48 replies to this topic

[Jonathan Paine]

Treat jump jets info as if it is the height you can jump. Pretend that you are seeing roughly 3x the rated height. Hope that PGI changes the info in mechlab.

Thus: mechlab claims you can jump 5 meters. Read it as "jump 3x 5 meters high = 15 meters". Allow for physics, thus a mech running at 120 kph will jump a lot farther under the same gravity as a mech running at 60kph.

[TopDawg]

M4NTiC0R3X, on 27 February 2013 - 11:38 AM, said:

Well yeah it is a little odd, but that's what happens when they nerf the JJ's to what they're supposed to be... the community has a backlash and their data tells them to fix JJ's....

so in a hurry, what with their angry customers eyes watching.. they increase the speed at which you rise... suddenly JJs feel like you're actually jumping again... and somebody has to come say they're jumping to high.

Wow... just wow. Like every other stress filled day in the universe.

( I may have focused on the JJ part and less the scale of 'mechs )

Eh, JJs in their nerfed state were almost never used, primarily because they were largely useless; certainly as JJs for navigating terrain (although not necessarily as JJs for turning faster).

I admit (and still kind of think) that JJs are a little over the top currently (as the change also nerfed the JJ height of the 5V and to a lesser extent the 5D) as it makes poptarting not only largely desirable, but fairly easy. I think toning back horizontal speeds while increasing max height a little bit makes more sense; they could even vary the rate at which Mechs rise based on the chassis' weight.

[Flying Blind]

I certainly don't want jump jets to be nerfed or shortened or even increased necessarily I just want data that means something.
I was trying to use JJ as a measuring stick to figure out some scale in the game and it turns out that JJ are a really bad tool for this and a new issue pops up because of it.

I have just posted a question about this in the new ask the devs thread so maybe in two weeks we'll get some answers.

[grifflyman]

Jump jets are broken :C

[Mazzyplz]

if that's 5 meters i'm dennis rodman..

that would mean the hills next to the atlas in forest colony are only like 8 meters high, big enough to climb by hand as a foot soldier.

it would mean the cars in river city are 30cm tall or less.... and lamp posts 1 meter. (when in fact they're 4-5 mts)

obviously it's the jets that are wrong, they should put in the menu 15 meters instead of 5, my guess is 3x of what it says

[Flying Blind]

Thontor, on 27 February 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

This has nothing to do with mech height

And everything to do with the mechlab "jump meter" providing innacurate information.

yup, that is the direction this experiment of mine has gone.

funny how you start out trying to do one thing and end up doing another completely

[Terror Teddy]

Hmm, I should try the spider with 12 jump jets and use the rangefinder on guns to see if I can get 350 meters in one jump.

Or for that matter, the Jenner with it's 180 meters.

[Lee Ving]

So no one here has noted that the jump measurement only makes sense if the mech is stationary? Too many variables for it to be anything else, different top speeds, weights, etc.

Is it totally out of whack if 5 meters is the maximum height straight up? And therefore the maximum attainable apogee?

[Flying Blind]

Terror Teddy, on 27 February 2013 - 12:15 PM, said:

Hmm, I should try the spider with 12 jump jets and use the rangefinder on guns to see if I can get 350 meters in one jump.

Or for that matter, the Jenner with it's 180 meters.

that's a good idea please do. maybe I'll see if I can do it too.

[Flying Blind]

Lee Ving, on 27 February 2013 - 12:20 PM, said:

So no one here has noted that the jump measurement only makes sense if the mech is stationary? Too many variables for it to be anything else, different top speeds, weights, etc.

Is it totally out of whack if 5 meters is the maximum height straight up? And therefore the maximum attainable apogee?

this was my initial thought. I tested it in my second video (near the end) by jumping to the top of ledge that was taller than an Atlas with a 10 meter jump rating. standing still I easily jumped higher than the Atlas height and then at half speed again. the mechlab ratingis almost certainly off by a large amount.

video:

Edited by Flying Blind, 27 February 2013 - 12:26 PM.

[Lee Ving]

Excellent response, I asked simply because I haven't really played with JJ much since CB, but they haven't ever felt quite right to me.

I still think you should be able to switch direction mid-flight though, so I'll try to avoid making suggestions on how to "fix" them

[Flying Blind]

I don't mind how they work so much as I just want to have some sort of accurate data on them.

[Bishop Steiner]

you know.. I been wondering about this stuff... cuz the jump distance listed is stuff like 28 meters...... which means the mechs are really really small.. or the jump ranges are really really inaccurate.

[Terror Teddy]

Bishop Steiner, on 27 February 2013 - 12:30 PM, said:

you know.. I been wondering about this stuff... cuz the jump distance listed is stuff like 28 meters...... which means the mechs are really really small.. or the jump ranges are really really inaccurate.

Mr Steiner, can you confirm that your Atlas scout lances are in fact 5 meters tall disguised urbanmechs?

[Kristov Kerensky]

The numbers listed for the JJ distance in the mechlab are obviously...off...to put it mildly. Heights of the Mechs are also off as well, with the Commando being half the height of an Atlas despite it supposedly being 2/3rds of that height by the lore..so..

As for how well JJ works currently, seems pretty spot on for the most part, only the actual distance you can cover being a bit low. JJ in TT aren't vectored, there's no way to jump up and then jet off to the left then zig to the right and so on. You start at hex A and you pick your final landing hex, make sure it's within the range of your JJ distance and jump straight to it, being able to change your facing as you come in for a landing and all momentum is lost as you land, which I know perfectly well rather defies the laws of physics...but it IS a game, so you'll just have to accept yet another in the LONG list of non-reality conforming things that BattleTech uses to make game play more fun.

[Kodiak Jorgensson]

jump distances are off the Atlas is roughly 16-16.5 meters tall.

[Terror Teddy]

Thontor, on 27 February 2013 - 12:50 PM, said:

The jump meter in the mech lab is obviously supposed to be jump height. Since distance is relative to the forward speed when jumping.

Then it must be really off because I easily jump over hills that are far higher than an atlas. So add a 0 to the mechlab and it sounds BETTER for jump length but not correct. Jumping a parabolic arc should mean 50% of your forward jump would be the height if it is equal thrust from start to finish.

[Flying Blind]

Thontor, on 27 February 2013 - 12:50 PM, said:

The jump meter in the mech lab is obviously supposed to be jump height. Since distance is relative to the forward speed when jumping.

that's what I thought too but if that is true an Atlas is only 5 meters tall and that's just screwy. seems like the true height of the jump is at least 3X the listed mechlab stat.

[Flying Blind]

seems like the faster you go the lower you actually jump. I don't like this idea but that does seem to be how it works.

[TheGreatNoNo]

If this leads them to nerfing jump jets then I will cry. I have only JUST learned the joys of a jump jetting Jenner! (Even though I do admit it, when I pilot a Jenner I turn into a ***.)