32 replies to this topic

[Glythe]

This is beyond ridiculous.

Every game you see 2+ Poptarts (CTF 2x ERPPC+ Gauss). Add a few LRM boats a Raven or two and at least one DDC. That's pretty much how every game goes. And while all these things can be countered.... they are best countered by playing exactly the same thing. If you aren't running the new cheese build then you are far more likely to lose.

The complete lack of mech diversity and build diversity wasn't really noticable until we had Elo mis-matching. And then every game you see the same thing. It's not fun. There's no point in having a garage full of mechs if you only ever need to play 4-5 builds.

There are really only two viable lights (because they have ECM) and one is 10x better than the other. The Jenner was once fantastic but ECM and the frontal hitbox changes make it so much weaker. A poor 2D pilot will beat a very good Jenner pilot and there's something wrong with that.

The PPC is TOO good right now and that's why you see it on about 50% if not more of mechs. Without exception Alpha damage is king. The increased travel velocity and reduced heat make it viable to fire 2 nearly nonstop on a medium mech. That is problematic to say the least.

If you want a math comparison look at the PPC and the AC/2. With one ton of ammunition these two weapons are the same weight. On paper the AC/2 does more damage but it's complete fantasy to think you'll get anywhere near that. A weapon that fires once for more damage is better in every way than a weapon that fires quickly for less damage because you can take cover after you fire (and if you poptart you rarely leave cover anyway).

There's no way you are going to get the 4 dps listing for the AC/2 unless the target shuts down. As such it is far more realistic to compare the AC/10 to the PPC. The ballistic weapon takes up 7 slots and 12 tons while the energy takes up 3 spaces and 7 tons (remember that more space= less heat sinks and easier to destroy). You're also going to need at least two tons of ammunition if not a third (remember this game is planned for 12 on 12). Meanwhile you can just use spare weight for more heatsinks with the PPC. Note the differences in projectile speed in that the PPC is almost 50% faster. Range favors the AC/10 except that due to the faster projectile it is not as good at hitting anywhere near as far; the PPC also has the added bonus of doing half damage within its blind spot (which should be zero). There's one more benefit of the PPC in that it is far easier to boat than a large caliber ballistic weapon. Granted the PPC runs hot but it's far too manageable right now. Overall the PPC feels like a superweapon and that is why you see it everywhere.

Ballistic weapons either need a big boost or the PPC needs a nerf. I doubt either is going to happen unfortunately. Personally I'd like to see the PPC with the same travel velocity as the AC/20. The game lore lists the travel speed of the PPC with the ballistic weapons. The Gauss rifle should also be the ballistic weapon with 2000 m/s speed NOT the AC/2 (1300-1600 would be about right for that little guy).

If you could build a mech from scratch think about what you would rather have in the arms. You're crazy if you would rather have 2 AC/10s over PPCs because the energy weapon is just better.

There isn't one big problem. All the things that could be better balanced came together and made this game nearly unplayable. Ok I guess really there are two problems.... Elo+PPC.

[Khobai]

I don't think PPCs are too good. PPCs feel like they're right where they should be. The problem is that the ballistic alternatives to PPCs are terrible. Autocannons just arn't worth the insane tonnage and crit space they take up.

As for seeing the same builds over and over, you'll have to get used to it, because that's going to happen as long as we don't have a proper battle value system.

[Lyrik]

I see a lot of different loadouts.

My Elo must be too low But I'm also using a Jenner and my favorite mech is a Hunch SP (ok, most of them have the same loadout) an K2 with 2LPL and 2 LL.


But Balancing is a hard thing. And if you want true balance the devs have to look at the top players. That's were you find the cheese which needs to be adressed ... even if your low skill players will be jerking about nerving their OP toys xD

[Karl Streiger]

It is personal taste, but i wouldn't grief much when the PPC got its heat burden back. I used PPCs since closed beta...they were very difficult to use - slow velocity, could hit multiple zones, really hot. All you got was a fast firing weapon with really good range.

Edited by Karl Streiger, 08 March 2013 - 12:55 AM.

[Dataman]

Well we have no solid gameplay for any variation... Bear with it. Hopely, when CW comes, it will changes things.

[Booran]

There's a lot more diversity now than it was this last summer..

[Protection]

Booran, on 08 March 2013 - 01:11 AM, said:

There's a lot more diversity now than it was this last summer..

Gausscats with no lasers
Gausscats with small lasers
Gausscats with medium lasers

There was lots of diversity.

Ironically, Gausscats have now been rendered nearly extinct, unable to match the sniping power of 3Ds.

[Lucky Noob]

i realy prefer my 2 AC 10 on my Cata over 2 PPC.

I simply can shoot constant, never have to watch my Heat so i am realy outgun any PPC by raw Damage output over short Time-

Also i have an reload of 2.5 sec. instead of 3.0 sec.

[Kahoumono]

Sorry, I am probably adding to your misery with my splat cat. I need to level up on it and without tag or lasers it doesn't make sense to put anything on it other than srms.

[Tompaboy]

Had a drop last night where there were 6 cats and 4 of them were K2's
Mine being one of them.

There's diversity for you.

[Redshift2k5]

Just wait until the 19th, then it'll be 6-10 Jagermechs per match.

Keep your head down.

[Budor]

I just bought a 5N to bring the drama.

[Broceratops]

Protection, on 08 March 2013 - 01:29 AM, said:

Gausscats with no lasers
Gausscats with small lasers
Gausscats with medium lasers

There was lots of diversity.

Ironically, Gausscats have now been rendered nearly extinct, unable to match the sniping power of 3Ds.

ML GAUSSCAT BEST GAUSSCAT

[Harmin]

I think it is a mistake comparing the three different types of weapon systems like for like. Balistics, missiles and energy weapons are rightfully subject to different strengths and weaknesses. I personally prefer lasers to PPCs actually.

[Congzilla]

So OP, what you are saying is that you just aren't very good at the game.

[grayson marik]

You are tired of random PUG madness?
Can't see a single slice of "Cheese" anymore?
Cheese even lost it's taste for you in real live?
Tired of minmaxers telling you you are just bad, because you deny to run the latest flavor of the week?

Maybe you should look here, to meet up with people, get away from the random second level experience and enjoy some fair games...

http://spherewars.sp.ohost.de

[ciller]

You forgot centurions! ALL THE OP CENTURIONS!! What will we ever do!??!

If this is a complaint thread am I allowed to complain about too many easy mode LRMs in matches these days? OMG its forcing me to use cover, how 2012 is that!?

My next question is why are people using gauscats? AC20 cats are still far superior (unless you like speed and vulnerability, then wait for the jagerbomb err mech)

[Private Backside]

play Jenners. or join some group. or quit MWO.
preferably play Jenners.
them awesome.

[Belorion]

Stopped reading at QQ.

[Silentium]

I'm good with PPCs, I think they are.viable now, and that is why you see them more often. You are right though, there is almost always a ddc, and a 3L, and an lrm boat or two. I don't really care anymore, it just doesn't matter. The pilot skill in all of these mechs does vary, and I have seen good and bad in both. Frankly, better pilots than me kick my *** all the time, and bad ones are just target practice.

Cherish those rare moments when you are fighting against a well matched opponent, or take a break for a while. Well, you could also run troll builds for kicks, that can break up the monotony too.