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What Price Would You Be Happy With


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Poll: Waaaah I'm too poor to buy them with fake money OR real money! (35 member(s) have cast votes)

CBill cost for consumables (the 110 for CF) NOW WITHOUT INTERESTING COMMENTS!

  1. 10,000 (4 votes [11.43%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 11.43%

  2. 20,000 (5 votes [14.29%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 14.29%

  3. 30,000 (3 votes [8.57%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 8.57%

  4. 40,000 (18 votes [51.43%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 51.43%

  5. 50,000+ (5 votes [14.29%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 14.29%

GXP cost for upgrading consumables NOW WITHOUT INTERESTING COMMENTS!

  1. 5,000 (4 votes [11.43%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 11.43%

  2. 10,000 (7 votes [20.00%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 20.00%

  3. 15,000 (19 votes [54.29%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 54.29%

  4. 20,000+ (5 votes [14.29%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 14.29%

MC cost for MC consumables NOW WITHOUT INTERESTING COMMENTS!

  1. 5 (4 votes [11.43%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 11.43%

  2. 10 (6 votes [17.14%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 17.14%

  3. 15 (9 votes [25.71%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 25.71%

  4. 20 (7 votes [20.00%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 20.00%

  5. 25+ (9 votes [25.71%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 25.71%

Vote

#1 p00k

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:23 PM

So in the official feedback thread there's been argument about how much things should cost, whether they're too expensive, and therefore still indirectly p2w. What do you think?

Personally I'm quite happy with the price points. First, the cbill cost itself. 40k, in the absence of repair and rearm, is to me a noticeable but not crippling sum. In an average victory, I'm usually making 120-150k, with good rounds ~180k, great rounds breaking 200k. Note, this is without premium or founders/hero bonus. Prior to savior bonus I'd knock off ~20-30k from each of those. This is also roughly what premium bonus will net you, and roughly what a non-boating medium/heavy might pay in R&R back when R&R was in effect.

Now, the GXP cost. 15K puts it at essentially the top tier among existing modules, typically modules that are game changers. Again, i'm quite happy with this point. Other 15k module unlocks are 360 target retention and capture assist, though to me the 360 retention isn't worth that much. But to make your consumables on par with MC ones I think can be just as game-changing as cap assist, and the 15k seems fairly reasonable. And again, remember, modules are supposed to be end-game content. For those grinding it out, 15k GXP will require you to earn 300k regular XP, which for non-premium players should be ~300-500 drops (my current average is 875xp per drop, and I haven't activated any premium time since we got the button, was ~1300 prior to the button)

Finally, MC cost. As someone who hesitates to spend MC on anything that can be otherwise purchased with CB, admittedly this seems ok, but hard for me to say. At the worst MC pricing tier, this works out to 8.3cents per use. At the best tier, 6cents. Pretty cheap to me. As this is for people who don't have time to grind, let's assume those people drop 5x per night. At the worst tier, this works out to ~$12/month to buy and use it every single drop. Not too bad honestly, but again I grind for most of this stuff.

So what do people think? Where would you like to see things priced?

EDIT: waaaaah! i have no sense of humor! fine just the numbers then

Edited by p00k, 07 March 2013 - 01:12 AM.


#2 Monky

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:41 PM

I think the pricing structure is adequate - we would need to test it to see any real positives or negatives at this point.

#3 Tennex

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:44 PM

whats the point of removing R&R when they pretty much put it back in as consumable modules.

its just going to be another half assed. barely thought out thing thats going to lose them more revenue and players than gained. Like with camo spec business model. do yourself a favor do it right, think it through the first time. maybe you can actually get some bang for the buck out of the hours in your life.

Edited by Tennex, 06 March 2013 - 10:48 PM.


#4 OneEyed Jack

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:44 PM

I think it's fine.

In addition to the point you made about the MC/Cb costs, which I agree with, I'd say that the modules they are detailed thus far are not so game-changing as to require that they are actually popped on a regular basis. Arty/Airstrikes are relatively low damage even when they do hit, and won't really be good for anything besides driving people out of stationary positions. The coolant module is so weakened that it's doubtful it will even be useful. Skipping firing quad ML for a single cycle length will have more effect than the "good" module.

As to the GXP cost, if you really think they're so important that you HAVE to have the improved versions, then sacrifice for it. If you're not willing to make any sacrifice at all, you must not care all that much. If you like the game enough that you want to play it all the time but are too impatient to grind out the GXP, then maybe you should consider a small show of actual support for the company that had provided all those free hours of play. A rather small investment will let you convert a bunch of useless XP into GXP and help keep the game going. If you're too cheap/lazy/selfish to acquire it by any of the means provided, I got no sympathy.


