25 replies to this topic

[Eisenhorne]

I love my CN9-AL as a ranged fighter. The key IMO is to use an XL engine. If your not brawling anyway, its usually not a very big risk. If your being blown to hell, your probably going to die anyway.

CN9-AL

If you drop in an XL225, you can run a PPC, TAG, 2x ML, and an ALRM20

[ICEFANG13]

I heavily suggest you get the engine to a 250, and remove a couple heatsinks to make it worth it. The doubles in the engine are better than the external ones. So while it loses a little heat, it also moves 64->81, which I'd say is worth it. I also am a fan of removing the MPLs, and you need to be using the LRM-5s as well.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7902fc0fb42aa35

Also noticed, you don't have FF armor on it, with this you can put it on, and add a ton of ammo, or increase engine size.

Edited by ICEFANG13, 27 February 2013 - 06:56 PM.

[Aeolus Drift]

Frank the Tank, on 27 February 2013 - 06:26 PM, said:

My build is not an alpha build. You really can't alpha a PPC, LL, and 2 MLs with only 12 DHS, nor should you. The sweet spot is very important to staging engagements though. I am doing my best possible damage between 200 - 450m, and If I can keep the enemy at a distance of +300m then they can't hit my with SRMs (which are in favor with a lot of builds right now). However, don't think I'm alpha striking ever second I can in the sweet spot. It takes a lot of finesse, but you can remain heat stable by alternating between MLs and LL while constantly dropping LRMs on target. Once you start using lasers you need to only fire the PPC when you have a clear shot on an exposed internal.

I really like Wrenchfarm's suggestions. Definitely keep the ER LL that's what makes you build unique, but switch the MPLs for MLs. This puts your sweet spot around the same range as mine; all you have to do is keep the enemy out of SRM range and you'll be set. If you really want it, you could put an MPL in the arm so you can take advantage of its reach.

Also go 18/18 armor on your head, and 47/48 on the legs. You need all of that head armor just in case you take a nasty AC/20 or gauss hit. Also spread the ammo out to each leg; if you do lose the leg you don't want to lose all the ammo. Lastly, if you switch to MLs you might not need all those DHS. I intend to give this build a try, but we all have our own preferences when it comes to how hot our mechs should run.

I apologize if I misspoke about your build. I meant to say say that it seemed more burst-specialized, although it appears that yet again I have allowed things to get lost in translation do to a poor choice of grammar. in a sniper battle I have no shame in admitting your mech would more than likely kick my ***. heck your build does have some better weapon range overlap than mine. Though I would still say my heat management might be in arguably better favors for a prolonged engagements (12DHS to 16DHS). more or less I think my mech would stand a better chance of staying active at close range (say 250 m). still this is MWO, and nothing is permanent. Say if we run into each other in our centurions shall do we a mono-e-mono to see who is the master (and no I will not be using Wimp-Lo's "your fist to my nuts" style).

[Frank the Tank]

I'm not trying to be hostile. I'm just trying to point out that I'm not comparing apple to oranges. Our builds' roles are very similar; I just happen to use a PPC instead of an ER LL for my ranged weapon. Also this is not a competition, if you want to challenge me that's cool, but we're here to offer suggestions to each other and get better together.

That being said, I had a chance to play around with your build as well as some of the other suggestions and was surprised by two things. First, the ER LL was not as good as I had expected; second, the MPLs were not as bad as I had expected. I still think that the ER LL has potential, but it doesn't live up to expectations.

In regards to the ER LL, I found I was rarely taking advantage of its extended range. Only Alpine and Caustic have enough open space to really out range the LL. All of the other maps are full of terrain features which offer plenty of cover. Because of this, firing from cover to cover or generally high traffic areas ranges from 250m to 600m. A good example is the dropship crash on Frozen City the natural points to watch the wreck are between 250m to 600m on both sides. While the ER LL is doing full damage up to 675m the LL is still doing fair damage out to 600m for less heat. Since its hard to maintain LoS to a target beyond 600m on most of the maps I think I might be more prudent to use a LL. This is more of a map design issue than a real problem with the ER LL though.

Also I found another problem with the ER LL. At its natural range of +600m it is impossible to maintain the beam on a specific part of a mech for its entire 1 second duration. If the 9 damage of the beam gets spread out over 5 sections of the target then You really aren't doing that much effective damage. Again, this is a problem with the game mechanics not necessarily the ER LL.

As for the MPLs I was pleased by their performance. I still prefer to have that extra range of MLs, but the damage to heat of the MPLs was better than expected. The build that I settled on featured 1 MPL in the RA and 2 MLs in the CT. The extra reach with the arm mounted MPL was good for keeping track on lights.

