80 replies to this topic

[Mechteric]

Mechwarrior 4 pretty much ruined it all for everyone, you're not supposed to violently explode every time your mech goes down. If anything it should be a rare event. Now that said there could certainly be some fun fireworks to be had from a mech going down due to ammo explosions

[Rodney28021]

Ammo Cooking and Reactor explosions should be a great light and sound show, nothing more to a battlemech. Now if there were infantry in the area, they should be toasted. Some of other mechwarrior games took the Stackpoole effect to an extreme, imho. Don't worry you will get your explosions when we alpha strike your mech and you explode. If they put in artillery pieces and fighter bombers, that will provide bigger explosions.

[Rat Bastard]

I like the idea of collateral damage when the fusion engine goes nova...

[Rejarial Galatan]

evil713, on 31 May 2012 - 10:03 PM, said:

two questions, 1 did they not say that harmony gold was not responcable for any delay or problem in making the game and 2 whas there no reseen variant drawn?

edit: there is a reseen variant http://www.sarna.net...i/Warhammer_IIC
problem, its clan, and looks like it was made either 3055 or 3085 (maybe i dunno, sarna reads like the upgraded the design when they took it with them but the tech manual reffrences are for well after the clans returned and the warhammer existed well before kerensky left to start the clans.)

i never said squat about the IIC version. I am talking the WARHAMMER the original one, the one people keep mentioning, not the clan version, but the original, the Unseen version.

[Hanged Man]

I really hope not. Destructive engine explosions are counter to the established canon and I honestly find them to be a pain.

[IIIuminaughty]

I would like to see mechs go boom because of my excellent shot I worked hard to put into the mech that i want to go boom

[Rejarial Galatan]

i honestly think there should be some sort of engine explosion. I mean come on, the reactor is a huge pressure vessel, you rupture it via coring a mech, there should be some outward manifestation of the breach when the pressure that is helping sustain the fusion reaction does what high pressure does best, moving from high pressure areas to low pressure areas. SOMETHING should be seen, aside from the mech falling down and playing dead.

[SyberSmoke]

A5mod3us, on 01 June 2012 - 04:31 AM, said:

I never understood why reactor breaches in MW were so violent myself. I'm glad you pointed this out. Modern fusion reactors (though inefficient at best) work in such a way that if they were ever breached, the worst that would happen would be a brief moment of plasma radiation and then the reaction would fail completely because in order to maintain fusion the reactor has to meet an extremely precise set of variables.

I think what happened with BT and reactor breaches is we got a few authors that didn't know squat about fusion and decided to make it up as they went along. Granted, it sounded cool when a mech popped like a piece of radioactive popcorn, taking out anything within 100 meters, but it's just not the way it would work.

In truth the type of fusion used is the main key. Your assumption is that they are using a Tokamak style reactor where plasma is sent around a ring contained by a magnetic bubble. So if the magnetic bubble is breached, the relatively thin plasma will be released and cool. But you are not accounting for pressure based fusion, often seen as our efforts to do laser fusion.

With laser fusion a pellet of fusionable material is put under extreme pressure temperatures to facilitate the binding of the fuel. Under this condition, if the containment were to fail, the implosive effect would turn into an explosion as the reaction starts to dissipate. Toss in how much fuel was being used for the reaction and you could have a very significant explosion on your hands.

[tynaiden]

It is mentioned in most if not all rulebook errata that the fusion engines are magnetic containment like Tokamaks. There are expanded rules for really rare fusion containment failures which required multiple critical slot hits and a rare roll to critically fail.

-If- they were to be added, under similar circumstances as the TT rules. Devs have stated they are trying to get Mechwarrior back to the core game and 100% core breaches are not typical to the universe.

[CyboNinja]

A mini explosion every time a mech dies would be pretty cool I think. Maybe X amount of energy damage to anything within a 50 yard radius. Also don't forget about lots of exploding buildings.

[Rejarial Galatan]

I think as the reactors containment fails as a mech is cored should cause some shrapnel to fly out and hit things. Also, I think seeing a light show as the reactor goes poof would be a nice touch.

[Hanged Man]

I really hope we don't see engine explosions. They're scientifically and canonically wrong and serve no purpose except to take the satisfaction out of a good kill if you're unfortunate enough to be standing on a dying mech.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Hanged Man, on 02 June 2012 - 07:57 PM, said:

I really hope we don't see engine explosions. They're scientifically and canonically wrong and serve no purpose except to take the satisfaction out of a good kill if you're unfortunate enough to be standing on a dying mech.

actually, they are in fact scientifically correct. Given that to have fusion, you need considerable pressure, and with high pressure comes containment vessels, with containment vessels comes the sudden and catastrophic release of pressure known as an explosion. While, physically impossible to achieve a Nova or Super Nova or even Hyper Nova be sheer small size, the fact that its going to take an obscene amount of pressure, and yea, an explosion is a given.

[Major Bill Curtis]

There will only be explosions in your ammo bay, followed by your engine.