View PostTennex, on 06 March 2013 - 10:44 PM, said:

whats the point of removing R&R when they pretty much put it back in as consumable modules.

Consumables aren't mandatory every fight.

Edited by OneEyed Jack, 06 March 2013 - 10:45 PM.


#5 matux

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:47 PM

View PostTennex, on 06 March 2013 - 10:44 PM, said:

whats the point of removing R&R when they pretty much put it back in as consumable modules.


Because they can charge MC for this and validate it by saying your getting something, where as R&R was just money disappearing for you being able to use a mech again.

#6 Tennex

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:50 PM

View Postmatux, on 06 March 2013 - 10:47 PM, said:


Because they can charge MC for this and validate it by saying your getting something, where as R&R was just money disappearing for you being able to use a mech again.


so they're allowed to reimplement what they deemed to be a bad mechanic as long as money is involved.

#7 matux

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:54 PM

View PostTennex, on 06 March 2013 - 10:50 PM, said:


so they're allowed to reimplement what they deemed to be a bad mechanic as long as money is involved.


Well you dont have to pay for it... so its not the exact same as R&R... but if everyone has to use it to stay competitive... then its exactly the same, but they said its here to stay as they may make money out of it.

Justification for you, i hate the idea of everyone one getting air strikes when this is a team game, which groups are based on military style organisation.... but hey why not turn MWO in to COD.

Edited by matux, 06 March 2013 - 10:57 PM.


#8 GalaxyBluestar

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 11:00 PM

i'd love to vote on this but i can't.

this is all figures on paper stuff we need to wait for implementaion and test this all in the field before we can judge whether it works and is or isn't balanced properly. we don't even know just how effective in battle these consumables are let alone whether the cost balances out it's amount of times used in matches is a far quota or not and all the rest of it.

#9 ragingmunkyz

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 11:00 PM

Well...would you look at that. Way to provide people with fair and balanced options that in no way insert your own opinions on the matter. I think you may have a future designing poll questions for political campaigns. Biased poll is biased. 2/10, did not vote.

Edit: The sad thing is I actually agree with you on 2 out of the 3 questions, and I'm pretty close on the 3rd...when you have a valid opinion, you shouldn't need to use underhanded ploys to manipulate things in your favor.

Edited by ragingmunkyz, 06 March 2013 - 11:04 PM.


#10 p00k

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 11:04 PM

View PostTennex, on 06 March 2013 - 10:50 PM, said:


so they're allowed to reimplement what they deemed to be a bad mechanic as long as money is involved.

R&R had a few flaws, but those aren't applicable to consumables quite honestly

R&R was essentially mandatory, consumables you can choose to not use even if you buy it

R&R vastly favored certain mechs, and largely crippled builds with (1) FF armor, (2) XL engines, (3) LRM boats, and more subtly made ammo-independent mechs more attractive. again, not true with consumables

R&R could be abused by avoiding rearm and using the free 75% ammo, and simply not repairing certain parts. again, not applicable to consumables

#11 Windies

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 11:13 PM

The problem is two-fold in that they have to have an incentive for you to buy the MC consumables, so they price the c-bill versions high so they can't be used all the time. On the flip side you can't price the c-bill versions so low as to make the MC versions worthless. It does give a battlefield advantage because if you want you can keep buying them, whereas someone who doesn't want to or can't, won't ever have that same advantage as you. That's what I don't like, I didn't like the whole gold rounds and consumable crap in World of Tanks and now I am seeing it being implemented here.

The problem lies in having a battlefield advantage being bought with MC, even if there is a c-bill counterpart. Hero Mech's were the initiation so to speak, now we have consumables. It's something that no one should like, even if you want PGI to make money, you shouldn't like your gameplay being dictated by wallets.

#12 Noobzorz

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 11:14 PM

Consumables look about right. They've got to be expensive enough to inconvenience you but not so expensive you couldn't buy them somewhat frequently. In terms of MC cost, they should be cheap enough that you can use tons of them but not ad infinitum. My preference would be not to have them, but I'm all right with the state they're in. They can fine tune to avoid P2W, but at present I could field 50,000 CBills of consumables every match and still have a fair bit left over to throw on the savings pile. The critical thing here is that we don't have explicit P2W. Still not thrilled about the hero mechs being so expensive, but presumably a little market research will demonstrate that there is lots of appetite for them at sensible price points.

