55 replies to this topic

[Lykaon]

xhrit, on 08 March 2013 - 01:11 AM, said:

Streaks don't automatically hit in MWO anyway. Go look at your weapon stats.

Weapon STREAK SRM 2
Fired :210
Hit:148
Accuracy:70.48%

Under what testing method?

I have yet to see a single streak missile miss in the testing grounds.

[sj mausgmr]

Considering the size of the munition in comparison to other weapons, they generate far too much screen shake for the damage they do. And yes i agree with other points in this thread, streaks are too good.

[Sug]

Khobai, on 08 March 2013 - 01:08 AM, said:

Streaks should not have a smaller warhead. Streaks do the same damage as SRMs. The problem is that Streaks automatically hit when they shouldn't.

Make a new account, buy a mech with 2 missile points, equip a SSRM2 and an SRM2, play for a week and show me that they do the same damage.

Khobai, on 08 March 2013 - 01:08 AM, said:

simple 2-step solution:
1) change streaks so they have a chance to miss
2) change guardian ecm so it no longer affects streaks at all

1) Yeah they tried that already. It went from always hitting CT (OP), to random spread + chance to miss (sucked), to now always hitting + "random" location (torso)

2) Title of the thread is Streak SRMs Are Doing Too Much Damage. How would nerfing ECM help deal with SSRM damage?

Edited by Sug, 08 March 2013 - 10:21 AM.

[Uzi Foo]

Leon Shirow, on 08 March 2013 - 12:11 AM, said:

If you take a SRM-6 and stand 40m behind the Atlas two salvo's will strip all the rear armour and turn the internals yellow, that is at least 68 points of damage, over 5.6 damage per missile.

No, that is 30 damage since an atlas has about 20 rear armor, not 68. So, it's 2.5 damage per missile. Try to apply some common logic to your testing next time.

Edited by Uzi Foo, 08 March 2013 - 10:36 AM.

[FupDup]

The damage itself is fine. The only issue is that they are able to accurately deal that damage too often.

Streaks should not always hit the CT. They should hit wherever you're aiming when you click your mouse. If you're aiming at an enemy's arm or leg and fire, you shouldn't instantly hit their CT.

Edited by FupDup, 08 March 2013 - 10:44 AM.

[Gandalfrockman]

I think streaks are pretty much fine now, sounds like thye might want to reign in the splash radius a bit is all.
Right now its super effective against Light mechs because more of their parts fit inside the splash radius, meaning each missile is hitting more than once. If they pull the splash in to something like 1.5 or maybe even 1 meter, so you only register one collision per missile the issue will go away.

Edited by Gandalfrockman, 08 March 2013 - 10:45 AM.

[Mister Haha]

SRMs also don't hit their target 100% of the time with 100% of the ammo.

[Stoicblitzer]

I don't think SSRMs by themselves are that great otherwise we would still be seeing strkcats. It's the combination of SSRMs and ECM.

[AnarchyBurger]

Lykaon, on 08 March 2013 - 01:40 AM, said:

Under what testing method?

I have yet to see a single streak missile miss in the testing grounds.

Sarcasm?

[Joseph Mallan]

Stoicblitzer, on 08 March 2013 - 10:53 AM, said:

I don't think SSRMs by themselves are that great otherwise we would still be seeing strkcats. It's the combination of SSRMs and ECM.

SSRMs with ECM and I am at 70% hit rate...
...
...
Maybe the OP factor in the equation is actually the warrior not the equipment?

[Sug]

FupDup, on 08 March 2013 - 10:43 AM, said:

The damage itself is fine. The only issue is that they are able to accurately deal that damage too often.

So they hit too accurately and often. And they do damage when they hit.

And they do damage when they hit.

They do damage.

Damage.

Joseph Mallan, on 08 March 2013 - 11:10 AM, said:

SSRMs with ECM and I am at 70% hit rate...
...
...
Maybe the OP factor in the equation is actually the warrior not the equipment?

Sorry, what do you mean?

Are you saying you use a mech with SSRMs and ECM? Or you use SSRMs despite ECM being in the game?

Are you considering 70% high or low?

Stoicblitzer, on 08 March 2013 - 10:53 AM, said:

I don't think SSRMs by themselves are that great otherwise we would still be seeing strkcats. It's the combination of SSRMs and ECM.

They're still pretty great. If ECM wasn't in the game you'd see streakcats. They just got tired of getting completely locked down by a 1.5ton piece of equipment so they switched to SRM6s.

I'm always astounded by the damage I do with streaks when no one is jamming me.

[Stoicblitzer]

Sug, on 08 March 2013 - 11:21 AM, said:

Sorry, what do you mean?

Are you saying you use a mech with SSRMs and ECM? Or you use SSRMs despite ECM being in the game?

Are you considering 70% high or low?



They're still pretty great. If ECM wasn't in the game you'd see streakcats. They just got tired of getting completely locked down by a 1.5ton piece of equipment so they switched to SRM6s.

I'm always astounded by the damage I do with streaks when no one is jamming me.

ya I had no idea what he meant so I decided to ignore him. Is it possible that ECM was designed as an overreaction to strkcats? I remember the devs kinda smirking at strkcats when ECM first came out.

[Remorse]

What if...

..you stop trusting the ssrm2 hit percentage stat?