This is the build I eventually settled on: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...fa4e5bd94e09a53
I kept the ER LL, because with 16 DHS heat is not an issue, but you could probably swap it for a LL and drop 2 DHS and still have decent heat. Like I said the MPL in the arm is great for keeping on target when fighting lights. Dropping 1 DHS and swaping the CT mounted MPLs for MLs saves enough weight to upgrade the engine to a STD 225 which hold 9 DHS so you remain even at 16 DHS. I played with this build for a while yesterday and did about the same as I do with my PPC AL build: 500-600 damage, 2 kills, multiple assists per game on average.

If you don't like these suggestions that's fine; personal style has a lot to do with game play, although I think I maintained the style of your original build. The changes that you should make irregardless are:

Swap LRM10 for 2 LRM5s
Max head armor (make legs 47/48)
Remove CASE and move LRM ammo to each leg.

[Aeolus Drift]

Frank the Tank, on 01 March 2013 - 08:28 PM, said:

I'm not trying to be hostile. I'm just trying to point out that I'm not comparing apple to oranges. Our builds' roles are very similar; I just happen to use a PPC instead of an ER LL for my ranged weapon. Also this is not a competition, if you want to challenge me that's cool, but we're here to offer suggestions to each other and get better together.

That being said, I had a chance to play around with your build as well as some of the other suggestions and was surprised by two things. First, the ER LL was not as good as I had expected; second, the MPLs were not as bad as I had expected. I still think that the ER LL has potential, but it doesn't live up to expectations.

In regards to the ER LL, I found I was rarely taking advantage of its extended range. Only Alpine and Caustic have enough open space to really out range the LL. All of the other maps are full of terrain features which offer plenty of cover. Because of this, firing from cover to cover or generally high traffic areas ranges from 250m to 600m. A good example is the dropship crash on Frozen City the natural points to watch the wreck are between 250m to 600m on both sides. While the ER LL is doing full damage up to 675m the LL is still doing fair damage out to 600m for less heat. Since its hard to maintain LoS to a target beyond 600m on most of the maps I think I might be more prudent to use a LL. This is more of a map design issue than a real problem with the ER LL though.

Also I found another problem with the ER LL. At its natural range of +600m it is impossible to maintain the beam on a specific part of a mech for its entire 1 second duration. If the 9 damage of the beam gets spread out over 5 sections of the target then You really aren't doing that much effective damage. Again, this is a problem with the game mechanics not necessarily the ER LL.

As for the MPLs I was pleased by their performance. I still prefer to have that extra range of MLs, but the damage to heat of the MPLs was better than expected. The build that I settled on featured 1 MPL in the RA and 2 MLs in the CT. The extra reach with the arm mounted MPL was good for keeping track on lights.

This is the build I eventually settled on: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...fa4e5bd94e09a53
I kept the ER LL, because with 16 DHS heat is not an issue, but you could probably swap it for a LL and drop 2 DHS and still have decent heat. Like I said the MPL in the arm is great for keeping on target when fighting lights. Dropping 1 DHS and swaping the CT mounted MPLs for MLs saves enough weight to upgrade the engine to a STD 225 which hold 9 DHS so you remain even at 16 DHS. I played with this build for a while yesterday and did about the same as I do with my PPC AL build: 500-600 damage, 2 kills, multiple assists per game on average.

If you don't like these suggestions that's fine; personal style has a lot to do with game play, although I think I maintained the style of your original build. The changes that you should make irregardless are:

Swap LRM10 for 2 LRM5s
Max head armor (make legs 47/48)
Remove CASE and move LRM ammo to each leg.

Thank you so much for giving my build an honest chance to prove itself. I was not expecting someone to be willing to try my first published build, but it is something I'm truly grateful for. I'm sorry to hear your experience with the ER laser was not as succesful as expected. I understand that it can be difficult to maintain the ER over a single hardpoint at max range. however I have tended to notice that utilizing thermal vision as well as a steady hand can help alleviate this difficulty. I'm glad to hear that you found some merit to the pulse lasers as well. Indeed I had considered your configuration for the medium lasers as well in the past, however I have a bad tendency to be somewhat broke on c-bills. Regardless overall I'm glad to hear you found my build to be competitive with your own personal build. So as a gesture of gratitude, I will try to give your build a shot when I have the time. cheers Mechwarrior.

P.S. I hope you don't mind me saying, but I would enjoy hearing your perspective if I ever publish another build again.

[Frank the Tank]

Interceptor12, on 02 March 2013 - 11:22 AM, said:

P.S. I hope you don't mind me saying, but I would enjoy hearing your perspective if I ever publish another build again.

Just here to help, man. What ****** me off most is when people respond to these threads with "You use and AL!? So do I. This is my build." or "Just looking at this I know its wrong." But neither offering any suggestions. These kinds of responses do nothing to encourage growth or the process. I don't want to be one of those people.

I am always trying new things, but I tend to be pretty broke too. I found whats best is always saving your engines so you can make big changes without spending a ton of C-bills. Good luck out there.