I do wish you'd worded your poll answers differently, though. Simple neutral questions would be a lot more appropriate for something like this, instead of implying that people who can't afford them are whiners, or people who would shell out more their mom's credit card.

Edited by Noobzorz, 06 March 2013 - 11:17 PM.


#13 Nayru

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 11:34 PM

View PostGalaxyBluestar, on 06 March 2013 - 11:00 PM, said:

i'd love to vote on this but i can't.

this is all figures on paper stuff we need to ETC ETC GRAMMAR ETC


I'd love to vote on this but I can't.

I have a policy of not voting on smart-*** polls.

#14 Brilig

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 11:53 PM

First off IMHO consumables in this game are a bad idea. The gameplay/economy do not support it well. I will grant we don't know how effective each consumable will be or how necessary they will be to use every game. But again IMHO from the detailed descriptions they have given to us about consumables they will grant a big advantage to those who use them, and will come in handy quite often.

I don't think there is a Cbill cost per consumable module that will encourage people to buy them for MC, but not make it a grind to earn enough Cbills to keep up with module usage and buy the weapon and mech content you want.

I would much rather see more content worth purchasing than be forced into choosing between paying MC to just play the game on an equal footing, or a painful Cbill grind to play the game on an equal footing.

Hell I would be totally fine with seeing some Coca Cola adds on the little billboards in river city that someone suggested in a feedback thread. That alone could generate some decent constant cash for PGI.

#15 Metafox

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 12:40 AM

I'm kind of surprised that 67% of the voters are fine with paying 120k Cbills per match for a full set of consumables. It wouldn't be so bad if it were 40k total per match, but 120k just isn't feasible.

#16 Znail

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 12:57 AM

The main thing to remember is that you wont use this every single game. Even if you use it every single time it could be an advantage so would I guess at maybe 1 in 3 games at most, maybe slightly more for realy hot builds. It's also worth remembering that for quite a few mechs so wont you even have room for it as you may want some other modules instead.

#17 Aym

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 01:06 AM

View PostTennex, on 06 March 2013 - 10:50 PM, said:


so they're allowed to reimplement what they deemed to be a bad mechanic as long as money is involved.

It's wildly different from RnR. If you didn't repair you were at a distinct disadvantage. If you use a non-consumable module you may just be different from a consumable one. I like the current prices/system. I hated the previous one.

#18 p00k

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 01:11 AM

View PostMetafox, on 07 March 2013 - 12:40 AM, said:

I'm kind of surprised that 67% of the voters are fine with paying 120k Cbills per match for a full set of consumables. It wouldn't be so bad if it were 40k total per match, but 120k just isn't feasible.


you don't have to use your CF and arty and airstrike every single match. just like not everyone takes their 3L raven or A1 cat or 3D phract or DDC atlas every single match, despite there being advantages to doing so

#19 vrok

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 01:27 AM

A non-paying non-premium player cannot afford 130k CB every game to replace all 4 consumables when running a 4 module mech. A paying player can. This is still 100% P2W. The CB prices need to be cheaper. You need to be able to replace all 4 consumables even with the absolute minimum CB reward from a single game or this is still P2W. "You might not need to use them all every match" is not an argument, it's a dumb excuse just to justify P2W. Exactly like 1 extra module slot for MC wasn't "such a big deal".

Not to mention that adding this is like if R&R cost your entire income and then a 45k GXP grind on top, it's a bit extreme. It's like you're actively trying to scare new players away. What kind of business model is that?

Edited by vrok, 07 March 2013 - 01:31 AM.


#20 armyof1

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 01:33 AM

View Postp00k, on 07 March 2013 - 01:11 AM, said:


you don't have to use your CF and arty and airstrike every single match. just like not everyone takes their 3L raven or A1 cat or 3D phract or DDC atlas every single match, despite there being advantages to doing so


I'm sorry but that is almost like saying you don't need to shoot your lasers every match. If there's a chance to do damage of course you'd want to do it. But the problem is the incredibly high price of 40K CBIlls a pop means you're pretty much destined to use MC to do what just about everyone else will as soon as these consumables will be in effect, otherwise you run a risk of actually losing CBills for playing the match in the first place. And when you can't afford to buy MC? Well I guess it's time to leave this game since it is still P2W.

Edited by armyof1, 07 March 2013 - 01:34 AM.






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