148 replies to this topic

[Mackman]

KuruptU4Fun, on 05 March 2013 - 08:12 AM, said:

If we go by the last contest (by definition is was not a tourney because it was a single player ranking) then there is no clear advantage when used by single players. Team tourneys aren't going to be an advantage either because (according to you) the only people who use them will be teams. PUG's will not participate in those tourneys, therefore your argument is moot.

So you're admitting that in team tournaments, you will have to use them to be competitive? How does that make my point moot? Also, a single player does still have an advantage, or did you not read Answer C?

[KuruptU4Fun]

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C. It's not P2W because you can achieve the same affect with the C-Bill version!
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Answer: If this were the only module in the game, you'd have a point. But it's not the only module in the game.

If you're a non-paying player, and your mech has 3 module slots, you can choose to get Tier 1 and Tier 2 cooling (for 35% flushing) and one other module, whether it's another Tier 2 Consumable or another kind of module.

If you're a paying player, and your mech has 3 module slots, you can get a Tier 3 Coolant (for 35% flushing), another tier 3 consumable (which right there puts you over the non-paying player), and you still have another slot for whatever else you want in there.

You may still be thinking, "well, alright, that's kind of an advantage, but it's still pretty small." Now multiply that advantage by 8 (or 12, when we get 12v12), and you'll see that a paying lance will have a noticeable, objectively measurable advantage over a non-paying lance in any kind of competitive setting.

You can get the same effect for one consumable... at the cost of a large amount of flexibility and power when it comes to the other consumables.

If everyone is using it, how is there an advantage? Just like if you go into an 8vs.8 man match armed with 5 ECM D-DC's and 3 3L's and get matched against the same, no one has an advantage....

Since only one Consumable module has been given as an example then both your speculation on how hey are implemented and mine are just guesses, when facts are given then you can present an opinion.

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So you're admitting that in team tournaments, you will have to use them to be competitive? How does that make my point moot? Also, a single player does still have an advantage, or did you not read Answer C?

No what I'm admitting is that if everyone in team tournaments are using MC coolant flushes, then there is no clear advantage as everyone is using the same baseline.

Edited by KuruptU4Fun, 05 March 2013 - 08:34 AM.

[Bilbo]

Where's the "They haven't implemented pay to win consumables" option.

[Mackman]

KuruptU4Fun, on 05 March 2013 - 08:27 AM, said:

If everyone is using it, how is there an advantage? Just like if you go into an 8vs.8 man match armed with 5 ECM D-DC's and 3 3L's and get matched against the same, no one has an advantage....

HAHAHAH. Are you serious, dude? So you're seriously admitting that if someone doesn't use it, then they're at a disadvantage? Are you seriously trying to justify it by saying "It's not P2W, because everyone is just going to buy it anyway so it won't even matter"? Is that really your argument here?

Look at my example again: A Paying lance vs. a Nonpaying lance will have a huge advantage in both module power and module flexibility: All of the paying lance will be able to field Tier 3 Coolant and Airstrike, and still have an extra module apiece.

[Krell Darkmoon]

Xenroth, on 05 March 2013 - 04:32 AM, said:

I don't like the fact you and anyone else call it pay to win ... no one of us has tested it yet so how you already can call it pay to win?

I think it's called "having played a P2Win" game before.

Easy to identify if you're not one of the few going "how is it pay to win, I don't get it".

It's a very easy Concept.

Pay for Power - Pay for Advantage - Pay for Win

The trustfund babies don't mind this move one bit, they have the cash to burn.

The whole Consumables for MC is just "Pay for Slight Advantage" but it opens up the path to "MC for Ammo" which would be Pay2Win completely.

[KuruptU4Fun]

Mackman, on 05 March 2013 - 08:31 AM, said:

HAHAHAH. Are you serious, dude? So you're seriously admitting that if someone doesn't use it, then they're at a disadvantage? Are you seriously trying to justify it by saying "It's not P2W, because everyone is just going to buy it anyway so it won't even matter"? Is that really your argument here?

Look at my example again: A Paying lance vs. a Nonpaying lance will have a huge advantage in both module power and module flexibility: All of the paying lance will be able to field Tier 3 Coolant and Airstrike, and still have an extra module apiece.

How consumable Airstrikes and Artie strikes are going to be implemented has not been shown. How can you prove your example is what is going to be used if you don't know how they are any more than I do? One example given is not proof that the other will follow the same path.

I'm not admitting anything until I've used it and seen the proof that one gives a clear advantage over the other. Currently all I know is that if I don't buy an MC coolant flush then I have to hit a button twice. Since I know how to manage heat then I'm not pushing a button twice in succession. I'll use one then save the other for later.

If a teacher says the class can use a calculator on a math test then where is there the logic in not using one? One persons IQ may be higher than someone elses. But then the person who has the higher IQ would see the same advantage in using a tool to confirm what they may already know over someone who can't do the math in their head and needs to use one to get the answer right in the first place.

Edited by KuruptU4Fun, 05 March 2013 - 08:44 AM.