[Joseph Mallan]

Sug, on 08 March 2013 - 11:21 AM, said:

Sorry, what do you mean?

Are you saying you use a mech with SSRMs and ECM? Or you use SSRMs despite ECM being in the game?

Are you considering 70% high or low?

I use the 3L With ECM & SSRMs I have a paltry 70% Hit ratio with a weapon that is supposed to hit with all missiles, every time it launches. I am not complaining just pointing out the Streaks do miss, and miss often. I am fine with how these missiles are working.

[FupDup]

Sug, on 08 March 2013 - 11:21 AM, said:

So they hit too accurately and often. And they do damage when they hit.

And they do damage when they hit.

They do damage.

Damage.

Alright, maybe my wording was a little dumb now that I confer with Captain Hindsight.


Anyways, are you saying that you would like some Streak adjustments of whatever form or are you saying that you're fine with them? (I'm guessing the former).

EDIT: Just looked at previous posts in the thread, found my answer. I'll change my wording to: "The damage per missile for Streaks would be fine if they didn't effortlessly hit the CT on every shot. They should require slightly more difficulty to aim, such as having to hover over the body part you want to hit instead of just automatically hitting the CT no matter where your crosshair is."

Edited by FupDup, 08 March 2013 - 11:58 AM.

[Taemien]

Khobai, on 08 March 2013 - 01:08 AM, said:

Streaks should not have a smaller warhead. Streaks do the same damage as SRMs. The problem is that Streaks automatically hit when they shouldn't. Streaks don't automatically hit in tabletop, they still have to roll to hit. They just don't have to roll on the cluster table if they hit. And if they miss they don't generate heat or expend ammo.

simple 2-step solution:
1) change streaks so they have a chance to miss
2) change guardian ecm so it no longer affects streaks at all

Fixt.

If you're going to quote the TT in an argument, then do it right. You never roll to hit with Streaks, ever. You roll to see if you obtain a lock. If you don't lock, you don't fire, you don't generate heat, and you don't expend ammunition.

[Vermaxx]

Khobai, on 08 March 2013 - 01:08 AM, said:

Streaks should not have a smaller warhead. Streaks do the same damage as SRMs. The problem is that Streaks automatically hit when they shouldn't. Streaks don't automatically hit in tabletop, they still have to roll to hit. They just don't have to roll on the cluster table if they hit. And if they miss they don't generate heat or expend ammo.

simple 2-step solution:
1) change streaks so they have a chance to miss
2) change guardian ecm so it no longer affects streaks at all

Fixt.

No, streaks ALWAYS HIT. They DO NOT FIRE if they cannot hit. Your solution is blatantly wrong.

Raise the lock on time, but nothing above the weapon cooldown. Require a lock on every fire. Make it easier to lose lock.

Are any of these necessary? No. Streaks are fine, as long as their game-value damage is equal to SRM damage. The problem is that ECM means YOUR streaks cannot fire back, and hitting light mechs with dumbfire SRM packs takes real skill.

Once we can trip people, SRM6 is going to be a lot more popular.

[MaddMaxx]

sj mausgmr, on 08 March 2013 - 02:54 AM, said:

Considering the size of the munition in comparison to other weapons, they generate far too much screen shake for the damage they do. And yes i agree with other points in this thread, streaks are too good.

Interesting observation. The SRM and SSRM have the same Damage and Impulse. It would seem logical that the (possible) set of 6 would impulse a Mech more than a maximum pair. ?

Quote

impulse="0.192"

Quote

damage="2.5"

What are we missing here? Likely it is not #' of projectiles hitting that affect Impulse value, but simply the mere fact that you got hit at all?

Edited by MaddMaxx, 08 March 2013 - 11:59 AM.

[Helbourne]

Did they put in damage meters in that everyone could access? Wouldn't the devs at PGI know exactly how much damage streak missles are doing? I would ask them. I would not speculate on how much damage they are doing, Are the stats on the stat page updated that quickly and accurately?

Besides the point to streaks is, that they fire and hit their target. They should randomly hit any part of the target mech. One a time. LRMs should (by TT rules) hit mechs in 5 point (5 missle clusters)

And it is a to hit roll in the TT game. You could call it a 'lock on' roll if you wanted to, it really does not matter. You make a gunnery skill check roll to see if the Streak missles hit, if you fail that roll they do not fire. Its not difficult at all.

The big point to streak missles is that you are supposed to be able to carry less missle rounds. They cost more, but you carry less missles because your not wasting them by missing your target. However, it does not mean anything in this game because we do not pay for ammo or repairs for that matter.

[MaddMaxx]

Quote

I'm always astounded by the damage I do with streaks when no one is jamming me.

Really? You do 5 damage per Launcher when both missiles hit every time. 2 x 2.5 = 5 damage.

You must be totally flabbergasted then when someone else pulls the trigger on 1 Medium lasers and holds it on target for 1 second. They also do 1 x 5 = 5 damage every hit as well.

It is all relative to numbers of launchers or Lasers or Ballistic weapons on board. We know the values as we have access to them.

As for the 70% on a never miss weapon? That other 30% is likely made up of 95% of FF due to friends intercepting your well placed shots.

Edited by MaddMaxx, 08 March 2013 - 12:09 PM.