55 replies to this topic

[Thirdstar]

dario03, on 25 February 2013 - 04:03 AM, said:

And glorious

[Moonsavage]

Glythe, on 25 February 2013 - 03:08 AM, said:

I'd like the Elo system if it kept the noobs in a completely separate game from everyone else. Sadly this is not the case so the game fares poorly.

When you can bring 600-800 damage per game (with no LRMs) you should never have a guy on your team with less than 50 damage (much less 2 or 3 such players). If you build your light mech correctly you can easily bring 400 or more damage per game.


Nope. It just tries to rank your team similarly to the enemy. If you drop with a team of 4 you usually get something like this: 2 aces 1-3 average pilots and everything else is scrub. Scrubs should be playing against other 1300 ranked new players and nothing else (unless a friend drags them "out of tier")

*Post edit* : When I hit save changes it looked fine but forum is doing something very strange at the moment.

I don't like you...

[Wispsy]

KinLuu, on 25 February 2013 - 02:18 AM, said:

I like how the masterrace is golden.

It has been noted on more then one occasion that vassago would very much like to be a gold.

[Fooooo]

RocketDog, on 25 February 2013 - 03:58 AM, said:

Maybe I don't understand Elo properly, but I thought it was specifically designed to avoid doing what you say it does. I thought it was designed to match players of similar Elo scores?

Re. damage: I can top the scoreboard with 4 kills and 600+ damage in one match and on the next walk round a corner into two Splatcats and be out of the game 2 seconds later with almost no damage scored. There's quite a bit of luck in how the games play out.



Once Elo is working well, then those who regularly field multiple 3Ls will soon find themselves in matches consisting only of 3Ls, Splatcats and 6PPC Stalkers. Which will be exactly what they deserve.

In a 1v1 situation, yes , it does that.

In a team situation its a little different, but its the same thing.........

if the top 2 players for each team are say 2500.

2nd players each 2000
3rd 1800
4th 1750
etc etc etc.

Even if it matched by 1v1 to make the teams, its going to end up pretty much the same.

The only way to lower the amount of lower ranked players in your matches..........is for a lot more people to start playing....

I don't know the exact number, but im sure there is some math equation that could work out the exact number of players needed to be online at the same time, to guarantee that happening. (even spreads on both sides..... so both teams full of 2000 - 2500 elo players etc)

Once there are enough players in each spread, then you will find that the matches will end up being exactly like you say..... fairly even elos on your own team and the opposing team.......

However atm the way it balances should still be quite fair.....if your in a match like you say, and are top dog, make sure you take out their top dog when you can, and you should win almost every match.....pretty much just like WoT.

If your in a maus, you better be able to knock their maus or russian / french equivielent out, or we have a much lower chance of winning.

Edited by Fooooo, 25 February 2013 - 04:29 AM.

[Koshirou]

RocketDog, on 25 February 2013 - 03:58 AM, said:

Once Elo is working well, then those who regularly field multiple 3Ls will soon find themselves in matches consisting only of 3Ls, Splatcats and 6PPC Stalkers.

Or they will make new accounts, grind themselves a new 3L and start making actual noobies quit the game in frustration once more.

Balancing multiplayer games is hard. Especially if they are relatively popular and attract, as all popular multiplayer games do, a fair share of people whose only purpose in the game is investing nearly all of their ample spare time in order to derive some hollow satisfaction from defeating others at all costs. ELO is but a baby step towards any balancing at all.

[F lan Ker]

S!

This thread delivers, really.

[Sierra Antares]

Glythe, on 25 February 2013 - 03:34 AM, said:

I just assumed that it would post what I had posted and not hiccup as it's never done that before.




I think you misunderstand. It's really not fair for experts to play with beginners. You might as well begin your boxing career on day 1 as Mike Tyson's sparring parther.

You probably aren't invited to pro golf tournaments. Why is that? You don't have a high enough ranking to be invited. You probably have no ranking because you haven't won any local tournaments or any higher tournaments that would qualify you for higher ranked play. Assuming you know how Elo works you'll realize people who drop with 4 players regulary are probably ranked upwards of 2500 about now. There is no reason a 1300 ranked player should ever see a 2500 ranked player. Let's throw aside the point that lots of people have inflated Elo at the moment.

It's more like: warning realism!

Thing is, you can't learn a whole lot from people who know the same things you do.. You need to play with better players to get better. At least for me it has always been like that.

[Novakaine]

Yeah we all know what happened in WW2
So much for the master race.
If only they had ELO.

[MadSavage]

My KDR is hungry. More pugs!

[Mercules]

Glythe, on 25 February 2013 - 03:08 AM, said:

If you build your light mech correctly you can easily bring 400 or more damage per game.

Yes, you can, but some of the best games I've had where I have contributed solidly to the game and team I've had around 100 damage.

Example, the other night on Alpine Peak, my friend was in his Founder's Cat and I in my Raven. I did hardly any damage but I identified and locked targets from outside my weapon range for my friend and a PUG Stalker that also had a goodly number of LRMs. Those two in tandem would kill my TAGged targets quickly often without actually having LoS to them. I could have closed in and delivered damage myself, but I strongly believe keeping my slower moving teammates undercover while I dodged all the PPC and AC fire and held targets for them better served the team.

[IIIuminaughty]

I use to be a pug stomper before the tourny came out....tourny came out, I went solo, Im still a pug stomper....WTF YOU SAYING BRO???

[MaddMaxx]

Quote

I like how the Master Race is golden.

Dude, they did not offer a Platinum Package, or the "Master Race" would have been Platinum, right? LOL

P.S. ELO, I believe attempts to Match the Teams over-all ELO rating. So, if you consider yourself a Mech god, then you will have to carry a few, sour tasting, cling-on based, peons along with you.

That should be not be a problem for a "True Mech God" though right...right?

Edited by MaddMaxx, 25 February 2013 - 08:05 AM.

[xDeityx]

RocketDog, on 25 February 2013 - 02:44 AM, said:

But doesn't Elo move all players inexorably towards 50:50 W:L no matter how good or bad they are?

Yes but this breaks down at the highest and lowest levels. Look at an extreme example: the best and worst players.

When these players queue, the matchmaker will try and find their peers. But since they have so few peers it will eventually say, 'screw it' after a certain amount of time has passed and put those people into imbalanced games. For the worst player in MWO this means that the MM couldn't find anyone as bad as he is and so he is put in a game with all better players. He will have worse than a 50:50 win:loss ratio in all likelihood. The best player will be put in a game where nobody is as good as he is, and he will likely have much higher than a 50:50 win:loss ratio.

Those are the extreme cases, but you can extrapolate the pattern. Only people smack in the middle of the bell curve who get better at the 'average' rate and thus never move will have 50:50 ratios.

Edit: PSA since this is a thread where Elo is discussed - Elo is not an acronym, it is a gentleman's last name.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arpad_Elo

Edited by xDeityx, 25 February 2013 - 08:18 AM.

[Hillslam]

I like when these guys cry about the ELO matchmaker putting "crappy" players on their team because they're obviously so awesome and then they lose.

...while it completely flies over their head that the EXACT SAME THING happened to the OTHER team...


narcisism - aint it a b**ch?

Edited by Hillslam, 25 February 2013 - 08:29 AM.

[Mike Forst]

I like to play the game sometimes

[Ter Ushaka]

Do you like it more than a freshly posted post?

[Mike Forst]

It depends

[Ryvucz]

.

[Mike Forst]

I think your post is missing

[Jalak Bali]

You're not stomping pugstompers. You got placed in the pool of all pugstompees. You're stomping your fellow pugstompees.