is your rational explanation... Mech has overheated and a safety system has locked down the Mech to prevent an explosion. Basic power is maintained to the Mech computer so that the Mech can automatically restart. The IFF transponder of negligible weight and size is powered by this Mech computer and will show up as friend or foe provided line of sight is available.

~~~

This suggestion is entirely for gameplay reasons.

• Is the changes with PATCH 1.2.179 intentional?
  
• Is the current lock-on mechanism with PATCH 1.2.179 good for gameplay?
  
• What behavior does the game designer want to see and are there any technical limitations for implementing the designer's point of view?

[focuspark]

No explanation needed. The damn thing is so hot it stopped working... the damn thing has a nuclear reactor in it, it's designed for heat - how hot must it be? Damn hot that's what I can tell you, therefore targeting it should be very, very easy as it's likely the hottest thing in the vicinity.

[Theobald Hauser]

So you WANT an IFF transponder to shout aloud to every enemy in the vicinity that you're out of combat and that they should take you down ?
That's not "rational".

Why should heat shutdown be different from manual shutdown ?

And from a gameplay perspective, you can shoot at shutdown mechs with any weapon except streaks, so, where's the problem ?

[MasterGoa]

I agree with Othello.

Push button shutdown and all systems off.

Overheat as reactor off, but systems on, waiting for cool down period.

Seems very reasonable...

Amarius, on 28 January 2013 - 11:01 AM, said:

So you WANT an IFF transponder to shout aloud to every enemy in the vicinity that you're out of combat and that they should take you down ?
That's not "rational".

Why should heat shutdown be different from manual shutdown ?

And from a gameplay perspective, you can shoot at shutdown mechs with any weapon except streaks, so, where's the problem ?

It is not the IFF that is down, it is the enemy mech's radar that is acquiring...

[Othello]

Amarius, on 28 January 2013 - 11:01 AM, said:

So you WANT an IFF transponder to shout aloud to every enemy in the vicinity that you're out of combat and that they should take you down ?
That's not "rational".

Why should heat shutdown be different from manual shutdown ?

And from a gameplay perspective, you can shoot at shutdown mechs with any weapon except streaks, so, where's the problem ?

Amarius, I made one up a rational explanation just for you. Science fiction arguments are pointless since there are endless counter-arguments. I am not here to convince you. I want the designers to review this proposal and gather some community feedback for their review. I already know where you stand on this matter.

[StalaggtIKE]

No. It is a part of heat management. If you're not careful, you may get overheat and get blasted by friendly fire. As for targeting overheated enemies, that's the purpose of BAP.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 28 January 2013 - 11:28 AM.

[Othello]

StalaggtIKE, on 28 January 2013 - 11:28 AM, said:

No. It is a part of heat management. If you're not careful, you may get overheat and get blasted by friendly fire. As for targeting overheated enemies, that's the purpose of BAP.

I do not believe that this issue is meant to be solved by a 1.5 ton and 2 crit piece of equipment. The low-tech method is a color scheme or unit decal (and we don't get free paint colors in pug matches).

[Theobald Hauser]

StalaggtIKE, on 28 January 2013 - 11:28 AM, said:

No. It is a part of heat management. If you're not careful, you may get overheat and get blasted by friendly fire. As for targeting overheated enemies, that's the purpose of BAP.

That.

Othello, there's no "SciFi" arguments there, but you don't have gameplay arguments neither. So it's a no-no.
Don't ask opinions if you don't want them. Accepting only friendly ones won't make you go anywhere either.

And look at your poll, half the people agreeing with you IS you at the moment.

Edited by Amarius, 28 January 2013 - 11:40 AM.

[Othello]

Amarius, on 28 January 2013 - 11:37 AM, said:

That.

Othello, there's no "SciFi" arguments there, but you don't have gameplay arguments neither. So it's a no-no.
Don't ask opinions if you don't want them. Accepting only friendly ones won't make you go anywhere either.

And look at your poll, half the people agreeing with you IS you at the moment.

Look the poll was just added earlier today. Give it time for more thoughts. Ultimately, the designer will do what the designer thinks is best for MWO.

The issue that I have in the game play my game play is deciding if I should kill an overheated mech that I do not recognize. It could be friendly, it could be an enemy. I could check the scoreboard to if it is likely to be friend or foe. I could also ask in chat. Usually I keep the mech in sight to catch it powering up but that is a wasted opportunity.

[Theobald Hauser]

That's the point as Stalag(...) said.

And don't believe that there is somewhere a whole army of people agreeing with you waiting the right moment to support you.

[StalaggtIKE]

I would agree with you, Othello, if BAP didn't already do this. I mean, that's really all it does atm. Why remove its sole purpose for existing.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 28 January 2013 - 12:07 PM.

[Ronstar]

Othello, on 27 January 2013 - 02:51 PM, said:

The bug report was tagged as Not a Bug, so I am posting it here in Suggestions.

~~~

I believe that our HUD should be able to target and lock on to overheated mechs. These are mechs that were forced to shutdown due to high heat and will automattically restart on their own. Mechs that are intentionally turned off will not be targetable without BAP installed.

We should also look at the data to see if there has been an uptick in friendly fire deaths after the Jan 23rd patch. Designers need to consider if the Jan 23rd patch has unintentionally changed HUD behavior.

You already have this option, its called Beagal Active Probe. Put one on your mech, now you can target shutdown mechs.

StalaggtIKE, on 28 January 2013 - 12:00 PM, said:

I would agree with you, Othello, if BAP didn't already do this. I mean, that's really all it does atm. Why remove its sole purpose for existing.

It also allows for a faster lock on time.

[Theobald Hauser]

No, BAP give 25% longer sensor range (but 0 % against ECM), 25% quicker info gathering, and shutdown targeting.

[Othello]

Amarius, on 28 January 2013 - 11:50 AM, said:

That's the point as Stalag(...) said.

And don't believe that there is somewhere a whole army of people agreeing with you waiting the right moment to support you.

Like I said, I know where you stand on this. This thread and and its poll is for the designers to review. Give it time for others to chime in on whether or not they believe this is a problem or not.

Yes, BAP can detect powered-down mech, but the problem mentioned in this bug can be done with low technology if teams had standard decal or some identification marker painted on them. I surely hope this is not considered a BAP buff because there are many other great ideas out there to boost benefits of BAP.

[Mechteric]

A mech with high heat should still be able to be picked up at close range without the need for BAP because its so hot your sensors should have no problem picking it out. BAP is still there to help against cold mechs that are trying to ambush.