[Remorce]

Ares convention, ares convention, ares convention. Do you guys even know what in the hell that actually is? What it did was make nuclear arms, orbital bombardments, and fights in cities illegal. You all constantly reference this as to why a mech won't explode. A mech is packed full of explosive munitions, it will likely explode, shot of it having CASE systems in every section that houses its ammunition. Since me merely saying what the Ares convention is probably not good enough for you, here is a copy pasted version from BT wiki itself. The full "document" of the signed Ares convention.

"Preamble[color=#000000]
We, the undersigned, on this 13th day of June, 2412, in accordance with our commitment to preserving human life, do solemnly pledge to prevent the loss of civilian life in war. Let this document testify to our desire to end the senseless atrocities attendant upon human conflict and our pledge to uphold the ideals contained with these Convention or suffer the harshest consequences.[/color]
[color=#000000]

Article I -- Nuclear Arms[/color]
[color=#000000]
The use of any nuclear device or variant thereof on a planetary surface or against any commercial vessel is prohibited. This prohibition extends to tactical nuclear blasts against the aforementioned targets. Controlled nuclear attacks in space against military targets are prohibited unless they occur at a minimum of 75,000 kilometers from the surface of any inhabited world in a star system.[/color]
[color=#000000]

Article II -- Orbital Bombardment[/color]
[color=#000000]
The use of orbital assets to bombard stationary targets (as defined in Appendix B, Section 4) on a planetary surface with the single exception of a valid military objective whose destruction the attacker deems necessary to ensure the survival of his own troops, is prohibited. In no case may any orbital attack take place in or near any heavily populated area, and any orbital attack is subject to ex post facto review by a duly appointed council from the signatory states.[/color]
[color=#000000]

Article III -- Surrender[/color]
[color=#000000]
To lessen the human cost of warfare, all combatants must accept the surrender of any unit that offers it. A white flag adorned with a red S will represent the universal surrender standard, so that any unit unable to communicate by conventional means may still surrender fairly. The universal surrender guidelines in Appendix E outline the provisions for the treatment of prisoners and fair compensation for the capturing forces upon the release of war prisoners to their native realms.[/color]
[color=#000000]

Article IV -- Safe Passage[/color]
[color=#000000]
The governments and military commands of the undersigned agree to recognize the aforementioned white flag as a symbol of truce. Any vessel, or vehicle, or person bearing such a truce flag shall be granted safe passage through any place, insofar as the bearer breaks no laws pertaining to that place, or initiates no hostile activity of any kind. Should the bearer of a truce flag engage in hostile activity as defined in Appendix F, the truce flag shall be deemed invalid, and any action taken against such an individual or individuals becomes the responsibility of those suffering said hostile action. Harassment of a truce flag bearer without provocation will be investigated by a duly appointed board of inquiry from the signatory states.[/color]
[color=#000000]

Article V -- Urban Warfare Restrictions[/color]
[color=#000000]
No battle shall be waged in an urban area except under extreme circumstances. If the military objective of an assault lies in a city center, attacking troops must ensure that any hostile action taken causes the least possible amount of collateral damage. No attack may be made against any civilian target, for any reason. Civilian targets shall be deemed to include such life-supporting equipment such as water and air purifiers, agricultural assets, or any other item that enables a planet's population to continue their existence.[/color]
[color=#000000]

Article VI -- Chemical and Biological Weapons[/color]
[color=#000000]
Because chemical and biological agents kill human life indiscriminately and often permanently damage the biosphere of any world suffering such as attack, the use, further development, and production of such agents is strictly prohibited."[/color]
[color=#000000]
[/color]

[color="#000000"]Clearly you can see here that the convention did not somehow (magic obviously), make explosions go away. What it did was make a sort of rules of engagement that we have today. It simply limits the types of weaponry that nations can use. [/color]

[color=#000000]Please learn what it is that you use, before you use it. Nothing bothers me more than people using false information to justify an argument. [/color][color=#000000][/color]

[Thanatos1973]

CapperDeluxe, on 01 June 2012 - 05:48 AM, said:

Mechwarrior 4 pretty much ruined it all for everyone, you're not supposed to violently explode every time your mech goes down. If anything it should be a rare event. Now that said there could certainly be some fun fireworks to be had from a mech going down due to ammo explosions

Don't forget about the opening video for MW3, the Mad Cat "going critical"

I love that video.

[Thanatos1973]

@Remorse, you do realize, they were just being facetious, right???

[Remorce]

Yes, but i have seen others on the forums here actually claiming the ares convention.

[Thanatos1973]

Don't tell me your taking them seriously. Just like in every other thread there are people who are trying to be funny. You can't take it to heart. I think we are all smart enough to understand that a piece of paper is not going to change the laws of physics, any more than Bones McCoy could.

P.S. The old lance I was in for BT TT was Loki Lance.

[Thanatos1973]

So, back on topic, explosions and stuff, and random pieces of treaties aside, anything with a damage above, oh I don't know, say 40, will explode in a flash of rainbows and butterflies, anything less, just glitter. The game needs a G rating to compete with GoGirlGames and such for fresh meat, I mean new players.(cough cough).

Edited by Gangrel, 02 June 2012 - 09:49 PM.